To all Dem lawmakers who allowed Haditha to happen - YOU'RE OUTTA HERE!!

[derby378]

Some Democrats on the Hill opposed the occupation of Iraq from the very beginning, to their eternal credit. Other Democrats signed onto the invasion, but now claim they were at best misled by the Bush administration.

But any Democrat in the House or Senate who thinks we should maintain our presence in Iraq, even after the massacre in Haditha, has got to go. This bullshit has gone on long enough.

First Abu Ghraib, then Fallujah, now Haditha. How much more are we Democrats supposed to tolerate?

If your Democratic Congressperson or Senator is a compromiser or an Iraq hawk, find out who's running against them in the primary. If he or she wants us out to pull out of Iraq, give that candidate your vote.

This is of paramount importance, folks. Get out there.

[TallahasseeGrannie]

1. I am ashamed.

[skipos]

2. You think there weren't massacres like this in WWII?

Or any other more justifiable war? I disagree with people who support this war in principle. Events like Haditha, while horrible, doesn't change my mind one way or another.

[The Magistrate]

3. This Is Breathtaking, Sir

A Republican administration conceives and embarks upon a war of colonial conquest and occupation, in the course of which atrocities occur, and your response is: "Let's throw some Democrats out of office!"

[derby378]

4. You misread my intent, then

I'm saying, "Let's throw some fake Democrats out of office and replace them with real Democrats!" Because sometimes - and you've gotta admit this - sometimes a fake Democrat is no better than a Republican. The Hayden confirmation stands as my witness.

[skipos]

9. Is Bayh a "fake democrat?"

Many DUers probably think so but he voted against Hayden. Is Levin a fake "democrat." I think he is really good but he voted for Hayden. I realize that at DU, you are only as good as your last vote, but yeesh. I'd like to see your list of "fake democrats." When you come up with your list, find the margin that Bush or Kerry won their state by, and you can see wether a Boxer or Feingold type democrat would have a chance getting elected there. My guess is that most of your "fake democrats" come from red states.

[derby378]

11. You raise some valid points...

...and I'm really glad Bayh voted against Hayden. Good for him.

Me, I come from Texas, which conventional wisdom would have you believe is so "red" that it's almost Marxist. But we're committed to turning Texas blue in November - and this time we intend to do it right.

[The Magistrate]

12. A Democrat Is A Democrat, Sir

It continues to amaze me that you find this not an occassion to denounce the Republican administration that concoted this the invasion and bloody occupation of Iraq, but rather take it as a pretext to attack Democrats in office.

[derby378]

16. If that statement was true, we would have bitched about Zell Miller

Once again, the question looms - do you want to be represented by a "Democrat," who will sell out his own party and his own convictions in order to secure his own political future, or do you want to be represented by a Democrat, who will put the freedom and security of our nation ahead of her own personal interests?

[The Magistrate]

18. Since, Sir

An official must secure election and re-election to office to do anything at all of consequence, actions people take in the interests of their political survival do not trouble me over-much: a person can over-indulge in this, of course, but just as every person who has a few drinks in a week is not an alcoholic, a sense of proportion must be maintained by all parties in judging such matters.

And you still have not engaged the element of greatest interest to me here, though of course, you are under no obligation to do so. Yet it still fascinates me, and will continue to fascinate me, that you take this event not as an opportunity to attack a Republican administration that contrived and executed the invasion and bloody occupation of Iraq, in course of which these atrocities occured, but rather take it as a pretext to attack Democratic office-holders.

"LET'S GO GET THOSE BUSH BASTARDS!"

[derby378]

19. I've already attacked the Bush administration over Iraq...

...but there's nothing new that I can say about Nero or any of his neo-fascist cronies that hasn't already been said on DU over and over and over again. They're corrupt, they're beholden to corporations that are just as corrupt as they are, they have no regard at all for the Constitution, they have stolen the last two Presidential elections, they sanction torture, etc., ad nauseam.

We're already united against the Republicans. But that's not enough. Once we take over Congress in November, we don't want to make it any easier for some lawmakers who identify themselves as Democrats to "enable" Republicans.

You do realize that you don't have to call me "Sir" all the time, right? I appreciate the gesture of respect, but you're all right.

[The Magistrate]

20. That Is A Pleasure To See, Mr. Derby

Attacking Republicans is one of those rare pleasures that never grows stale, and cannot be experienced to often....

And certainly, when we have a majority, politicos who will not stick with it on substantial votes will need to be called out and driven out if they do not heed the call....

A pleasure to make your acquaintance, Sir!

"Even in this vale of tears there remain things to be thankful for: I, for one, give daily thanks I am not a Republican."

[Catrina]

21. Thank you ~ we have a real Democrat in our district who despite any

perceived threat to his career, has consistently voted the way a real Democrat might be expected to vote. Oddly enough, in this not very Democratic district, he is highly respected for voting his conscience.

Otoh, our Senators, Sen. Hillary Clinton and Chuck Schumer have often made it difficult to tell which party they belong to ~ Sen. Clinton is up for re-election this year. She most likely will win, but it's not as certain as it was initially. Too many real Democrats are very disappointed by her shift to the right ~ she did vote against Hayden, however. I have noticed that they seem to take turns voting for the neocon agenda.

I don't buy voting for a bill that gets people kille, or cuts benefits for the poor or elderly in order to preserve one's own career ~ there are Democrats who have not done that and have had long careers in office. There are others who haven't done so either but have lost ~ however, they are not complicit in the on-going destruction of their own country. They took their oath of office seriously. That is of primary importance imo.

Joe Lieberman is learning that when you do not represent the people who put you in office, they are under no obligation to support you ~ I think there will be many Dems such as Lieberman who will be surprised at the anger of the people as they wake up from the horror of the past five years.

I keep trying to think what Diane Feinstein, eg, has accomplished as a Democrat ~ all those who supported the war and continue to do so, are complicit.

I have more respect for the Republican Congressman who thought up the 'freedom fries' nonsense, but after seeing the results of his support for the carnage in Iraq, renounced it and joined John Conyers in his efforts when even Democrats refused to do so.

So, I agree with you ~ no one ever has to apologize when they do the right thing.

[MrBenchley]

8. Astonishing, no?

[derby378]

10. Make up your mind

Do you want "Democrats" representing you, or do you want Democrats representing you?

[MrBenchley]

14. I got no problem with Democrats, Derby....

But then I'm not trying to peddle Republican propaganda, either....or pretend the idiotic and dishonest views of its looniest splinter group are "bipartisan" concerns.

[derby378]

17. Hey, whaddaya know? We actually agree on something

There is hope for the Republic, after all.

If I run into you in Jersey, I'll buy you a beer so we can toast the downfall of Nero together.

:toast:

[Mr_Spock]

15. Good point

It was not going to be stopped by Democratic opposition and they were actually trusting the "intelligence" of the administration at the time. It was too close to 9/11 to show a large amount of government distrust.


It's totally unjust to blame the Democrats for this, never-mind the fact that they would not have embarked on such a folly if they were in power.

It is appropriate to criticize those who still support the war however - it's bad politics to support a failed war just to win a few votes in your next election (from dumb-asses).

[ificandream]

5. The problems start at the top

Focus on getting Bush out. That's the problem. The Dems aren't the real problem here. I will agree, though, that any Iraq hawks -- D or R -- have got to go.

[derby378]

7. If you want Bush out, it all starts with the primaries

If your Democratic Senator and/or Representative will not support impeachment of Bush, research their primary opponents and see if they'll support impeachment. Then vote for them in the primaries.

When November comes around, vote for every last Democrat you can find on the ballot.

Then sit back, bask in the knowledge that you helped give Congress back to pro-impeachment Democrats, and watch the fun ensue as Republicans collectively soil themselves in fear.

[Catrina]

22. I absolutely agree. The American people are in a bad mood, especially

Democrats who thought they were voting for an opposition party. I think there might be many surprises in the primaries. Republicans who are crossing over are more likely to vote for someone who is less well-known to them ~ it will make it easier for them to hold their noses and vote against their own party if the Democrat has not already been on their radar screen as an 'enemy'.

Washington needs some new and uncomprised legislators ~ being there too long seems to have a negative effect on many. Anyone who serves the coroporate world, cannot serve the people they represent. It's really that simple, imo. That should be completely obvious to any thinking person by now.

[zulchzulu]

6. "signed onto the invasion"...

Actually, if you've been paying attention, not that many Democrats "signed onto the invasion". They believed in the UN and yes, were misled by Bush with false intelligence and believing he would actually follow the UN accords that were signed.

I'm as pissed as you are about the war, but this is simplistic conjecture. For those who are still for the war, I certainly would fight hard for the opposing candidate in the primary though.

[Ian David]

13. They massacarred civilians, but at least none of those soldiers are GAY!

I mean...

That would get them in SERIOUS trouble!

SOLDIER PLEADS GUILTY IN GAY PORN SITE CASE
Associated Press

FORT BRAGG, N.C. (AP) - A soldier pleaded guilty Tuesday to having sex on a military-themed Web site for money and was sentenced to three months in prison.

Pfc. Wesley K. Mitten, 21, pleaded guilty to sodomy, conduct detrimental to the Army and cocaine use. He will be discharged from the service.

"I am sorry for disgracing my family name and my unit," he said, according to The Fayetteville Observer.

<snip>

Four other soldiers were punished outside of the military court system. All four were reduced in rank to private, forfeited half a month's pay for two months, performed extra work and were restricted to Fort Bragg for 45 days. The Army has discharged one paratrooper and has recommended discharges for the other three, division officials said.

http://www.outinamerica.com/home/news.asp?articleid=29103