Norway thinks corporations shouldn't be scumbags (dumps Walmart, Freeport)

[swag]

Norway's finance ministry thinks corporations shouldn't be total scumbags.

Aftenposten reports that the Norwegian Government Pension Fund has washed its hands of Wal-Mart and Freeport McMoRan :

{Finance Minister} Halvorsen's office cited "serious" and "systematic violations of human rights and labour rights" as its reason for pulling out of its Wal-Mart investments.

Another decision to dump shares in Freeport McMoRan was based on "serious environmental damage" incurred by the company.

Halvorsen was quoted in a government statement as saying that the exclusions "reflect our refusal to contribute to serious, systematic or gross violations of ethical norms in these areas through our investments in the Government Pension Fund - Global."

. . .

[Redstone]

1. As the Norweigans are busily killing whales. What hypocrites.

Redstone

[flvegan]

2. Oh, SNAP!

And to think that I was going to say something very much along those lines.

Beat me to it AND said it better, too.

[Redstone]

3. Hey, I'm always alert for a chance to point out hypocricy. Not that I

notice much of anything else, like what day it is...

Redstone

[Elidor]

8. No word in the article about whether

Mr. Halvorsen personally mans the harpoon in the longboat, nor even whether he agrees with his country's stance on whaling. But he lives there, so he must lust after whales, too, eh?
:sarcasm:

[flvegan]

10. Shee says, per the op, that

the corporations of Norway shouldn't be scumbags. Shee took stances on some things, not on others. Whaling, absent from what she spoke about. You know what they say about silence...especially a long silence.

On edit: gender.

[Redstone]

13. So how come you can argue with these people without saying

"fuck," and I can't? Maybe I should have gone to college....

Good to have you covering my back, as always.

Redstone

[MissB]

23. She. Not he.

Kristen Halvorsen, she. Not he.

[flvegan]

32. Corrected, thank you

for pointing that out.

[MissB]

34. Thank you.

:hi:

[Redstone]

11. He doesn't "just live there." He's a fucking cabinet minister. Part of

the government of the country. That makes him at least partially responsible, and fair game.

Redstone

[MissB]

22. She. Not he.

She is a fucking cabinet member. Part of the government of the country.

If you want to hold "him" at least partially responsible, then at least refer to "his" gender correctly.

Fuck.

[Redstone]

26. I heard you the first (or was it the second) time.

Or was it the third time? You've made your point, already. OK?
Redstone

[MissB]

28. It may well be picky, Redstone.

I tried to point out the gender issue to everyone that posted "he" on this thread. I may well have hit you twice.

[Redstone]

31. Not picky at all. You were right to post that. But it was three times.

One would have been enough.

Redstone

[MissB]

35. You know me.

I would've gone for four if I'd had enough time. :D

[Redstone]

38. Be my guest. But I beat you to it, and issued a retraction after

only three. Or was it two?

About as sharp as a catcher's mitt, that's me.

Redstone

[JuniperLea]

42. Well considering you couldn't grasp that whaling is

part of the Norwegian culture and has been for thousands of years... perhaps redundancy was in order?

Clearly no one posting on this thread, including myself, knows enough about this to argue effectively... he/she... 1930 vs. thousands of years... please... I think we all need to educate ourselves and quit being to freaking uppity and hard-headed.

[flvegan]

48. Culture?

Should I start throwing out there the number of things that are part of past "culture" that are now against the law and/or seen as morally reprehensible?

Educate yourself.

[JuniperLea]

51. Perhaps you should start your crusade in your own backyard...

And tell the American Indians to leave the eagles alone?


http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2005/07/24/BAGDLDRBE51.DTL


What enabled eagles to return to areas they had vanished from was a nationwide effort to control pesticides and water pollution, plus the strictest wildlife protection law on the federal books. The Bald and Golden Eagle Protection Act says that anyone who so much as collects a fallen eagle feather off a forest floor could face as much as a year in jail and a $5,000 fine.

The sole significant exemption from the ban is for American Indians, who have long venerated eagles in their religious observances and have used eagle feathers, heads and talons in the ceremonies and tribal regalia.






The Norwegians aren't having sex with the freaking whales, and they aren't hunting whales that are endangered.

[flvegan]

57. Strawman.

My Nemasket blood tells me so.

I also don't see anywhere that anyone is having sex with any animals here, either. I mean, if you want to shit on Native Americans, have at it.

Perhaps we should give the land back, and see how the eagle thrives.

Crusade...good one.

[JuniperLea]

61. Thanks... I'll gladly accept the land on behalf of my people

I'm sure the eagle would thrive under those conditions...

[flvegan]

66. Might well be true.

And hopefully so, but it's still bs, and a strawman post.

[deaniac21]

131. It also used to be part of their culture to jump in boats then

rape, kill and plunder all over Europe. One of the most feared cultures ever. Now the vikings can't even win a superbowl.

[MissB]

21. He is a she.

And I'll add a little "FUCK" here about people's assumptions when it comes to the gender of government officials.

[Redstone]

24. OK, then SHE's a member of the Government. Therefore culpable.

Better?

Redstone

[MissB]

27. Much.

It just burns my backside that a gender-neutral article about a government official leads people to presume that the government official is a he.

[Redstone]

30. Christ, you KNOW that I'm not good with detail, right?

But it doesn't change the validity of my assertion.

And at least I respond and acknowledge my mistakes. That's gotta count for something, yes?

Redstone

[MissB]

33. Anything *you* say counts for something.

I certainly wasn't singling you out. I was just rather freakin' pissed that everyone assumed that she was a he.

Out of 18 or so cabinet members in PM Stoltenberg's second cabinet, 9 are women.

[Redstone]

40. That's one thing the Scandinavians get right. Lots of women

in government.

Redstone

[mogster]

103. But not ethical invenstments?

;-)

The ban of companies with unethical standards from the Norw. Oil fund is a result of several years of work, and has support across the political spectrum here. Here's from the pages of the Norw. finance dept.

http://odin.dep.no/fin/english/news/news/006071-990626/dok-bn.html
http://odin.dep.no/etikkradet/english

Also Norw. companies has been forced to divest abroad, an example is the producer of fertilizer, Yara, who was forced out of Western-Sahara (occupied and exploited by Morocco).

Here's Mrs. Halvorsen:


There's a total of 19 companies banned, based on recommendations from the Council of Ethics:
http://odin.dep.no/fin/english/topics/pension_fund/p10002777/screening/recommendations/bn.html

Wal-Mart Stores Inc.
Freeport McMoRan Copper & Gold Inc.
BAE Systems Plc.
Boeing Co.
Finmeccanica Sp.A.
Honeywell International Inc.
Northrop Grumman Corp.
United Technologies Corp.
Safran SA
Alliant Techsystems Inc.
EADS Co (European Aeronautic Defence and Space Company)
EADS Finance BV
General Dynamics Corporation
L3 Communications Holdings Inc.
Lockheed Martin Corp.
Raytheon Co.
Thales SA.
Kerr-McGee Corporation
Singapore Technologies Engineering
http://odin.dep.no/fin/english/topics/pension_fund/p10002777/screening/excluded/bn.html

[Redstone]

109. May I point out that their government BUYS FROM 12 of those companies?

Bit of a dichotomy, there.

Redstone

[mogster]

113. Sure, but do you have an opinion on topic

At all? ;-)

[Redstone]

116. Hey, that IS the topic. How those corporations are evil, according to

the same government who buys from them.

Couldn't GET more on-topic than that.

Redstone

[mogster]

120. Not to the govt., no

The Pension fund (Oil fund) are not tied to any govt. but are the savings from the surplus from oil exploration, by state owned companies. In a teaspoon: the govt. doesn't own the money, the Norw. people does. And they want it invested ethically.

You seem to have a very simplified way of thinking; each nation is a little box where all citizens eagerly stand in line supporting their govt., regardless. Bad country - good country; one topic decides. And the topic of this thread isn't Norway, it's ethical investment.

And what your thoughts are about that is still in the dark, bro! :D

[Redstone]

130. Well, if they think it's unethical to invest in them, doesn't that mean

it's also unethical to buy from them?

Just wondering.

Redstone

[JuniperLea]

15. Well... where do I begin

There's been a 20 year moratorium on whaling, and yes, Norway wants to start whaling again. This issue, like so many, has a different story from every perspective. From what I can gather, the 20 year ban has done what was intended and the numbers of whales are back up, way up. One thing I know about attempts to save different animals is that things can get out of control. Allowing whale populations to grow unchecked can cause problems for other fishes and sea creatures. It's all about the balance. There are good arguments on many sides of this issue and I don't see what's so bad about letting some controlled whaling happen. It's a huge part of their culture.

Norway is very progressive and what they have done to Wal Mart deserves kudos. I think throwing this issue into the mix is, well, sucky. Especially since you are speaking from one side of a multi-faceted issue.

[LeftyMom]

17. Norway IS whaling

and has been since 1993. Unlike Japan they're not even trying to pass it off as research and squeeze it through a loophole. It's a blatantly and admittedly commercial hunt in defiance of treaty obligations and international law.

For the record, that huge part of Norweigian culture dates back all the way to 1930.

Whale populations don't go unchecked. They have predators and they breed very slowly. For that matter, the whales in question (in Norway they kill Minke whales) subsist on krill, which is hardly in short supply.

[JuniperLea]

Ok, methinks you need to do more research

Whaling has been going on in Norway for centuries, since recorded history as a matter of fact... and it wasn't until 1912 that they had set up whaling operations all over the world and became the number one whalers. I don't know where you got your "facts", but they are not correct.

Norway objected to the halting of commercial whaling and set their own limits, which are ecologically sound. They have very strict laws and no whale products can be exported.

You want more?


Oops! Edited to say... thousands of years.

[flvegan]

19. I do. I want more.

Norway is in violation. They "set their own limits" (your words) in violation of law.

YOU do more research.

[Name removed]

20. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[flvegan]

29. The moratorium set by the IWC in 1986

It prohibits commercial whaling.

Grip? Pfft.

Next?

[LeftyMom]

37. Norway is a CITES signatory

CITES prohibits commercial whaling of all great whales (including the Minke whale) and trade in thier flesh.

http://www.cites.org/

[LeftyMom]

25. Norway exports whale meat and blubber to Japan

Care to porvide some evidence that killing over 1000 whales a year is sustainable, or are we to take your word for that?

[JuniperLea]

41. I read where it's 400 a year

Where do you get your info? Or am I to take your over 1000 figure at your word.

I originally got into this argument when someone erroneously stated that whaling was not part of Norwegian culture farther back than the 1930's, which is patently false. The Vikings were whalers, fcol. I count that as part of their culture for thousands of years.

Clearly we aren't getting the whole story on this... I'm trying to get some facts from the source and my Norwegian is a little shakey...

[LeftyMom]

44. Well, is the BBC a reliable source?

"Norwegian whalers will be allowed to kill a total of 1,052 minke whales in 2006, an increase of 30%.

The quota was raised from 797 - already a record - after a unanimous vote in parliament, the government said."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4551258.stm

[JuniperLea]

45. Whaling today is limited to the non-endangered Minke Whale

Many supporters of whaling agree that its macroeconomic importance is negligible, but hold that the livelihood of individuals and small firms depend on it and that sustainable development depends on human harvesting of all non-endangered species (<7>). Norway's whaling today is limited to the non-endangered Minke Whale, which also accounts for more than 90% of the catch in Norwegian waters since the 1920s (<8>).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norway

[LeftyMom]

50. The Minke Whale is a CITES listed species

As a CITES species it is internationally recognized as threatened and it is illegal to trade in the tissues of a CITES listed species. Norway is a CITES signatory and thus in violtion of it's treaty obligations and international law.

The IUCN, Red List and WCMC list them as "lower risk, near threatened."

[JuniperLea]

63. Linky?

I've never seen it on any list of endangered species dated after 2003.

[LeftyMom]

67. I already linked to CITES, but here you go

http://www.cites.org/eng/app/appendices.shtml
The minke whale is Balaenoptera acutorostrata.

[flvegan]

53. Of course supporters of whaling

will agree. Supporters of Bush will also agree to idiocy and lawlessness.

Oh, and Norway's coastal communities rely on their fisheries for survival. "Sustainable development" is convenient.

[Redstone]

73. Oh, you'll cite wikipedia. There's a reliable source.

Redstone

[JuniperLea]

47. Your article clearly states their argument for doing so

The species they hunt is not endangered. They willingly stopped and even fought for a moratorium until the numbers increased. They are one of the most ecologically sound countries on the planet. They have carefully considered their position and clearly have no intention of hunting anything into or near extinction or endangerment.

Edited... so I can show you what your article says...


"According to scientists, the quota is within the interval that gives adequate safety regarding the conservation of the minke whale stocks that we target," the statement added.

[LeftyMom]

52. Those would be scientists working for the Norwegian government.

Since we have scientists working for our own government who deny global warming for political expediency and the Japanese government employs scientists who claim that hunting endangered humpback whales is a fine idea, you'll forgive me if I'm not impressed.

[Name removed]

54. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[LeftyMom]

55. I realize they don't kill humpbacks, as I said Japan does.

If you don't understand that government sources sometimes distort data for political purposes (for that matter, Norway reestablished commercial whaling to buy votes in the northern part of the country) well, welcome to politics.

[JuniperLea]

62. Then you'll excuse my burning of your straw man...

Who cares what Japan does when we're talking ov Norway?

[LeftyMom]

68. I'm talking about how politically motivated science is suspect

I mentioned Japan as they are also perpetuators of bad science to excuse thier whaling.

[JuniperLea]

76. Clearly you know nothing of Norway's environmental procedures...

They are the toughest on the planet... you can't compare what the US or other countries do...

[LeftyMom]

78. Got a linkie for that or am I to buy that unevidenced assertion too? nt

[JuniperLea]

59. Fine... here's an American scientific site that cites the same thing

http://www.acsonline.org/factpack/MinkeWhale.htm

as does Wikipedia


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minke_Whale

[flvegan]

64. Awesome. Now show me where

ACS says that it's okay to violate the law.

I'll wait.

[LeftyMom]

65. Wikipedia is not reliable

Anybody with an axe to grind can edit and in less-visited articles thier edits can remain for some time.

The ACS fact sheet is not a study, it's not scholarship, it's just a fact sheet and thus not an especially great source. It doesn't say that the minke hunt is sustainable, only that thier numbers are being studied.

[Nordic65]

69. Forgive me, but that is utterly BS

There is absolutely no connection. These are independent scientist as in the true meaning of the word "Independent".

Do you think it would pass muster among the environment lobby in Norway if it weren't?

Get over it. This is the real world, not a Hollywood humanization of animals (aka. "Free Willy").

[flvegan]

71. No it isn't.

If you think it is, then back it up.

[Name removed]

72. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

98. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

100. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Name removed]

102. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[JuniperLea]

74. "Some people" can't understand the Nordic ways

I challenge anyone to find a more ecologically sound country on the planet. The environment lobby puts companies through the wringer... it's grueling, and rightfully so.

Norway is number one on my list of countries that I would gladly move to for this and many other reasons. You can't compare Norway to the US... Apples and oranges.

[LeftyMom]

77. Norway's primary exports are oil, timber and mined metals

Tell me again just how ecological that is? :wtf:

[JuniperLea]

82. You have to look at the way they go about that

And see what their record is...

[LeftyMom]

84. Well, back that up then

I've got dinner on the stove and a five year old underfoot. I'm not about to make your argument for you.

[JuniperLea]

86. I have the CEO tapping his foot for a meeting agenda...

and I want to go home... tomorrow...

[flvegan]

88. Then get to it.

This will wait for another day when a deadline maybe doesn't loom.

[JuniperLea]

135. Just so you know

I'm waiting for information from someone who has great knowledge of Norway... I had to confirm some facts... haven't forgotten about you:)

[mogster]

121. Pile it on, confuse the topic

A fox hole discovered under a main road today. No, they weren't brutally killed or their fur sold for the sole purpose of enriching the govt.

See? Stop being so one-eyed :-)

PS. Wikipedia is still counted as fact by most

[Redstone]

75. so, it's "their culture," and that's an excuse? It was once American

culture to own slaves and to exterminate the Indians and the buffalo.

Does that mean those things should be excused today, because "it's the culture?"

Redstone

[JuniperLea]

119. And you have the nerve to call strawman...

:eyes:

[kittenpants]

91. Well said.

[kittenpants]

90. Would you prefer they killed whales AND supported Wal-mart?

Give them some credit.

[stepnw1f]

124. bingo

glad somebody see the positive in this

[rman]

107. Kinda like how "the Americans" are killing innocent Iraqi civilians,

right? What hypocrites.

[Touchdown]

118. Whales are more important than people then?

Okee-fine.:eyes:

[HEyHEY]

138. Why do people think all other nations should be so simple to understand?

It's absurd. So, they club seals, but what they're doing with Walmart is good. I'm sure the Norwegian government is every bit as complicated as the US government. Do you really think it's that easy for them to just say "one, two, three....make everything perfect!"
ANd do you really think they would sit in government about to pass this legislation and suddenly say, "Wait! How can when we're hunting whales!?"

[Hardrada]

4. Picayune people!

Norway is doing something right here so be grateful for this pressure on Walmart. Anyway I don't see you out there on the Greenpeace boats or whatever they are.

[swag]

5. "Picayune" is such a good word.

"Pecksniffian" is another good one.

[K8-EEE]

99. Hurray For Norway

They are doing the right thing with WallyWorld, I hope they start a trend...

Thanks for posting this swag darling!

[swag]

111. Hi, K8-EEE.

Long time no see. Entirely my fault!

I need to check in with you and the crew at one of those other places.

I'm going to see our own DC next month, looks like, too. Aren't you jealous?

[K8-EEE]

129. Incredibly Jealous!

Just don't come to LA without hollerin' first!

[swag]

133. I won't.

I'm waiting for another big event.

but it will be soon.

[Redstone]

6. Doing one thing right doesn't excuse doing another thing that's wrong.

Let's apply a bit of logic here.

By your reasoning, it would be OK for the US to invade Iraq because it's giving food aid to people in Africa.

Redstone

[Hardrada]

7. So it's useless for me to give anything to charity

since I don't recycle beer cans?

[Redstone]

9. No, I didn't say that. Do you understand the word "logic?"

Redstone

[Hardrada]

56. Picayune Pecksniff!

[Redstone]

80. I suppose so, if I insist that people actually READ posts before

replying to them.

Redstone

[swag]

95. Tasty coinage.

I anxiously await your novel.

[LeftyMom]

12. No, but if you drive them to the recycling center in a Hummer somebody

will point out the disconnect. :shrug:

[Redstone]

14. Smooth.

I like.

Redstone

[Hardrada]

58. Smooth move, ex-lax

as I useta hear in college (boy, was I running around with a fast crowd!)

[JuniperLea]

16. What exactly do you know about the whaling issue?

Perhaps you should try to enlighten instead of just being bull-headed with no supporting documentation...

[flvegan]

18. What do you want to know?

Norway allows commercial whaling, which flies in the face of the IWC and CITES. It's international law, and they break it (there's no real "enforcement").

[Redstone]

36. Balls. (Hey, I didn't say "fuck!) Who are YOU to speak for the whales?

Redstone

[Nordic65]

49. Chill out, please...

Nobody is perfect, nor is the country of Norway, but it's on a different planet compared to the mega-corporation that is Wal-Mart.

Pick your fights carefully. You can't win everyone, and the problem of commercial whaling is negligible to the human suffering at the hands of the Waltons...

[flvegan]

60. Negligible...to whom?

Compassion shouldn't have boundaries.

[Redstone]

70. "Chill out?" Fuck, no. I don't like Wal-Mart, but that doesn't mean that

countries that defy international laws and kill whales just because they fucking feel like it get a free pass if they also don't like Wal-Mart.

If this was a country that needed to kill whales to feed its people, that would be something else. I'd defend them to the death.

But they don't. They're doing it for sport. Fuck'em for being sanctimonious twits.

Redstone

[Name removed]

81. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[JuniperLea]

43. So, then all Americans are assholes

because their president is an asshole... no matter what we do, it doesn't make us right about anything.

[Redstone]

79. No. That's not what I said, and you know it. You're getting desperate,

here. And not making any sense.

Redstone

[JuniperLea]

85. There's not a desparate bone in my body n/t

[Name removed]

87. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[JuniperLea]

117. I'm gone

Invoking the JuniperX rule: never argue with anyone who has a closed mind and is unwilling to see another POV.
And the JuniperX rule: never argue with someone who puts words in your mouth.
And the JuniperX rule: never argue with someone who throws out meaningless rules that don't apply to the situation.

[rman]

108. Sure, which is why no-one is claiming that it does.

And of course you are not claiming Norway's stance on Walmart is irrelevant because of the whaling, which might be cause for some to wonder why you used the Whaling issue to hijack this thread.

[flvegan]

39. I agree that this is a positive step, and the reasons are to be applauded.

And someday, you might...

[Momgonepostal]

46. Freeport McMoRan? Are those Irish FReeper Morans? nt

[Redstone]

83. Oh, that was funny. Thanks for bringing a touch of humor to the thread.

Redstone

[Swamp Rat]

89. Your thread has been hijacked by whales

:D

PS. Wal-Mart sucks. :)

[swag]

92. It happens. And in the immortal words of Casey Kasem,

"Who gives a shit?"

[kineneb]

93. so long, and thanks for all the fish...n/t

[swag]

96. adios, compadre.

[stepnw1f]

94. Good....I Dislike Walmart and What They Represent (nt)

[swag]

97. It's too bad there's not an option to recommend for worst thread.

Read another bad thread
Available Now and For Free
Sent It To Your Cell Phone
Now!

Advertise on this thread

[mogster]

104. This is (still) an interesting thread, and those two others as well

Thanks for posting, you beat me to it! :-)

[swag]

115. Don't mention it. I didn't mean to steal your thunder,

but came across reference to the story in an industry rag yesterday, and am always happy when shareholders exercise their rights and responsibilities.

[mogster]

132. I agree

And it is a very large fund, one of the worlds largest.

"The market value of the Fund at end-2005 was NOK 1 399 billion. Since 1996, the Ministry of Finance has transferred a total of NOK 1 154 billion to the Fund. Of this, NOK 220 billion was transferred in 2005."
http://odin.dep.no/fin/english/topics/pension_fund/p10001683/bn.html

There goes about 6,2 NOK on a $, so it gives about 225 billion USD. Much of the surplus comes from high oil prices caused by war and conflict, and it's part of the ethical aspect to divest in areas like weapons production to not 'fuel' the fund's income into becoming a perpetuum mobile of high oil prices caused by war.

[upi402]

101. John Bolton tried to tell the Norwegian ambassador

but he couldn't tell him much
:rofl:

:hide:

[bettyellen]

105. KnR.....such a great OP

[SlavesandBulldozers]

106. anybody who does one small thing to rid their country of wal-mart

is cool with me.

All whales aside.

[omega minimo]

110. I SPEAK FOR THE WHALES

This is a really important subject and POTENTIALLY good discussion thread. The point of the OP seems to have been, missed, hijacked, snarkituded and trivialized into oblivion.

Too bad.


In the Thread-That-Never-Was I would have said:

Individuals can make decisions that "reflect our refusal to contribute to serious, systematic or gross violations of ethical norms in these areas through our investments....." and purchasing power.

THIS IS AN IMPORTANT POINT AND GIVES US MORE POWER AND INFLUENCE THAN BULLYING EACH OTHER OVER WHO STILL WHALES.

Bloody petty.

[bridgit]

112. as do the residents of Humboldt Co, CA...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x1377999

[swag]

114. Your state has been in the forefront.

Too bad the corporate bullies seem to have gotten Sean Hannigan evicted from his post at CalPERS.

Imagine the nerve of CalPERS:

Demanding companies disclose their Y2k readiness.

Calling on companies which operate in offshore havens to repatriate to the United States.

Calling for reform in executive compensation, especially Golden Parachutes.

Suing the NYSE over allegations that their specialists (floor workers) engage in practices which hurt investors.

Banning investment of its funds in nine companies that do business in Sudan until the government of that country halts ongoing genocide.

[bridgit]

136. i do not have to tell you how much horsepower that CalPERS...

account generates...truly staggering = hiring firing king makers & breakers

[Swede]

122. Good for them.

Let he who is without sin,cast the first stone.

[GirlinContempt]

123. Holy.....

What in the hell happened in here?


Interesting story :)

[swag]

125. Hey,

Canadian! I'm listening to "Hail to the King" by Machine Go Boom.

Nice coincidence. Great song.

[GirlinContempt]

126. Well well well

Must be fate :D

[NobleCynic]

127. Wow. My condolences Swag

This could have been an interesting thread had it stayed on topic.

[swag]

128. Thanks for the sympathy.

I'm sure I'll get over it, with some counseling.

[Raine]

134. Good

I know they are wrong on whaling but at least they did right with this.

[theHandpuppet]

137. Uh-huh. Norway, world's biggest market for baby harp seal skins...

... and unapologetic whale killers.

NEXT! :grr: