I have a question- I think it is "field of depth" related

[Inchworm]

Ok. I took this picture ages ago and got lucky. I cannot find the original to see how I had my settings. I've been futzing around trying to reproduce the "look" taking hummingbird pics.

It is seems to me it is nearly out of focus but that may be the autofocus on camera. See how the colors of the finches are there and the background is identifyable but blurred. That's what I want :D



Any tips are appreciated.

:hi:

[Cassandra]

1. I'm thinking an f stop of 4, maybe a bit more.

Some sunny day, set something up with a similar distance from the background, start at 2.8 and work your way along until you get the amount of definition in the background that you want.
(BTW, it's amazing to me that I can offer any advice at all when I've had my DSLR about 3 weeks. The man who's been instructing me is a very good teacher).

[Inchworm]

4. Thanks!

DU is my teacher :D

I'll play with it some more. I have a male H-bird that has claimed my feeder as his territory. All day he sits on the fence about 25 feet from where I sit at desk. I may name him :P

:yourock:

[Blue_In_AK]

12. DU was my teacher, as well, Inchworm.

Everything I know I learned here or from books that were recommended by DUers. Special thanks especially to regnaD kciN, ConsAreLiars and the dear departed F. Gordon for your encouragement and confidence in me. :)

[regnaD kciN]

17. "departed"...???

I hope you mean that in the sense that F. Gordon is no longer here at DU rather than something more...permanent. Did something happen I didn't hear about?

[Blue_In_AK]

21. Not dead, just tombstoned apparently

For something I missed during the primaries. Hard to imagine our mild-mannered F.Gordon losing his cool, but apparently it happened. I think Crisco (who is now Nash Vegas I believe?) knows the story.

[Richard D]

2. Here's your settings

Magic, huh:

# Exposure Time (1 / Shutter Speed) = 10/2000 second = 1/200 second = 0.005 second
# Lens F-Number/F-Stop = 40/10 = F4
# Exposure Program = normal program (2)
# ISO Speed Ratings = 64


To get the kind of picture you are looking for, you'll need to have the smallest number f-stop your camera is capable of. The tricky part here is that the larger the number is, f-22 for example, the smaller the aperture will be and the more depth of field you will have - making the background and the foreground sharper. The smaller number, f-4 in the case of the above picture, will give you a more open aperture. The more open the lens, the less depth of field you will have and the part of the picture that isn't directly in focus will blur out.

Hope that was clear.

Most cameras give you the option of aperture priority in the exposure settings. You need to be careful here though because the camera will use the shutter speed to adjust the exposure, so if there isn't enough light, it'll shoot at a speed so slow there will be motion blur.

[Cassandra]

3. Did you dig out the meta data?

I was just going by what it looked like. Perhaps my eye is better than I thought.

[Richard D]

5. Good eye!

That was from the Exif information. Someone posted the add-on here a while ago.
If you use firefox, the add-on is called Exif Viewer.

[Inchworm]

6. Went to manual

Exposure time goes from 4" to 1000. Gawd.. is that inches? :P

Thanks for the help.

:hi:

[Richard D]

7. hahahaha

4 seconds to 1/1000 of a second.

There's quite a learning curve to photography. Unfortunately, the more you learn not only is there more to learn but then you start to want better and better cameras and more equipment. Did I say equipment? Tripods, strobes, reflectors, lenses, filters, lenses, camera bags, lenses, more strobes, remote shutter controllers, full version of Photoshop, lenses, strobe diffusers, etc. They say a boat is a hole in the ocean into which you can pour endless amounts of money and a horse is a four legged animal that eats money. There should be a similar saying for photography. But damn, it's fun and satisfying. Scuse me while I open my can of cat food for breakfast while I lovingly think about that D3 . . .

on edit: Any exposure slower than around 1/60, or 1/30 if you have a very steady hand, will require a tripod. If you're shooting telephoto, you'll need a tripod pretty much for anything under 1/100 (some opinions may vary), unless your camera has image stabilization. That gives you a little leeway.

[Inchworm]

8. ok.. now I'm scared of hummingbirds

:rofl::rofl:

Thanks for the knowledge though :)

:yourock:

[Richard D]

11. Well, for hummingbirds . . .

. . . you'd really need a motion activated shutter control . . .

not really, just kidding, sort of.

[dbmk]

10. A good rule of thumb

For handheld the shutter speed should be approx. the inverse of the focal length. So of you shoot at 100mm the shutter speed should be 1/100.
Thats of course highly subjective to steadiness of hands. :)

[Tallison]

28. Dude - you are so right about the knowing more = wanting more

I justified upgrading to a 70-200/2.8 VR Nikkor a few weeks ago saying THAT WAS IT for acquisitions for the year. ;-)

Last night I spent a few hours researching gear that will ramp up my macro lens magnifying power. JUST RESEARCHING. ;-)

Last week, as I lamented my choice of photography as an expensive hobby, I met an urban tribe of sailboaters, and felt gratefully trumped. $4,300 per year on Chesapeake bay slip fees?!?! That's crazy.

Two handheld shots taken with my new VR at 200mm, both 1/3 second, 2.8:

[Blue_In_AK]

13. Seconds.

4 seconds to 1/1000 of a second.

[dbmk]

9. Add to that the distance.

The distance to the subject also influences the DOF. The closer you are the smaller it becomes.

[Inchworm]

14. I'm getting the concept, but..

are the settings mere luck?

I adjusted this to get little light meter (well that's what I think it is) to center
Exposure Time: 0.0080 s (1/125)

These remained constant
Aperture: f/4.0
ISO Equiv.: 64



The background is hella far away, but see the colors come out from leaves? That's an improvement. Now if I could just get a bird to land there ;)

Here is other exif info in case it helps. I think that's what it's called hehe

File Name: blurback2.jpg
File Size: 94 kb - 800 x 600
Camera Make: FUJIFILM
Camera Model: FinePix S5700 S700
Date/Time: 2009:05:06 13:34:19
Resolution: 800 x 600
Flash Used: No
Focal Length: 63.3mm (35mm equivalent: 399m...
CCD Width: 5.71mm

Exposure Time: 0.0080 s (1/125)
Aperture: f/4.0
ISO Equiv.: 64

Whitebalance: Auto
Metering Mode: matrix
Exposure: Manual
Exposure Mode: Manual
Exposure Mode: Auto bracketing

:)

[Tallison]

29. The problem is you're in manual exposure mode!!!

In full manual mode, a light meter only provides information but doesn't affect aperture or shutter speed settings. The settings aren't luck - YOU set them!

Switch the camera to aperture priority, and set it at 2.8. At 2.8 (or whatever the lowest value for your lens), you'll achieve the narrowest DOF possible for the distance at which you're shooting.

As you back up from the subject (and it gets smaller in your viewfinder - you're not zooming in your telephoto to compensate), the DOF will increase for a given aperture. As you walk toward your subject (it gets bigger in the viewfinder - you're not zooming out to compensate), the DOF will decrease for a given aperture.

Aperture and distance from subject are the two biggest variables in DOF.

I rarely shoot in manual - only do when ultra-fast subject movement (like running water, cars, sometimes sports) and DOF are equally important and balanced exposure isn't the priority.

[DollyM]

15. Got monkey . . .

small thread crap here but your siggy reminded me of my "own" monkey. My husband that is . . . out of work for 6 months so this is what we do . . . put on a giant monkey costume and stand outside a flower shop and pose for pictures with people. Kind of fun actually, no one can resist smiling at a giant monkey (well, most people can't anyway!). I just keep thinking, we have Master's degrees for this??? But it helps pay the bills!

[CC]

16. Two great books for hows and whys are

Understanding Exposure and Understanding Shutter Speed: Creative Action and Low-Light Photography Beyond 1/125 Second both by Bryan Peterson. I think Understanding Exposure was recommended to me by F. Gordon. (Who is greatly missed.) I grabbed Understanding Shutter Speed when I read the Chapter title "One Photo OP, Six Correct Exposures."
For some people they may seem like pretty basic books but it never hurts for any of us to go back to the basics once in a while. I doubt I ever let my copies go. He is very good at explaining and has great photos to illustrate his explanations.

Cassandra's suggestion is a great one too though I would add that you might want to try it in all sorts of lighting conditions and focal lengths. It gives you a good working knowledge of what your camera and your lens will do and what the end product will look like.

[regnaD kciN]

19. Peterson's books are generally worthwhile...

...including his "basics" book, Understanding Digital Photography*. I'm drawing up the curriculum of a workshop I plan to offer later in the year, and I'm using Peterson's categories for much of the lesson plan.

*As long as you aren't bothered by the frequent photos of his glamorous blonde wife. We get the point, Bryan -- you're married to a woman who could be a supermodel. Now, can we get back to photography instruction, please?

:evilgrin:

[Blue_In_AK]

22. Yes, it was F.Gordon who recommended the Understanding Exposure.

That's a great teaching book. There's another one he recommended, too, that I have at home, but I can't remember the title.

[regnaD kciN]

25. An intersting point about that book...

A year later, Peterson published Understanding Digital Photography, where he admitted that matrix metering had become so much better in the past few years that he had changed his whole approach to calculating exposure -- now, he simply relied on aperture- or shutter-priority automatic, and found the results no worse than doing everything manually.

It doesn't invalidate most of the earlier book's contents, to be sure...but it is interesting that he changed to a new approach so soon after "writing the book" (literally) on exposure.

[regnaD kciN]

18. All excellent advice...

...except no one has pointed out the most obvious thing: it's "depth-of-field," not "field of depth." :)

[Inchworm]

20. Ok .. all my schooling from you all.. and..

Here is my favorite.



I was told it is "balanced" as far as art goes, but is it as cool as I think? lol

I may by gosh enter it in Spring Contest :P

:hi:

Thanks again everyone for helping me understand.

:yourock:

[Blue_In_AK]

23. That's a great shot. I love it. :)

[ManiacJoe]

24. Great shot!

Some might complain about the branch running though the bird's head, but with wildlife you take what you can get.

For next time, you might try a higher ISO to get a faster shutter speed (EXIF says 1/40). From what I have been told, small birds tend to be a little twitchy.

[WannaJumpMyScooter]

26. excellent shot

any post-processing?

[Inchworm]

27. Thanks all!

I cropped it because I sorta learned the 1/3s rule here :D

Don't think I did anything else.

:hi:

[Maestro]

30. Great advice here, but I will add one more.

I like to use spot metering with birds with they are perched. Also, in modern DSLR cameras and perhaps in more advanced point and shoot cameras you can set the focus points. This is very important. I like to set the focus point right in the middle. I am aim for the eye and in this way I know that the face will be in focus. If I want to compose the shot with the subject to the right or left, I set the focal point accordingly. Doing this along with the correct F/Stop and shutter speed really helps the image.

BTW, love the Bluebird.

[dbmk]

31. Good point

I always shoot with the center focus only.
Half press, get focus, and recompose and click.