Did anyone actually watch the Qana videotape?

[underpants]

Forgive me if this has been discussed before. I have been watching that videotape all weekend pausing and rewinding it (on TiVo) and freeze framing it.

There is no building at all in the video. That is a farm field-an orchard or a vineyard most likely. There are no buildings near the launch site. The video makes that very clear.

Has no one commented on this? Are the talk overs really so effective that they can just tell you what you are looking at?

Here is the video again-several versions available on YouTube this is called "QANA the facts!" and supports the IDF claim of rockets being fired not only out of Qana but from "civilian areas"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0jhx2ZT0gTA
Notice that the wide shot at the beginning shows that the now famous crossroads aren't IN Qana although they are near.

The close up is what totally amazed me the whole weekend. There isn't even a building at that intersection of dirt roads. You can see what are buildings in the shot but there isn't anything AT THAT SPOT!!!

The video shows what appears to be a flatbed truck driving past the missile firing spot and then (we are told) the same truck pulling into a building, a building that is set apart and away from everything else in the area. Two other trucks are shown and we are told that they are further proof but there is nothing on this video to back up that claim.

This video appears to be from the same source and is entitled " Hezbollah In Qana Neighborhood" (1:46)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTLdX9i_vI4
That doesn't show a damned thing. All I see is a building on a hill and missiles flying over the building having been fired from down the hill. Not anywhere close to the building really.

But this is the one that really amazes me
This one is entitled "Hezbollah fire rockets from behind 3 story civilian building"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LqeIg674sM8
The first example offered (the :23 mark) has nothing of significance around it.

Further more the two DIRECT HITS that are shown (:48 - 1:09 and 1:22-1:45) are not "behind 3 story building", especially the first on, and demonstrate that they are able to have very precise firing.

Are these videos just being taken as fact? Are we really at that level of psy-ops now?

[Poll_Blind]

1. It's not so much psy-ops as flat-out bald-faced lying. n/t

PB

[Dhalgren]

2. Someone else posted an article this morning that said the IDF

now admit that no missiles were fired from the building or its vicinity at any time close to the bombing. So those videos of missile launching were just supplied to make it look like the bombings in Qana were legit.

Cue the Israel defenders....

[underpants]

5. Well I didn't need anyone to tell me that

technology in the hands of the masses is a real bummer for the liars.

The first time I saw the excuse video I let out a "Hold it WHAT!?!" towards the TV screen and then backed it up and watched it in slomo and frame by frame. The oddest part was flipping back later and seeing a different failed actor read the same exact story as the previous failed actor.

I guess the retractions are printed on the back page. They just created a story for this and hoped it would sink in with everyone on first glimpse.

[DistressedAmerican]

3. IT IS NOT THE QANA VIDEO AT ALL!

Different sites, differnt times. A lie put out and absorbed without question. If you watch closely even the networks say is is not the video. But, look how fast is was labeled as such.

[malaise]

7. Not absorbed by me

I questioned IDF spin on the original thread.

[leftchick]

8. they have taken a page out of the US DoD propaganda

they have learned well from rummy's BS in Iraq.

[Cary]

4. So what's Israel's answer?

You can't possibly say that they should just accept rocket attacks on their civilians, and a stateless entity like Hezbollah.

I don't like war either. I am as opposed to neocons as anyone. But I don't see that Israel has any good choices here.

[DistressedAmerican]

6. How about not bombing innocents then lying about it to cover your crime?.

There was no rocket launcher in Qana.

Are you arguing that this action in ANYWAY helped defeat Hezbollah when they were not even in the area?

If so, you believe a lie.

The video was not Qana. The IAF admits there was no launcher in the area. This attack lends NOTHING to efforts to stop rocket attacks and your bringing it up justifies nothing that took place. Not the crime and not the cover-up of the crime.

[underpants]

10. I didn't know that they had already fessed up to this lie

but it has probably done what they wanted it too-it got that version of the story out there and that is all that most people will remember.

[DistressedAmerican]

22. Very Quietly Of Course.

Scream the lie and whisper the retraction and people will keep believing the lie.

I'd bet that 90% of Americans believe that Israel was shootijng at a rocket launcher. A total lie. Anyone that thinks that the lie was not deliberate are fucking morons.

You sure do not see CNN or anyone else correcting the story. More fucking lies. Screw them.

[Cary]

12. I don't think it's as exact a science as you imply.

I think Hezbollah has indeed woven itself into the civilian fabric of Southern Lebanon. I think the Israelis have made every effort to avoid killing "civilians".

War sucks.

Here's an idea. Why don't Hezbollah and Hamas stop warring and start attending to business?

[acmavm]

14. Here's another. Why doesn't Israel quit stealing ALL of the

arable land and water resources and come to the negotiating table with a view to being honest for once?

[DistressedAmerican]

23. Here's a better idea. How about Israel Stop Comitting War Crimes.

Fcuking "A"!

How about the offer a just peace for a fucking change? How about theyu get back in their borders? Accept the right of return? Act like they want to be anything but opressors of the Palestinians.

That would make them a hell of lot more safe than dropping bombe on women and children then lying to cover their war crimes.

People that justify war criminals and their actions have lost their souls.

[underpants]

9. I posted something like that a few weeks ago

I can't find it now but basically I said that Israel does have the right to protect itself--that that is the WHAT it is the HOW that is troubling. I also stated that clearly Israel has decided to try to completely do away with Hezbollah once and for all right now. I don't know if that is really possible but they sure seem like that that is their goal.

What is upsetting about this is that there seemed not only to be no need for it but it was sloppily executed and a full speed cover up has taken place.

THAT is what troubles me about this.

[Cary]

13. I can accept that it is troubling. (n/t)

[RaleighNCDUer]

15. If that's their goal, they have a long way to go.

It's estimated that there are 10,000 Hezbollah fighters. Israel claims to have killed 300. That leaves 9,700 to go, not counting the new recruits they are creating by the displacing of half a million Lebanese.

I have no doubt, they have created more terrorists than they have killed. Just as we are doing in Iraq.

[underpants]

16. Yeah if your plan includes killing everyone who disagrees with you

you have entered into a fool's purchase.

[Flavin]

17. Self defense

Lets play devil's advocate here for a brief momment.

Say our country, under continues military presure from a superior military power for approx 20+ years (at the least) can do nothing to stop the repeated military incursions, military represions and what's the term... yes, collective punishment.

Do the citizens of a country then have the right to gather in their own defence when their govt has proven incapable of doing so itself?

If Jordan was the US, would you not as a citizen gather with those who can defend you or gather with others to defend your own country?

It's obvious to me that this is the choice, and maybe the only choice, that Hezbolah backing citizens of Jordan have taken. It doesn't matter WHO is giving Hezbolah the weaponry to defend the populace, only that it is.

Hell, Hezbolah was practically handed this job by the Isrelies, who have systematically demolished and destabilized jordan,s govt and infrastructure.

One could respond that the actions of Hezbolah have endagered it's citizens.

But remember this is a classic case of asemetrical warfare.
You rarely can destroy an armoured column, but you can garuntee that the world sees every broken child, wrecked home, and burning village caused by those tanks in their own living rooms at 6 and 10 oclock. It eventually negates the tatical effectivness of the enemy.

Most Americans are incapable of understanding the push/pull of asemetrical warfare, as we have been in the position of being the stronger military power for the majority of our contry's existance (the Revolution, and the War of 1812 aside). Hell, a study of the Revolution and pre-Revolutionary tatics show that our founding fathers embraced the weaponry of the underdog in an asymetical war with gusto. Records reflect that at least a 2 years proir to any open conflict with the ruling government, the American Revolutionaries dispatched groups of militia to areas of strong pro-government sympathy (New Amsterdam (New York)was one). These units burnt the homes of sympathisers, comitted acts of assault, and generally acted as terrorists. There is very little diffence between launching a Katusha and throwing a firebrand through a barn door or onto a porch.

It's darkly cynical but to some extent the population is a chess piece in this conflict. unfortunatly.
As another poster put it: "War sucks".
It sucks harder when there is a merkava shooting down your street manned by individuals who culturally think your a lesser being then themselves, who culturally see any challange to their ways as a first step the the concentration camps, and you've little or nothing to defend your home with.

So to me the conflict boils down to two points.

1) The Jordanians siding with Hezbolah feel they must to defend
their Interest and country

2) The IDF is defending itself based on the belief that a failure to
flatten every single threat is the first step towards cultural
anahilation.

Flavin,
Whose prepared for the Anti-Semite firebombing to start for daring to disaprove of the Israeli actions.
Sigh

[RaleighNCDUer]

20. You mean, of course, Lebanese, not Jordanians.

Jordan's kept out of this, so far.

Other than that, well put.

[Flavin]

21. oops my bad.

please self edit when reading my post lebanon for every single reference to jordan (which has issues of it's own).

Thanks for pointing it out.

Flavin
Practicing 'Stream of unconcousness'

[dipsydoodle]

11. Proof of the lie,

as has happened this time, reduces any possiblity of an occasional truth being believed in the future. Israel appears to have shot itself in the foot.

[LostinVA]

18. It is not THE real videotape n/t

[Emit]

19. I didn't watch the tapes you posted

(can't right now) but I want to say that initially, when these tapes were aired on CNN, one of the talking head gals made sure to note that this was not an actual tape but one "like" it -- that was early on. Then, yesterday, Paula Zhan showed the same tape while interviewing an official from Lebanon -- she stated that it was the footage from Qana. (The Lebanese official said that the tape should be verified and Paula just skipped right over.)

Last night, and I forget which channel or which person was being interviewed by this point -- an Israeli official made sure to comment that this very tape again was not the actual, but one like it. In this case, it was the same tape Zahn had shown -- the one, I think, that you described first, with the crossroads.

As usual, the MSM clouds the issue very effectively. It's so dangerous and unprofessional.