Bush will not stop the war in the ME because he wants Lebanon and

[KoKo]

Syria to stand up to their terrorists elements. He wants the Arab/Muslim world to see how violence hurts their own people. And, if he can drag other countries into the violence by getting them to try to evacuate their people trapped in these countries as the violence escalates then he will have his extra troops to fight his WWIII.

Trying for peace in the ME doesn't work because of Israel, so allowing an all out confrontation drags everyone into the fight and makes it a World cause. Probably what the Neo-Cons have intended all along.

Why else would Bush not be making a huge peace effort? Why are other countries not pressuring him too? Why is there not massive negotiation going on to threaten Israel to cut off our aid until a "settlement" over the soldiers in Lebanon can be made? Where are Jordan and Egypt in negotiations? Where is the Arab League and Saudi Arabia.

It appears that nothing is being done as the G-8 proceeds as usual? There doesn't seem to be a "buzz" about what's going on as there has been in other confrontations which have put us on the brink of war in the past.

Does anyone have faith that something's going on "behind the scenes" to stop escalation of this into a War with Israel continuing bombing until the whole place explodes?

[eShirl]

1. "Why else would Bush not be making a huge peace effort?"

sheer incompetence

[davidwparker]

4. and a love of violence. Bush on the Couch by Dr. Justin Frank is a good

read. He is externalizing his inner tensions.

[KoKo]

5. It's not up to Bush alone. Just today 5 Canadian citizens were killed and

France, England, Germany and other countries have citizens in Lebanon and Syria for business or peronal reasons.

If France and US are sending ships and Canada will have to evacuate it's own citizens...where is their influence?

I'm getting tired of the incompetent excuse for him. He's backed by powerful Think Tanks who have been working on "war games" and scenarios for decades.

This is too serious and other countries would have been involved in the past when threat of world destablization over oil came into play. This seems different. Why?

[global1]

9. I'm Just Worried That Conveniently A French Ship With Lebanese...

evacuees gets blow up. That certainly would be a convenient way to build world sentiment and draw other countries into the fight.

[redirish28]

2. Some people don't find it that way. Some believe he wants a back door

into Iran. Therefore he is waiting for Iran to get involved so he can go in there (have a reason to go in there.)


Watch the news... at least CNN has mentioned something about how Iran was holding the Israeli hostages or how Iran gave the weapons to Hezbollah. It is settle BUT watch if this is a correct idea then you will here more and more about Iran helping Hezbollah.

[KoKo]

7. If Bush wants Iran...will other countries stand by and let him have it,

though?

[redirish28]

10. They sat back and let the US go into Iraq. But this time. You have

Israel crying that Hezbollah's weapons are being given to them by Iran.

[blonndee]

3. I think you are on to something

in that they're (Bushco) obviously purposefully encouraging the situation to escalate; but I don't think it's because they want the countries to "stand up to their terrorist elements" and "to see how violence hurts their own people." Instead, I think they want those countries to stand up FOR those terrorist elements and/or against Israel and the U.S. THAT's what would ramp up the big WWIII the neocons want. I think the fighting going on right now will "coincidentally" diminish once the U.S. attacks Iran/Syria/etc.

Hopefully that's way off base, though, and somehow this can die down.

[blm]

6. Why make Bush sound idealistic? He WANTS war because it serves FASCISM

and its goals of perpetual profits from perpetual chaos and war.

[lonestarnot]

8. Personally, I feel better when bushitler keeps his mouth shut .

[Double T]

11. bush has never made ANY attempts at peace, why would he start NOW????

bush is ALWAYS confrontational and the current skirmish between Israel and Lebanon is the same old crap that has gone on for decades or longer. bush loves this kind of an ordeal. bush has more interest in eating cake with mccain or feasting with chancellor merkel during times of disaster or world tensions, then attempting to secure aid or peace. bush is incompetent and has NO position or standing as a true world leader; I believe MOST other countries see bush as a joke or laughing stock. I don't believe this is WW III, but the damn rethugs are so desperate for a 'war cry' for the 2006 elections, they see the escalating middle east tensions as another one of their sick opportunities.

[kenny blankenship]

16. Indeed this is the culmination of his policy to promote war

and throw roadblocks in the path of peaceful solutions. No peaceful solution in Iraq would have been acceptable to him, no rational person can doubt that. Here as well, only lip service to the idea of negotiated settlements is heard from the Bush Administration while every effort is made to encourage a unilateral Final Solution imposed on the Palestinians by Israel.

[ourbluenation]

12. Please read this...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=1648709&mesg_id=1648709

**********************************

Shrewd Israeli Objectives May Be to Curb US Deal-Making Options In Middle East

Some Questions Regarding Israel's Objectives: Is Israel Trying to Curb America's Deal-Making in Middle East?

Why is Israel pounding most of Lebanon rather than just the South and rather than pinpointing its attack against Hezbollah assets? Why the dramatic bombing of explosive fuel centers? The attacks both in Gaza and in Beirut seem made for Fox News, CNN, and the next Schwarzenegger movie.

snip

The Israeli response to the Hezbollah incursion is exactly what Hezbollah wanted. Adversaries rarely give each other the behaviors the other actually desires unless there are other objectives involved.

My view is that three broad threats were evolving for Israel from the American side of the equation. One one front, the U.S. will be attempting to settle some kind of new equilibrium in Iraq with fewer U.S. forces and some face-saving partial withdrawal. To accomplish this and maintain any legitiimacy in the eyes of important nations in the region -- particularly among close U.S. partners among the Gulf Cooperation Council states -- America "might have" tried to do some things that constituted a broad new bargain with the Arab Middle East. The U.S. had even previously flirted, along with the Brits, in trying to get Syria on a Libya like track and out of the international dog house.

There was also pressure building to push Hamas -- or at least the "governing wing" of it -- towards a posture that would move dramatically closer to a recognition of Israel. Abbas was becoming increasingly entrepreneurial in creating opportunities for the constructive players in Hamas to squirm towards eventual negotiatons with Israel that could possibly be packaged in terms of "final status negotiations" on the borders and terms of a new Palestinian state. George W. Bush is the first President to actually call the Palestine territories "Palestine" and may have eventually come around on trying to pump up Abbas's legitimacy as the father of a new and different state. I am doubtful of this scenario -- but some in Israel had serious concerns about this unfolding.

Lastly, despite lots of tit-for-tat tensions and enormous mistrust, Iran and the U.S. were tilting towards a deal to negoatiate about Iran's nuclear pretensions and other goals.

Some in Israel viewed all three of these potential policy courses for the U.S. -- a broad deal with the Arab Middle East, a new push on final status negotiations with the Palestinians, and a deal to actually negotiate directly with Iran -- as negative for Israel.

**********************

Ya think?

[KoKo]

13. Thanks for the link....it's a good read from Clemons and the comment...

and might be the truth of it, actually. I hope more folks will read it linked from this post.

Goes along with the Neo-Con's position of who they support, first. But, why does the rest of the world stand by and watch this play out when it's not just US and Israel involved. It's world stability and Oil!

How would Israel feel about world opinion if this escalates out of control and citizens of other countries, including our own are bombed? It would be a dicey walk, wouldn't it, to risk world opinion going against Israel for starting this? It's not the kind of world of negotiation and diplomacy, that I remember...but then I guess that went out the window when the P-Resident was installed by the "handlers."

The world does nothing because like our Dems they just don't know WHAT to do?

[a_viable_option]

14. Why not?

Why not let the citizens find out about the true nature of the terrorists in their country? It is their country and their way of life that is affected when these organizations decide to perform their cowardice acts. Hezbollah is hiding their arsenal of weapons in civilian buildings? What is that about? It sure isnt to defend them. Syria put their tail between their legs and left, hopefully Hezbollah will do the same once they realize that Syria and Iran has their back for only so much longer.

[newyawker99]

23. Hi a_viable_option!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[kenny blankenship]

15. The present hostilities are integral and were implied in the Bush policy

to destabilize the elected Palestinian government. War preparations began (here and there) the day Hamas was announced the winner in Palestine. Israel doesn't want to negotiate with any Palestinian government towards the creation of a Palestinian state (a policy continued under different PMs of different parties) and therefore makes it impossible for the Palestinians to have that government, any government. Meanwhile they herd the Palestinians into ever smaller cages...

[KoKo]

18. and....oppressed people will eventually fight back with whatever ways

they have. I think some of us in America are beginning to see what happens with "oppression" by the government and a controlled media.

I heard a report on NPR after I posted this from a newspaper editor in Lebanon who said Hezbollah has gotten it's act together after watching the Arab leaders deny their views for 45 years. I imagine Bush's invasion of Iraq caused alot of "fence sitters" in the ME to become more "organized."

While the United Arab Emerites, Kuwait and Saudi Arabia are lush with new building and resorts and all sorts of wonderous delights, much of the Arab world suffers under conditions that don't benefit from all this financial largess. And to them...Israel and US influence is just too much to bear.

[Laotra]

17. This is how it looks like

Israel is getting second thoughts after the first hasty reaction as they don't want to reoccupy southern Lebanon or cause a regime change in Beirut, which would only play into the hand of Hezbollah (the real motive of their provocation).

But the Bush position is not leaving Israel no other option, denying Israel their usual face saving tactic, obeying US will.

[KoKo]

19. Then...that would say FAILURE of not only Bush Diplomacy but World

Diplomacy to allow Israel not to have an "out." The very premise of Diplomacy (years ago) was to always work to find a "way out" of a very tight situation that might cause destabilizion. At least that's what I grew up with expecting and what I found with everyone except BUSH and his HANDLERS!

Shouldn't having a "compromised out" to "save face" be the FOUNDATION of DIPLOMACY? Why else would governments the world over have instituted such a thing? :shrug:

Mediators are worth their weight in OIL...aren't they?

[Laotra]

20. True

Problem is that "world" has got so used to US leadership in most matters and especially Israel that they refuse to see that the Emperor has no clothes, which would be the first prerequisite for effective diplomacy.

[KoKo]

22. IOW'ds we "suckered the World so Long" that they look to US to Lead

instead of standing on their own feet..

Yeah....I could see that. We were the beacon of light after WWII and folks never though that WE could GO ROTTEN like every "experiment" in History has.

Even us "babes in the woods" after WWII believed all that stuff....how little did we know that WE,TOO could get a DICTATOR/EMPEROR ...we were taught that it "couldn't happen here...because of our strong Constitution."

Little did we know that our "Constitution" is only supported by the WILL OF THE PEOPLE...and that WILL turned Fundie Christian or International Pro-Small Country from the Bible.........and we were sucked into Religious WARS ....

Once Again....history repeats..........:-(

[iamthebandfanman]

21. lol

you act like this is the first time isreal has been involved in something that the rest of the world seemed interested in .... but ultimately personal national interests of individual countries get in the way and nothing is accomplished ....
this current situation will help noone involved.

people will still die needlessly for being at the wrong place at the wrong time regardless.