Feelings on film "Last Temptation of Christ"?

[Tallison]

Just finished seeing it for the first time and feel bewildered, like I don't know what I just saw. Not that I didn't like it so much as I don't feel I understood it well enough to even form an opinion. I'm now tempted to read the Niko Kazantzakis' novel on which it's based, hoping it'll improve my comprehension - if that's is the right word - of this particular take on Christ's life. I'd be interested in hearing anyone's perspective on this film/book/narrative. Thanks!

(I'm also posting this thread in the Catholic forum...)

[murielm99]

1. Read the book.

I have not seen the movie, thinking that I might not like the cinematic interpretation of the book.

It was a controversial book. It almost got Kazantzakis excommunicated from the Greek Orthodox Church.

I think the book concentrated on Jesus' humanity. His temptation was that He wanted to stay flesh, instead of concentrating on His divine mission. He wanted to enjoy all the ordinary human pleasures. The visions and voices troubled Him, and He wanted to push them away. It seemed to me that the whole book was His journey toward accepting His divinity. That may be simplistic. The book is more complicated than that.

Read it, and then see what you think.

BTW, I was a church librarian about fifteen years ago. We acquired a pastor who was a bit conservative for our denomination. I wanted to buy that book for the church library. He did not want it in the library. He could have left it at that, and I would have disagreed, but respected his wishes. But he chose to castigate me publicly, in the church bulletin. He did not mention my name, but everyone knew it was me he was talking about. I left that church. That was not the only reason, but it did help me make the decision.

[RevCheesehead]

2. What a jerk.

Classic triangulation - trying to make the congregation part of the disagreement. I worked with a senior pastor who did exactly the same thing, telling people publically (during church) about our personal disagreements. Very ugly, indeed.

I've wanted to read the book. I saw the movie when it was released (1987?), and later bought the VHS tape. I might need to watch it again and post my post-seminary thoughts. :)

[Tallison]

3. Well, I just rewatched the film for the second time

in two days, finished it two hours ago at 2am, and am still unable to sleep. I feel stunned, touched, and at the risk of sounding precious, somewhat spiritually reawakened. Now, like possibly many in this forum, I was not raised Christian, and I've never considered myself very conventionally Christian. That said, after two decades of exploring different religious traditions during which I earned a B.A. in religious studies, at one point joined the Catholic Church and at a later one became active in a Buddhist temple, I've remained strongly enticed by and allured to a Jesus as Christ-centered sense of spirituality. Despite this, my issues with various dogmatic and theological tenets of the RC Church and most Protestant denominations have prevented me from ever before fully identifying myself as a Christian.

To digress for a moment, I recall a salient point Joseph Campbell made in his book "The Power of Myth" regarding what a difficult time some have in identifying meaningfully and personally with theistic images of perfection. I don't have a copy of the book by me from which to quote, but he wrote something to the effect that it's through personal flaws and shortcomings that humans ultimately evince their vulnerability within a community and by extention their need and suitability for receiving compassionate love. In other words, imperfections often evoke love and compassion in others; the extent to which a figure is lovable is in some sense proportional to the number and magnitude of his/her flaws. Campbell supposed this condition accounts for the difficulty many have in achieving a relationship that feels emotionally gratifying with a perfectly conceived God.

"The Last Temptation" has me now wondering to what extent Campbell's point has been operative in my own struggle to believe, when for lack of persuasive scientific reasons to in this secular age, it's the emotional ones that become most compelling. And what an emotionally compelling and provocative film I found "The Last Temptation," far more so than "The Passion," which I think is chiefly due to "Temptation"'s portrayal of Jesus as an anguished, self-doubting, identity-conflicted being for whom salvation and redemption never appeared certain until almost the moment of death. That is suffering, and one which renders Christ much more relatable and by extension lovable to me. Yes, lovable. Never considered such potential for feelings within my relationship to a higher power before. I'm so impressed. And terrific job, Defoe and Scorsese!

In any case, I'm now very, very eager to read the book.

[Old Mouse]

9. What a marvelous post!

I find a great affinity for your spiritual situation, with Cambell, Miles, Pagels, Armstrong, Castaneda, Pinker and Bulfinch providing little relief...

One of my favorite things about Last Temptation is that it came out to great protest and controversy, when in fact it was deeply spiritual, (although the sex scene is overlong and gratuitous - the film is just as powerful without it) but Monty Python's Life Of Brian, a scathing rebuke of Christianity, had no where near the complaint.

[FreedomAngel82]

15. Something like that happened at my church

A group of people wanted to take over the church. I don't know why but I guess they didn't like some changes (nothing unscripture or anything). :shrug: But they started a petition to get people to rally up against the elders and wanted all of them but one to resign. Majority of the church didn't want it but they still caused problems. My mother is still upset about that sometimes today and so am I because I thought it was rude how they went about everything. Instead of trying to get the whole church involved it should stay between you and that person as it should be. Since then my church has talked (scriptually) how you should handle situations like that privatley and not gossiping etc.

[regnaD kciN]

5. Agreed. Read the book first...

IMHO, the film wasn't nearly as good.

[FreedomAngel82]

14. That's so rude and immature

How Christian of him. :eyes: I've never heard of this book before. Sounds interesting. I think it sort of goes along with Jesus' feelings when he was about to begin his walk to the crucifixion stage of his life. I do think he was probably really scared of the pain and all that. I'm sure it probably took a while to get used to everything. I've had visions and things before and it's very weird. It happens so fast you don't know what's going on so it does take some time getting used to. Poor guy. :(

[Kat45]

4. I loved the movie.

I'm a huge fan of Scorsese, and I make sure I see everything he directs. His films are so good, and he has the ability to reach me unlike other directors. That said, I really liked the movie when I saw it way back when. I remember churches protesting it as well. I think it's an interesting take, whether or not I agree with it. It worked to portray the human side of Jesus.

I grew up Catholic and stopped going to church during college. (I had been away from church when I saw the film.) In recent years, I felt spiritual needs and was fortunate to find a wonderful church in my town, and I eventually joined the church. It's a Congregational (UCC) church, quite progressive and non-dogmatic. I've been atttending Bible study there, and a couple of years ago we and the minister (who leads it) decided that we'd watch movies dealing with religious themes and then discuss them. I suggested "Last Temptation.." and watched and discussed it. It was a very interesting discussion, mainly because it was such a different--and unusual--portrayal of the life of Jesus. It was a much more provocative discussion than the one following "The Passion..." last year.

[boomboom]

6. Please don't flame me

although curious, i've refused to see the movie. I don't want our Lord to be humanized. I live and breathe the Bible as the word of God. Christ Jesus did not struggle with the flesh. We do, he didn't. Praise God.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

7. I'm not flaming you, but the mainstream teaching of the Christian church

for centuries has been that Jesus was both fully human and fully divine. As such, he did struggle with the flesh. Remember the story of the temptation in the wilderness? Remember when he prayed in the Garden of Gethsemane that he be exempted from the "cup" he was about to partake of?

The early church considered the idea that Jesus had only a divine and not a human nature to be the heresy of Monophysitism.

[Old Mouse]

10. There's validity to your choice.

All storytelling is an interpretative process. That movie is Scorsese's
Christ, not yours. Do you feel the same about "The Greatest Story Ever Told"?

[FreedomAngel82]

17. You should read more of the Scriptures then

Read about the pain he went through on the Cross emotionally and physically. The pain when Judas and Peter betrayed him and God. It's there in the Scriptures if you read it.

[FreedomAngel82]

16. I think sometimes people tend to forget

that even though Jesus is the son of God and had great abilities he was also a human side. I'm sure it was hard to struggle the two and I think it's important to remember and know that part of him as well. He cried and he felt betrayed when his friends (Judas and Peter) betrayed him just like we do. He wanted to make sure his mother was taken care of etc. He even prayed to God before his crucifixion for the cup to be passed from him. When he was on the Cross he prayed to God on why he left him. So Jesus still was human.

[onager]

8. That tattooed Mary Magdalene was HOT.

One of Barbara Hershey's best roles, IMO.

And the movie was a lot more interesting than Scorsese's film about the Dalai Lama. But you could say the same thing about watching paint dry. That damn thing was SO boring, I was actually rooting for the Evil Chinese Invaders. At least they provided some action, unlike the Talking Waxworks on display for most of that movie. I guess that's a lesson in what happens when the artist feels overawed by his subject.

Funny story about "Last Temptation." When it came out, Blockbuster here in L.A. sucked up to the Fundies and announced they would not be carrying it.

I went in my local Schlockbuster one day and, just out of curiosity, asked if they had it.

The girl on duty looked around nervously and whispered: "Yes, but we keep it under the counter and you have to ask for it."

[Kat45]

11. I enjoyed "Kundun," his film about the Dalai Lama, and I'll tell you why.

This is not the type of film I'd ordinarily go see, but I love Scorsese's work so much, I'll see anything he directs. I read an interview with him beforehand, and when I read it, I understood that I'd have to put myself into a different mindset to watch the movie; I hoped I could do that.

I began watching the movie, and at one point early in the film, two quick scenes in sequence (I think it was a bird flying overhead and the ripples of a lake/pond, I forget in what order) suddenly sucked me into the movie and I was able to alter my mindset. It's hard to explain, but I let the film engulf me and just got into it; if I didn't understand something going on, it was ok--I just went with it, there would be plenty of time to ask questions and think about it later. I really enjoyed the movie, and I spent a lot of time later thinking about it and trying to understand what I had seen. All that, thanks to Scorsese putting those two little scenes together; that man is good!

[RevCheesehead]

12. Hey! Are you back??

NMP, it is soooooo good to see you here! :hug:

[Kat45]

13. Hi Rev!

Yeah, I finally had time to drop by here. Ever since I started working full time, I haven't figured out how the heck people have time after work to do much of anything. :hi: