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Philosoraptor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 09:04 AM
Original message
I'm tired of Republican Lite Democrats.
I really am, they know who they are, we know too. I want someone with a D behind their name to be the complete opposite of the republicans in EVERY WAY, and I want them to fight the Republicans on EVERY ISSUE.

Is that asking too much?
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 09:09 AM
Response to Original message
1. Deleted sub-thread
Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
saltpoint Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 09:09 AM
Response to Original message
2. Just as plants have a hardiness zone to determine their natural
habitations, so do politicians.

I don't think Barbara Boxer is anything less than a tremendous public servant. I love her to death. But I don't think she'd last very long on a ballot in Alabama.

Those "lite" Democrats you're talking about don't always vote the way we wish they would but they know their constituents awfully well.

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The Backlash Cometh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 09:11 AM
Response to Original message
3. I think the DSCC is still trying to push them, despite the obvious
conflict. They seem to think that a Democratic majority should be the goal for 2006 and that we shouldn't worry our pretty little heads about the quality of Democrat elected.

Well, I don't know why they bother calling for donations with that attitude.
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skipos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 09:13 AM
Response to Original message
4. Then work for your preferred candidate in the primary.
nt
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Philosoraptor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 09:16 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. Please suggest someone to me who is all anti republican.
And I will vote for that person.
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skipos Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 09:25 AM
Response to Reply #6
10. There are plenty of "all anti-republicans" running in primaries
If you think Lamont in CT or Wilson in WA are DINOs, I can safely say you will never be happy with any dem ever.

I also think it is very unrealistic to think that you will ever find any candidate you agree with 100%.
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INdemo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 09:15 AM
Response to Original message
5. If your are wishing for every Democrat
to be a Feingold it just wont happen
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LaurenG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 09:16 AM
Response to Original message
7. Here is the problem
The democrats and the republicans KNOW darn well what their constituents want. For instance, 85% of the American public wants us OUT of Iraq yet neither side gives a damn. They were wrong to vote for the war and they are still wrong. They insist on "staying the course" with the republicans and close their minds and ears to any opinion other that that which they think will get them re-elected. I'm sick of nearly everyone of them.

Get rid of all of them (maybe 13 out of the entire senate are voting appropriately). We have been hijacked by a bunch of yes men and few are listening to what we want.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 09:25 AM
Response to Reply #7
9. baloney.
Nothing like tossing out a figure with zilch basis in truth. Not a single poll I've seen indicates that 85% of Americans want us to immediately get out of Iraq. Americans are muddled about Iraq, and this is reflected in the polling materials. What's more, most democrats don't simply go along with the repukes. for example, in the house, the majority of the dems voted against the IWR. In the Senate 22 voted against it. Last week 39 dems voted for the Levin amendment calling on the US to start withdrawing troops. In thousands of other votes, you'll find the vast majority of house and senate dems voting against the repubs.
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LaurenG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 09:33 AM
Response to Reply #9
12. Whatever, dude or dudette
I'm in NO mood to be talked down to by someone who has an opinion about everything. I AM allowed to have an opinion and in mine it "ain't bologna". Whether my numbers (which came from Tweety himself) are accurate or not. The majority of Americans want us out of Iraq. End of story.
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dogday Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 09:38 AM
Response to Reply #9
14. Zogby had one based on Soldiers polled,
and 73% of the Soldiers polled would like to see the war ended... A majority of the people are against the war, that is a polled fact, a majority believe the reasons for this war were wrong...


Somehow they thought we would have gas and lower gas prices, that it would be a short conflict, that it would pay for itself, and that we would be greeted as liberators. Where in the world would they get those kind of ideas? :shrug:
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 09:17 AM
Response to Original message
8. Yes.
If the people of Nebraska wish to vote for a conservative dem, if the people of Indiana wish to vote for a moderate one, if the people of Vermont wish to vote for a liberal one, that's their right.
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Warpy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 09:26 AM
Response to Original message
11. Yes, it is, because by the simple law of averages
the GOP is going to be right on some issue sometime. It just has to happen. You can't be wrong 100% of the time, it takes too much research.

All snarkiness aside, the problem with Repub-lite, conservative Democrats is that they've been allowed to worm their way into power by promising to deliver the Southern moderates, the mushy middle Repub votes, the swing votes, and other mythical voting blocs.

What they have delivered is being shut out of all three branches of government and a party that is disgusting both its own rank and file base as well as voters who are looking for an alternative to GOP sleaze, lies, and corporate toadying.

The last few elections cycles should have proven to anyone who isn't a conservative (they learn real slow) that what is needed is presenting a clear alternative to corporatism and some economic hope to a vast number of people in this country who have had none for a very long time.

They need to be pushed aside. Our country as well as our party depend on it.
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acmejack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 09:38 AM
Response to Reply #11
13. Well they're just about due in that case, aren't they?
Barabara Boxer is on now gotta go!
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peacetalksforall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 09:44 AM
Response to Original message
15. Exact opposite - YEAH. Exactly right. I'm exactly in agreement.. .. nt
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derby378 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 09:53 AM
Response to Original message
16. When I hear the term "conservative Democrat"...
I want to think of Lila Lipscomb, not Zell Miller.

There are a lot of good conservative Democrats out there who are united with the liberals and progressives on more issues than you might think. I ran into a few of them at the Blue Dog Caucus when the Texas Democratic Party had its state convention a couple of weeks ago.

We're a big tent - not big enough for Zell Miller, but big enough for conservatives and liberals alike. Miller just went batshit insane.
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originalpckelly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 09:56 AM
Response to Original message
17. Cross-party traitors are what dealt the last blow to Germany...
Opposition parties voted for the "Enabling Act" because they thought it would ease the instability in the Weimar Republic. It basically signed their death warrant.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enabling_Act
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Ezra the Prankster Donating Member (67 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 10:37 AM
Response to Original message
18. The weakest link in every political system in history has been...
...Its people. Every form of government that has ever succeeded seemed like a good idea at the time, which is why enough people were willing to cooperate with it to make it function. But no form of government has ever worked as well in practice as its founders thought it would. Every form of government in history has always been based on an incomplete understanding of human behavior. A functional universal understanding of human behavior exists now, but it's been discovered by-- who else-- evolutionary theorists, of which I am one.

In our case, our government is (supposedly) controlled by votes cast by its citizens. Supposedly we have a secular government. But voters cast their votes based on what they believe to be true about the world, regardless of why they believe those things to be true. If the secular goverment is controlled by votes cast by people who hold their personal beliefs for religious reasons, you don't have a secular government.

Enter the Christian Coalition and other Christian fundamentalist groups. They build their political ideology in a secular fashion on beliefs a majority of Americans hold about the world for religious reasons. You can read all about it at www.theocracywatch.org.

The Christian Theocrofascists have seized control of our government by outmaneuvering our political system. In effect, they have made themselves a third party in our two party system. But instead of running candidates, they control such a large number of votes that no politician can get elected without offering the Theocrofascists what they want. So no matter which candidate gets elected, the Theocrofascists always win, because whoever doesn't offer them what they want doesn't win elections. Obviously that's more true in some states than it is in others, but that's the basic idea.

Luckily, a lot of progressive Christian leaders and other religious leaders have been figuring this out, and are trying to mobilize a political force to counteract the Theocrofascists. You can find a couple groups at www.tikkun.org and www.crosswalkamerica.org.

I'm contributing to that in my own way by masterminding a fourth party that can replace the Theocrofascists as the dominant alternate party in America. The Theocrofascists have woefully underestimated the uses of evolutionary science, because at this point there is not one single characteristic of humanity that can't be traced down to the evolutionary origins of our species. That means that (strange as it may sound), it's possible to use evolutionary science to write a book that does everything the Bible does, only better, because instead of being founded on an understanding of the world held by a certain group of people who lived 2,000 years ago on the other side of the world, it's founded on characteristics that everyone in the world is guaranteed to have in common by virtue of their membership in the Homo sapies species. Poets, philosophers, progressive activists, and progressive religious leaders have been trying to write a new story of the world for decades, but the one critical component that was missing up until a couple of years ago was a working understanding of how all the components of human behavior fit together. So once that working understanding of human behaviro was complete, all that left to do was to fit together all the things that progressively-minded people were trying to say. You can download my free audio book from www.newbookforanewworld.com.

There's one other political movement I can think of that's winning a lot of support right now. If you were to poll everyone under 30 and ask whether they were Democrats, Republicans, belonged to some other political party, or had given up believing that voting for anyone would ever solve anything and had started looking for ways to solve problems in the world independantly of government, I'm will to bet that more people under 30 would identify with Anarchism than with any other political party. I know a lot of Anarchists who agree that President Bush has done more to attract people to Anarchism than anyone else in history. First our two party system effectively shut any other political party out of being able to participate effectively in our political system, and then the Theocrofascists lured so many people into voting for their political goals that they turned our two party system into a one party system. So currently, Anarchism is the only other politcal movement anyone has to choose from. A good place to find out more about this is www.infoshop.org.
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LoZoccolo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 11:13 AM
Response to Original message
19. I'm tired of tons of people complaining and not doing shit.
Like when I could only find fifteen people on this board who leave the house at least once a month to do something political:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=2678140

It's your party, and if you don't like it, find out what to do about it.
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Philosoraptor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 12:07 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. There are people in this world who cannot leave the house,
Not once a month, not hardly ever. I'm one of them. So going door to door, attending meetings, protests, rallies and funcions is out for me.

I do have a lot of time on my hands and frustration in the meantime.
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Philosoraptor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 12:09 PM
Response to Reply #19
21. and who says I'm not doing shit?
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Mace_Windex Donating Member (7 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 01:30 PM
Response to Original message
22. ?
Doesn't sound like too much is going to get accomplished if everyone's fighting tooth and nail on every single issue.
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aikoaiko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 01:51 PM
Response to Original message
23. I'm tired of Democrats who defined themselves in terms of repugs.


We can do better.
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adwon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 02:19 PM
Response to Original message
24. Um
This is silly. You want contradiction, for little more than contradiction's sake. If this is a thinly veiled swipe at conservative Democrats, as I suspect, just stop. This party has never been all liberal, all the time. It wouldn't hurt if more people realized that the major issues of 20th century America were often fought just as much WITHIN the party as without.
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Philosoraptor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 02:20 PM
Response to Reply #24
25. No, I don't hate conservative democrats, I hate neo cons.
I hate Bush's war, and I hate Hillary and Joe for supporting it in any form.
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adwon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 03:30 PM
Response to Reply #25
27. Sure
Is this the only litmus test, or are there more? Is this a single elimination contest, where one disagreement disqualifies a person, or is it more flexible? Or is this yet another anti-"DINO" thread?

I shudder to think how FDR, with his dislike of welfare and quite hawkish stance in the late 30s (compared to most of the country), would rate in today's Democratic party. Or Truman, who agreed to both loyalty oaths for government employees and agreed to take on the support of Greece, the effective beginning of the Cold War.

P.S. Don't construe this as support for the people you named. I'm no fan of them myself, but my reasons are quite different and various.
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Jun-25-06 02:29 PM
Response to Original message
26. Vote issues. Not party or politicians.
If they want your vote, they'll come to you. If not, they'll pay.
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