There's only one requirement to being a Christian:

[The Backlash Cometh]

And that's to accept Jesus Christ into your life as your Saviour. That's it. From that point on, it's debatable as to how many times you have to go to church every week, or whether you have to witness to other cultures. From that point, it's really arguable if being a good person is associated with Christianity, or whether it's just the result of a good upbringing, or a combination of both.

So, if you take into account that there's only one universal requirement to being a Christian, how did the Republicans monopolize the religious demographics? I know they took strong sides on Abortion and prayer in the schools, but why didn't the Democrats retaliate with all the goodwill programs that were directed to the poor, which were also secular in nature? Why don't they still do it now since it's obvious that Republicans don't see poor people?

I just don't see how Republicans can keep the facade when they're the warmongers, and killers of innocent civilians.

[WinkyDink]

1. I beg to differ.

"it's really argueable if being a good person is associated with Christianity,":

Not if one takes the Sermon on the Mount seriously.

[Amy6627]

4. I agree with you. If that were true about not having to try to live as

Christ taught, then the right-wing anti-Chirsts would be Christians, and they clearly are not!

[The Backlash Cometh]

16. Good Point.

Then this is the angle that the Democrats should control. We should bring good works back into Christianity. Does it say anything about being humble?

[Amy6627]

17. Yes. When you do good works you are not suppose to tell anyone.

[The Backlash Cometh]

19. And THAT's what's complicating everything.

Because no Democrat will get on a microphone to explain that quiet charity is part of his way of practicing his religion, no one knows the good that Democratic Christians are doing.

[jonnyblitz]

22. yep, all the good christians aren't out there tooting their horn

about it therefore nobody hears about them. it makes sense.

[NMMNG]

42. But the fundies scream from the rooftops

whenever they do the smallest thing.


Maybe the Dems need to speak up about the fact that acts are part of their faith, even if they don't talk about the individual acts.

[kestrel91316]

79. Dem Christians need to toot each other's horns, rather than their own.

Brag about what OTHER Dem Christians are doing in the way of good works, and let them brag about you in return.

Simple. Easy. Gets you noticed in an acceptable way.

[NMMNG]

93. That's an even better idea

Then the good deeds get noticed without people being vain braggarts.

[phylny]

90. I don't think your assessment is accurate.

Fundys don't publicize when they do good things. They publicize that they're CHRISTIANS and rant and rave trying to get OTHER PEOPLE to do things or to stop doing things.

[DoYouEverWonder]

46. How you live and conduct yourself

should make it apparent that you follow the way of christ. You don't have to talk about it, when it's a way of life. It's just who are.

[Freedom_from_Chains]

28. Yeah, the mainstream Christians, who I think really do try to

follow the teachings of Jesus, have been way too silent during the Bush regimes takeover. But then again, Muslims, whom I think have had their religion hijacked by extremist, have also been ineffectual.

[movonne]

5. I agree...

[movonne]

6. I agree...

[LostinVA]

15. Only if one is a Fundamentalist

Everyone else -- especially RCs, Quakers,a nd Unitarians -- empathizes good works. Baptists, etc., don't believe that good works get you anywhere. Heck, some think it goes AGAINST what a Christian should do... which is witness.

If one takes Jesus' words as the true Gospel, one is mandated to help those around him in every way... and not to judge. Ever.


ON EDIT: And, accepting Jesus into your heart as your Saviour is basically being Born Again, which the majority of Christians don't believe as doctrine.

[The Backlash Cometh]

18. Good works. Why were they allowed to brush this one under the rug?

I suspect it was because most of us who learned the old way, also learned to be humble and not boast about the good things we do. It's time to change that.

[Samantha]

27. Well, I was a Baptist until the Church came out in support

of a pre-emptive attack on Iraq. I never considered myself a fundamentalist, however. You are correct about not judging others ... judge not, lest you be judged is something I first heard when I went to church as a child, and I carry that with me today. Those Baptists I hear condemning gay marriages, for instance, to me have departed from their religion. It's God's job to judge, and not the prerogative of any human being to do so (with the obvious exception, I feel, of those who commit criminal acts and must face a court of law).

But as far as the good deeds, I feel you have kind of misrepresented that denomination. Baptists feel doing good deeds is simply the Christian thing to do and one should not perform good deeds for the purpose of gaining a higher ground in the afterlife -- but for the purpose of simply helping his fellow man or woman. "By their deeds Ye shall know them" is another Biblical refrain I heard when I started attending church as a child -- today that would simply translate to "you can tell what kind of person you are dealing with by the way he or she conducts himself." "Do unto others" ... the golden rule. So many Baptists do a lot of good deeds, all you have to do is look to New Orleans and you will see their hands at work, not for the sake of gaining glory for themselves but simply for the sake of giving a helping hand.

As I said, I am no longer a Baptist because of the position this denomination took on the Iraq war (as a Baptist I was outraged) but that does not mean I do not recognize the many good works many Baptists do on behalf of the underprivileged, the sick or the elderly.

Al Gore is a Southern Baptist .... Jimmy Carter is a Southern Baptist. These are two of my political heroes who have chosen to stay with the church despite their opposition to the war.

My point is Baptists should not be universally condemnned any more than Muslims should be.

[misanthrope]

33. I'm a recovering Southern Baptist as well...

...and I'd bet dollars to doughnuts a fair number of those folks who journeyed to NOLA were piling up heavenly brownie points in their minds. Granted, they did a job few others were willing to do, and there's honor in that, but don't believe that all of their motivations were so pure of heart.

All of this stuff about good works and other things are still skipping the obvious point.

If humans love each other as they do themselves, then all the good works and non-judgemental 'tudes come about as the result of holding those axioms in your heart. They are supposed to be a manifestation of a belief, not just something you do because of fear of Hell or anything else. They're supposed to be done simply because compassion motivates us to do them.

[LostinVA]

44. Just going by what several Baptist ministers and many Baptists

Themselves have told me.

[fishwax]

55. but Baptist doctrine allows NO credit for works, only faith--

Only faith brings salvation, according to the Baptists. They believe any suggestion that good works will help you get into heaven to be heresy. That doesn't mean that none of them ever do good works--of course they do, and in my experience you're right that many of them believe that good works are the christian thing to do.

Still, if you tell a baptist preacher that you're helping out at the homeless shelter because you want to do good works to get into heaven, he'll likely tell you that you're going about it all wrong, and that only faith will get you into heaven.

[LostinVA]

71. Thanks, Fishwax -- that's what I was trying to say

[fishwax]

81. living in baptist central for years, I became quite familiar with their

views on my salvation :rofl: I imagine it's quite the same in Virginia.

[The Backlash Cometh]

91. What jerks. Makes sense now why they do so many terrible things

and still get away with it.

[pitohui]

40. being born again is in the bible

i can't really believe the majority of christians other than catholics could possibly deny you must be born again

[LostinVA]

45. Only Fundamentalists and Evangelicals follow this

Catholics, Lutherans, Methodists, etc. etc. etc. do not follow this doctrine of "Born Again." That's why they have adult baptism and the others have infant baptism.

Unless every single comparative religion class and theology book I"ve vere taken/read have been wrong.

[BeTheChange]

58. Being born again has nothing to do with baptism...

Water Baptism is a symbol.

[knitter4democracy]

82. So is being born again.

Most churches say that Christians have to be baptised. Baptism is a symbol of the rebirth in Christ. Jesus Himself was baptized, which is why it's given priority in the sacraments.

[fishwax]

53. not all christians view such passages as literal doctrine

The born-again faction is far from a majority of christians. Just because something is in the bible doesn't mean it is taken literally by all or most christians. Even those who claim the bible is the literal and inerrant word of God tend to believe parts of it (such as the part where Jesus says you have to eat his flesh and drink his blood to have eternal life) are symbolic.

[kestrel91316]

80. I was raised Presbyterian and never even heard this thing about

being "born again" until we got transferred to Ohio in the 70s and all my school friends were Southern Baptists and into being "born again". It was completely alien to me and my parents.

[knitter4democracy]

83. It's a matter of definitions.

In the Eastern Orthodox Church, we say that baptism is the outward show of being born again in Christ.

It's how you define being born again--is it a decision made at a kneeling rail, is it choosing to be baptized, is it a daily choice to be like Christ as much as possible every day? Most churches accept all of those definitions.

[BeTheChange]

65. Ephesians 2:8,-9.

For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith-and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God-not by works, so that no one can boast. Ephesians 2:8, 9.

[fishwax]

87. James 2: 21-26

Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?

Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?

And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.

Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?

For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

[JerseygirlCT]

68. Thanks, you said that better than I did. nt

[pitohui]

39. your theology is bad. winkydink

this is the way it goes, god saves by GRACE

not by works, not by ass-kissing, not by anything you can do, by GRACE --which seems to be indistinguishable from "whim" but be that as it may

the point is that god is all powerful and can do as he likes, he DOESN'T have to let the really good person into heaven (would you, really, if you had to listen to them until the end of time), no it's by GRACE, it's UNKNOWABLE to us why and how we are chosen, we can be saved by grace even at the moment of death

think abt the logic of christianity, it is that god wants blood sacrifice, and his son was so disgusted by this that he came to earth and shed his own blood for us

THAT is christianity, that god's son died for us, that's it, everything else is doctrinal variations

the point being that god is that irrational being who pretty much picks and chooses

now, as a presbyterian, i am taught that god is omniscient which means that he is all-knowing and that he is omnipotent which means all powerful -- the inescapable conclusion drawn by logic and by the presbyterians is that god wrote down the names of the saved in the book long before you and i were born, it was already decided who was of the elect and who wasn't because if he didn't know at the beginning of time who was saved he wouldn't be omniscient would he?

if you entertain god enough apparently you are in the book and you are saved even if you are an evil person and you can be a wonderful good person and go straight to hell cause your name ain't in the book!

needless to say, the presbyterians don't much advertise their belief in the elect any more, god is out of our hands and out of our control

all we can do is be kind to one another

but we can't force god to be kind just by behaving nicely, god is mad, my friends

you have a kind heart and you have created god in your image but there is no reason that god can't be raving power mad ego maniac, he did demand his own son's blood after all

[fishwax]

56. winkydink's theology isn't bad, it's personal

:shrug:

[BeTheChange]

59. Are you people serious?

Jesus demanded his own son's blood?


No. Jesus had free will... just like the rest of us... predetermination? No. No. No. No. That is freaking retarded and made up by simple minds that somehow cant comprehend that just because God knows what we will do doesnt mean he makes us do it.

[Toots]

51. A quote from Eleanor Roosevelt

"Don't tell me you are a Christian, let me figure it out on my own"

[knitter4democracy]

84. Or St. James's epistle.

Faith without works is dead, according to St. James, the brother of Christ and first bishop of Jerusalem.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

2. It all depends on how you define "Christian."

[Freedom_from_Chains]

3. Simple, the republicans had a better PR machine.

[DanCa]

77. Mo money, mo money mo money, the words that the gop lives by.

[cmd]

7. Oscar Meyer comes to mind

B o l o g n a. Being a Christian requires one to live a life modeled after that of Christ. There are very few Christians in this world; though there are many who call themselves Christians.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

9. Gandhi said it well:

"I like your Christ.
I do not like your Christians.
They are so unlike your Christ."

[WinkyDink]

29. He WAS a snarky sort, wasn't he?! Heh.

[Bluerthanblue]

62. sort of like Jesus

confronting the Pharasees saying:

"Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You clean the outside of the cup and dish, but inside they are full of greed and self-indulgence. 26Blind Pharisee! First clean the inside of the cup and dish, and then the outside also will be clean.

"Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You are like whitewashed tombs, which look beautiful on the outside but on the inside are full of dead men's bones and everything unclean. 28In the same way, on the outside you appear to people as righteous but on the inside you are full of hypocrisy and wickedness.

"Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You build tombs for the prophets and decorate the graves of the righteous. 30And you say, 'If we had lived in the days of our forefathers, we would not have taken part with them in shedding the blood of the prophets.' 31So you testify against yourselves that you are the descendants of those who murdered the prophets. 32Fill up, then, the measure of the sin of your forefathers!

[panader0]

8. I never considered myself a "Christian"

in spite of being brought up as one. My mom was a Prod and dad a Catholic. I always felt that "Thou Shalt Not Kill" was the most important thing. All of the other commandments or "sins" pale in front of this one obvious fact. If you take a person's life away, you take it all, all future chance for redemption, everything.

[JI7]

10. because being Christian or religious is not about doing good for others

there is an assumption that it is . and that's one of the problems in the first place. some people are good and happen to be Christians. and i don't mean just Christians but religions overall and the belief in God.

the whole view that if you believe in God than you are good and moral.

there are many people who do good and what some people claim to be "the christian thing" but are not Christian or don't believe in God at all.

if someone does good i think their religion has little to do with it. it's mostly about what they were taught, how they were brought, or just their own morals and values.

[Freedom_from_Chains]

13. I read somewhere this week

That religion did not create morality, but that morality created religion.

[Freedom_from_Chains]

11. Well this ought to be good for a flame thread. LOL

[bloom]

12. That is not a requirement either

there are people who consider themselves to be Christians who believe in following the teachings of Jesus.

And that is all.

[Freedom_from_Chains]

14. But then again, one can consider themselves to be anything they want

Simply believing such does not mean that one is what they believe themselves to be.

[bloom]

23. So - according to you

if some Organized denominations says you are a Christian - even when they have no idea what you really think - then you are?


Like the Organized religions are valid and one's own viewpoints are not?

I don't buy it.


Besides there are non-hierarchical religions that DO NOT require that people announce that Jesus is their "Lord and Savior" - the Quakers - for instance.

[Freedom_from_Chains]

34. I have no idea how you came up with that was what my statement

implied. Can you explain?

[Name removed]

20. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[shimmergal]

66. No offense meant, but that's nonsense.

Not all religions claim there is an afterlife. And, whether there is one or not is not dependent upon what any religion says about it.

Religions are attempts to find MEANING in the universe.

[malaise]

21. As an athiest I live by one creed

What you do not want done to yourself, do not do to others.
What you do not wish upon yourself, extend not to others.
Do not do to others what you do not want them to do to you.
Analects, Book 15:23Confucius

Bush and his christians can have their crusade - they will lose this one as well.

[Lefty-Taylor]

25. Who needs religion, its mythology and its wars! Be kind to others,

think clearly, love your family and friends, and don't vote GOP!!!!

[malaise]

26. Be gentle with nature

as well. :D

[Zhade]

24. Yep, though of course wars have been fought over "real" Christianity.

The "No True Christian" fallacy is a dishonest attempt to portray Christians as only being good people. It's blatantly false, of course, since many prominent Catholic leaders throughout history (say, Torqemada) have indeed been both Christian AND murderous thugs.

[misanthrope]

30. I disagree...

...the central crux of "Jesus' teachings" is to love others as you love yourself.

[bleedingheart]

31. that's a hard one...I don't know if I could love others as much...

that would mean less loving for me....

:silly:

[RevCheesehead]

36. Yup.... Also,

"to love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, mind, and strength... and to love your neighbor as yourself." He says that this combination is the summation of the 10 Commandments, the Torah, and the Prophets.

[pitohui]

41. the central crux of jesus's teaching is blood sacrifice

if all it was is you can love others as yourself, he could have died of old age like the buddha or like confucious -- from which he stole this little sound bite

the whole point of jesus is that god hates and resents people for being imperfect, as punishment for being imperfect, he demanded that we sacrifice animals and (sometimes, as in story of abraham) our children

jesus died and gave his blood for once and for all kind so that god could stop taxing us for our children's blood, our pet's blood, our animal's blood...he basically made a statement to god to knock it off

your interpretation of christianity is v. kind and i suspect you are a v. kind person because it's human nature to think everyone is like ourselves but if you review your bible again or get more deeply into theology you will see that i am technically correct

[BeTheChange]

61. What Bible am I supposed to read..

to ever come up with an idea even remotely validating that the above statements are "technically correct"?

[knitter4democracy]

86. Of course. That's why He died. Then, why did He rise again?

It's in the resurrection that we see how He modeled mercy and forgiveness as well. He loved us so much, more than He loved Himself, that He sacrificed Himself once for all of Creation. That's where the theology of Love stems from.

[BeTheChange]

57. And I disagree with you....LOL

and that whole teaching is to love others as He has loved you... not as you love yourself. We love ourselves very imperfectly.

[BeTheChange]

69. A little more elaboration...

The below passage was uttered during an attempt to trap Jesus in reference to his knowledge of the OT....if you are talking about interpretation of the commandments, yes.. but when you say "crux" I think we are missing the point:

Mark 12:
And one of the scribes came up and heard them disputing with
one another, and seeing that he answered them well, asked him,
"Which commandment is the first of all?"
29
Jesus answered, "The first is, 'Hear, O Israel: The Lord our
God, the Lord is one;
30
and you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and
with all your soul, and with all your mind, and with all your
strength.'
31
The second is this, 'You shall love your neighbor as yourself.'
There is no other commandment greater than these."

Then Jesus said.. wait a second.. that was only part of the story... I have a NEW commandment for you:

John 13:34 (The Message)
The Message (MSG)

34-35"Let me give you a new commandment: Love one another. In the same way I loved you, you love one another. This is how everyone will recognize that you are my disciples—when they see the love you have for each other."


See... to love eachother as he loved us is way harder then loving someone as you love yourself... Loving other as Jesus loves you.. passionately and without end is often the hardest thing we will ever do.

[lonestarnot]

32. Separation of Church and state and DU and Church. This is my last

post to anything that looks like, smells like, or tastes like religion of any kind. :hi: It's called hijacking, and they are good at it apparently, especially when sheep are used to being herded.

[mmonk]

35. While that's good and all

I prefer the Christianity whereby Jesus and his teachings set the example to live by (rather than a kind of oath club or Jesus as an object to worship without paying attention to his message). Anyway, I'm not feeling close to religion these days.

[REP]

37. Actually, There's Less To It Than That

The taking "Jesus {the} Christ into your life as your Savior" is actually a matter of debate. The basic requirement for Pauline Christianity (what is practiced on this planet today) is to believe in the divinity of Christ. Everything is else is why there is many demoninations, schisms and movements.

Personally, I agree with George Bernard Shaw when he said, "Christianity as a specific doctrine was slain with Jesus, suddenly and utterly." (Preface to Androcles and the Lion: On The Prospects Of Christianity, 1912)

[SoCalDem]

38. Reagan started the demonization of the poor/weak

so a stance where the poor are helped, gets no traction in the press.. Poor people are dirty, they smell funny, they are welfare cheats..They only vote when democtrats pay them..they are alcoholics/addicts/trailertrash/dropouts.. When dems want tohelp them, they are accused of "enabling" lazy people..

It's TOTALLY wrong, but the propaganda of 3 decades "proves" the opposite.. Just look at how positively gleeful reporters/politicians are when the announce that they "cut the FAT" out of the budget..(that's a euphemism for support of services for the poor.young.old)

[cmd]

43. How many Christians responded to this poll?

This was the online poll results today in our local paper:

An eye for an eye................
Total votes: 161
Leaves the whole world blind 28.0 %
Is proper justice 48.4 %
Should only be used in extreme cases 19.9 %
Not sure 3.7 %

http://www.timesreporter.com/

[mikelewis]

50. 45

[cmd]

64. Amazing, isn't it?

I'm sure that many of those who voted an eye for an eye consider themselves Christians. They just don't believe in the teaching of Jesus.

[meow2u3]

47. I agree and disagree

...that's to accept Jesus Christ into your life as your Saviour....this is a slogan particular to the Baptist, Evangelical, and/or fundamentalist churches. So are you really saying that in order to be a Christian, you have to be a Baptist, Evangelical Protestant, or a fundamentalist? I don't think so, and here's why. One reason is that right-wint fundies have a reputation for "accepting Jesus Christ as their personal savior" only to go around doing as they please behind closed doors, despite--or because of--their public stand against sexual behavior they claim to find abhorrent: straight sex for women outside marriage; kids having sex; etc., while privately the most powerful men among them have been caught numerous times engaging in illegal sexual behavior, i.e., with children and/or unwilling victims.

The original Christian church established by Christ is now known as the Catholic Church. The word "catholic" means universal; open to everybody, regardless of race, culture, or national origin; and with the same doctrine no matter where in the world you are, even though the forms of worship vary from culture to culture.

[LWolf]

48. I disagree.

I think the "accept Jesus Christ into your life as your Saviour" is an after-the-life of christ addition; I don't think he said that. I know Peter said something about "repent and be baptized," but repentance and baptism can take many forms, not just that the church decides to assign it. To be honest, I was never really impressed with how the disciples interpreted and carried out his words, anyway.

I think the only requirement to being a christian is to live according to the principles that christ tried to teach his followers. I don't think saying words in church that label you "saved," while you live your life in opposition to Christ's teachings, makes you a christian, unless being a christian is being a member of a church that has usurped his name.

Of course, 99% of organized christianity disagrees, lol. That's ok with me. I think organized "christianity" is corrupt and off the path they should be on as followers of the Christ.

[BeTheChange]

63. In the original Hebrew/Greek "Savior" translates more closely to King...

And Jesus did indeed say that we must accept him into our life as King in numerous ways throughout the NT.

*shaking head* Where do you people get this stuff from? Did you read this somewhere? Im just curious because it doesnt appear that any of these false statements in this thread have been made by anyone that has actually devoted even a day of their life to the sincere study of the Bible.

[LWolf]

70. In the 1970s,

I read the bible. Cover to cover. Repeatedly. In more than one version. I compared what it said to what numerous "christian" churches I was attending said it meant, and discovered a large conflict between the two.

I saw too many church leaders twist and shape bits and pieces of scripture to fit their world, and religious, views in ways I didn't really think intended by the text of scripture. I saw them encourage people to close their minds to critical thinking, analysis, and history.

I witnessed those who professed to follow christ engage in lies, dishonor, deceit, abuse, and hatred. They were fine with that; they liked being "sinners" who got to stay rooted in that "sin" because they couldn't help themselves, but Jesus "saved" them. They did whatever the harmful hell they pleased, and then made

Edited to say: This was a long post that somehow got cut off; I'll try to "recreate" it from this point.

And then made loud prayer begging for forgiveness. As long as they showed up on Sunday and prayed loudly and regularly, they didn't have to exhibit any actually christ-like behavior.

I started getting phone calls from my pastor, who was "worried" about my pre-marital sex life. He asked all kinds of detailed questions, and seemed particularly obsessed with whether or not I'd ever given any guy a blow job. When he appeared in court to testify on behalf of an alcoholic congregation member with a history of domestic violence,who was suing for sole custody of his kids, because the mother was a lesbian, that was enough for me. I left, and spent about 5 years drifting around, sure that other churches would be "better." Instead I found the same patterns, and I left the church without looking back by the end of the decade.

Fast forward to this century: I had to deal with another group of "christians." A family my grandson was born into. After 4 years, and numerous instances of neglect, abuse, endangerment, and outright near-death experiences for my grandson, we finally got the law to step in and revoke custody. Forever. Of course, he will, for this lifetime, carry the scars that they inflicted on him as proud, church-going, bible-thumping, "christians."

I should also say that I have met many of what I consider to be "real" christians in that they actually try to live what they think christ was trying to say; they practice the golden rule, etc..

I respect them, and honor the path they've taken.

Like the words of a holy man whose teachings I relate to more than the bible, they are striving to "become" the christ they follow.

To me, that's what christianity is. It has nothing to do with the corruption of those who have usurped the term.

[BeTheChange]

72. So what? Who cares what churches say?

We sure weren't supposed to trust the council of such people.

1 Corinthians is basically a whole book devoted with how to deal with false Christians. It's a whole book that says.. Hey Church, you arent getting it. Why do we have to go over this again and again? Paul passionately pleads with the church to reconsider it's path. His words arent completely unlike some of those in current times who dislike the Church. The only difference is, he hasnt thrown the baby out with the bathwater.. just because those who claim to be Christians arent acting right, he doesnt reject Christ himself... he doesnt morph his teaching or Jesus' message to accomodate these "bad Christians" just because they say they are Christians.


1 Corinthians 5:
9When I wrote to you before, I told you not to associate with people who indulge in sexual sin. 10But I wasn't talking about unbelievers who indulge in sexual sin, or who are greedy or are swindlers or idol worshipers. You would have to leave this world to avoid people like that. 11What I meant was that you are not to associate with anyone who claims to be a Christian yet indulges in sexual sin, or is greedy, or worships idols, or is abusive, or a drunkard, or a swindler. Don't even eat with such people.


.......

Dont let your disappointment with man trick you into believing that you dont have to accept Christ as your Savior. The way the truth and the light isnt some after market addon.

[mikelewis]

49. Wrong....

Saying Jesus is your personal savior is not the only requirement. In fact, it's not even a guarantee for salvation. Even Jesus said, "Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name? Did we not drive out demons in your name? Did we not do mighty deeds in your name?' Then I will declare to them solemnly, 'I never knew you. Depart from me, you evildoers.'

This is what is required to be a Christian...

Everyone who acknowledges me before others I will acknowledge before my heavenly Father.
But whoever denies me before others, I will deny before my heavenly Father.
"Do not think that I have come to bring peace upon the earth. I have come to bring not peace but the sword.
For I have come to set a man 'against his father, a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law;
and one's enemies will be those of his household.'
"Whoever loves father or mother more than me is not worthy of me, and whoever loves son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me;
and whoever does not take up his cross and follow after me is not worthy of me.
Whoever finds his life will lose it, and whoever loses his life for my sake will find it.
"Whoever receives you receives me, and whoever receives me receives the one who sent me.
Whoever receives a prophet because he is a prophet will receive a prophet's reward, and whoever receives a righteous man because he is righteous will receive a righteous man's reward.
And whoever gives only a cup of cold water to one of these little ones to drink because he is a disciple--amen, I say to you, he will surely not lose his reward."

To be a Christian, we must follow these commandments...
"You shall love the Lord, your God, with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.
This is the greatest and the first commandment.
The second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself.
The whole law and the prophets depend on these two commandments."

You can call yourself a Christian all you like but if you do not know God, he will not know you. These Republican "Christians" think Christianity is a social club and they believe God exists to serve them. Nothing could be farther from the truth. To follow Christ, we must obey his commandments...

"You shall love the Lord, your God, with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind. This is the greatest and the first commandment.
The second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself.
The whole law and the prophets depend on these two commandments."

When they lie, when they cheat, when they steal, when they kill they are willfully and knowingly breaking the Lord's commandments and so are not Christians. There's a whole lot more to being a Christian than saying He is your savior.

[fishwax]

52. there is no "one requirement" to being a Christian, because there is no

conclusive or universal definition of Christian. There are personal definitions and institutional definitions which are accepted by faith, but any definition of christian advanced by one person or group is bound to be rigorously contested by others. And there are many christians who don't profess the doctrine of a personal saviour. Of course, plenty of other people will say those people aren't really christians, which simply demonstrates my point.

[Bluerthanblue]

60. the only 'requirement' to being beloved by Christ-

is to be-


What ever a 'group' decides to name themselves, whatever initiation rites they set up -is up to them, and means little in the long run. I can call myself a queen, yet I'm a queen only to those who 'believe' my claim, including me- Naming yourself something doesn't change who you are.

Jesus Christ came so that everyone could have abundant life- It is ours for the taking- no strings- there are many 'bad' christians, and many 'good' athiests- none of this seperates us from Jesus' love-

When we do bad, in the end, we are really hurting ourselves the most- because we are victims of our own hate. We have missed out on the opportunity to live life to its fullest.

This is my belief- and I seek to follow the path of Christ- because I believe compassion, love, and caring for each other as if 'others' meant 'self'- kindness, generosity, and patience- is the way to live in peace, and with as few regrets as possible come the end of this journey-

peace,

blu

[mikelewis]

73. Amen

[genie_weenie]

54. I can tell you it will standing on one leg:

"You shall treat your neighbor as yourself."

[JerseygirlCT]

67. I don't accept your definition, either

Many denominations w/in Christianity aren't of the "take Christ as your personal savior and be SAVED, AMEN" school. Exactly what that means, and how that's interpreted is an open question.

Otherwise, I agree. I don't see much at all in the Republicans' actions that would indicate a devotion to following the path Jesus did. They focus on a few matters about which Jesus had little or nothing to say, b/c it allows them to ignore the things he did have something to say about: healing the sick, feeding the poor, housing the homeless, visitng prisoners, turning the other cheek.

[uppityperson]

74. 2 definitions of Christian (can be combined too)

Those who do as Jesus did (or is supposed to have done, emulate him)
Those who accept Jesus as your Saviour (still not sure what that means, but some must since they say it)

These can be combined, but for me I do not consider you a Christian unless you do the first, second I still do not understand, but you must do the first.

[enki23]

75. not quite. there is only one requirement, but that isn't it.

the only requirement for being a christian is calling yourself a christian (one way, or another).

[kitty1]

85. And that is loving The Lord and everyone as himself. n/t

[enki23]

92. no it isn't. it's just saying "i'm a christian."

.

[DanCa]

76. I agree with your sentiment but for some

It's being a rich healthy republican. The sick and downtrodden need not imply. Case in point the vatican wants to expell stem cell scientist, and pro stem cell politicians. Funny I wonder when they'll get around to Rudy and Arnold.

[Redstone]

78. You could even follow His teachings without going to church

at all. That's what we do.

Redstone

[havocmom]

88. I follow him as 'master' as in 'teacher'

Savior? Only my own actions can save/protect my own soul. No one's blessing can undo what harm I may do in life. I must work toward good.

There are many wise teachers/masters. Sadly, there are more vile teachers who cajole and lie. True good masters are rare/ False prophets abound.

To few followers of the former. Way too many followers of the latter

My ol mom used to encourage us to learn all we could about other's beliefs. Compare them and consider that what teachings are universal may be worth looking into, for there, may be truth.

[Crunchy Frog]

89. Does accepting Jesus into your life as savior imply

any obligation to at least attempt to follow any of his teachings?