Interested in obtaining your opinion on photo education vs.

[bliss_eternal]

shooting, taking workshops, shooting, reading, shooting and maybe assisting a pro? ;)

There seem to be so many opinions out there also evidence of both, master photographers that never set foot in a photography program, and acclaimed photographers that have BFAs, MFAs, etc.

So where do you stand?

Thanks! :hi:

[RagingInMiami]

1. Hi Bliss

Welcome to our little group here. I would go for the latter, but I guess it all depends on what you really want to do with all the skill once you get it.

For example, the photo education might help you land a job easier than all the other stuff. But even if you do have the education, nothing beats actual experience. Actual trial and error.

I spent several years writing for newspapers and taking my own photos. I got a degree in communications, so my education was focused only on writing. To this day, I still haven't taken a photography class.

But thoughout all those years I was shooting pictures, I would always ask the photographers questions on improving my skills. I asked if I should take classes.

And they always ended up telling me that I don't need classes. That the only way to improve as a photographer is to keep shooting and shooting and shooting.

[bliss_eternal]

2. Hi RagingInMiami!

Always good to see you--thanks for the welcome!

So many professional photographers seem torn on the issue. Some say shoot, shoot, shoot and take some workshops when you can. Others say education never hurts, could only help, education is never wasted, etc. I spoke to one today that said you don't need it, she didn't have it... Interesting.

Photographs that I admire, come from those with little to no formal photo education. They just got out there and did it, or so it seems. Look at Herb Ritts--not so much the fact that he shot celebs-I could care less about that. I just loved his style-he made beautiful pictures. Then I look at Stanley Kubrick who couldn't get the education he would have liked because at the time it was difficult (if not impossible) for Jews to be admitted to some schools. Stills from his films--I don't even have the words for how I feel about them.

Anyway, didn't mean to go off on a tangent. LOL! I really appreciate your advice!

If you feel like it, go here...

www.juliadean.com

This place is within driving distance from me, and offers photo workshops, pretty pricey for some. Let me know what you think.

Thanks again! :hi:

[RagingInMiami]

4. Checked out the website

Not only is Julia Dean an awesome photographer, she's very progressive as well.

Speaking of workshops, a Miami-based photographer named Seth Resnick offers these workshops that focus solely on the digital process, specifically improving the workflow.

Resnick is considered one of the top corporate photographers in the world. He is the one that takes the photos for Canon when they're advertising their cameras in magazines.

You know, the ads that try to get you to believe that you can take those same exact photos, if you only buy the camera.

His workshop costs $1,000 and he takes it around the country. It's very expensive but I've talked to several photographers down here who've taken it and they said it was worth every penny.

http://www.d-65.com/workshops.html

[bliss_eternal]

5. I just checked out the link--

Amazing! It looks so interesting and very thorough--I got excited, as I saw he's coming to the west coast--but I'm afraid I'm not quite at the advanced level required.

Are you going to attend it?

[RagingInMiami]

6. I'm in the process of getting my writing/photography biz off the ground

So right now, I have very little income coming in, but if I get lucky and make a few extra thousand bucks between now and then, I will definitely take it. I figure it would be tax-deductible and it will really help me in my business.

Here is my website. http://magiccitymedia.com

[bliss_eternal]

8. Your photos are wonderful!!!

You should find much success! I'll hold good thoughts that something comes through for you, so you can take the course.

[RagingInMiami]

9. Thank you

I need to revamp my photo page before I do my promotion blitz to national magazines.
I need to sort out the photos under subjects instead of having them scattered about like that.

And I also need to add a bunch of photos I've taken over the last few months, including photos from the protest in DC and photos I took during and after Hurricane Wilma.

[bliss_eternal]

11. Oooh--

Please let us know (me) when you put up the protest photos! I LOVE protest photos! :P I know, it's sick. The Hurricane Wilma photos will be interesting to see, too. I didn't see as much of that one as Katrina.

[RagingInMiami]

13. Here you go

I have them on a separate page for right now. The antiwar protest slideshow is in the center of this webpage, and the hurricane wilma slideshow is on a link on the left hand side. There is also another slideshow from a spoken word event down here last month on the left hand side.

http://www.magiccitymedia.com/antiwarprotest.html

[bliss_eternal]

17. Sorry I didn't finish looking

at all of these until now. There are so many wonderful shots! I took my time and really tried to absorb the moments, the experience, the atmosphere you photographed. It looks like such a fun day--so many more people there than I expected to see. The media made it sound like hardly anyone showed up. But I see the police were there in full force, of course.

That a cool shot you have where all the police motorcycles are lined up in succession. I like the angle you had on that one.

Thank you for sharing--those will look great on your site!

[RagingInMiami]

19. Thanks

And don't forget to look at the other slideshows as well, when you have time, of course.

[intheflow]

3. There's a photography school in Massachusetts I always wanted to go to.

The Hallmark Institute of Photography: http://hallmark.edu/

I always wanted to learn studio lighting, that was the training I wish I'd had. All those umbrellas and lights! However, in the end I found I could usually create interesting photographs by existing light with just a little bit of trial and error, and, of course, shooting, shooting, shooting.

I learned wedding photography as I went to weddings (as a wedding photographer, don't tell any of my clients I was learning on the fly). Again, shoot 20 rolls of film at a wedding and the bride and groom are bound to get at least 50 really good shots, more than enough for an album.

I learned composition from an ex, who was a professional videographer. So I learned from his formal (college) training. But I still experiment with a couple different perspectives of almost every subject I shoot.

[bliss_eternal]

7. I've heard nothing but raves about Hallmark!

I'm sorry you couldn't attend.. :(

But it's wonderful that you work with weddings--I'd LOVE to do weddings! (I promise not to tell your clients, lol).

The thought first occured to me after our wedding. I found myself calling our photographer and asking if she ever considered an assistant. This came as quite a shock to me, as before the day I made that call, I'd never even thought of this before. So it was kind of weird, to me at least. Nothing really panned out with her, and I moved on to other things...now I know that's probably what my fondest desire was and I should have went with that.

So now, I'm honoring what I want to do. Just trying to iron out if I should sign up at the not so local community college, or from the www.juliadean.com workshops. As Raging said, her work is amazing and she is progressive. I've poked around checking out some of the work of those that teach at her workshops--also some great works!

How long should one study and shoot before offering to take on a small event, in your opinion?

[ConsAreLiars]

10. All or any of the above paths can work.

Do whatever is possible, and continue with whatever you find most fruitful. For the back story on getting paid for your work, add informal conversations with people working in those areas of photography you find interesting.

Local weekend or remote vacation-grade workshops are a good way to get a feel for different types and styles of photography as well as the course content.

[bliss_eternal]

12. Excellent--thank you!

:hi:

Some of the workshops look SO interesting and fun. I appreciate your advice!

[BamaGirl]

14. Hey Bliss

I fall into the shooting/assist a pro category, I guess. Any formal education in photography I've had came from my father. Every now I talk about taking a class, but he's cheaper lol. ;) Plus I have to listen to a lecture about how it might ruin my style and perspective. I tend to agree actually, for me personally. Couldn't hurt to give it a shot, but in the end there is no replacement for experience.

[bliss_eternal]

15. Hi BamaGirl

You're so fortunate to have someone in the family! :hi: Thanks so much for your advice!

Earlier today, I read a very long thread about that very thing--ruining one's artistic perspective and style by enrolling in traditional programs. It was an interesting thread, and one of the reasons I was prompted to start this one.

I have to say I agree with what you said about experience. It seems (some, not all) of the people that go to school kind of expect to get out and have a position waiting for them or handed to them. I've read posts on other boards by people like this, and I wonder how school will help them in the long run?

[BamaGirl]

16. I've wondered that too, Bliss

and I have no idea. One of the local studios is running an ad for an assistant that has "taken at least one class". Two of the photographers in that studio have no degree, so it makes no sense. (The one with a degree is the most jr photographer. Go figure.)

I kind of feel bad for anyone who thinks a degree is going to automatically get them work, in any field, much less photography. It is just not that easy. Most of the photographers I know are solo/freelance. You'd probably be better off with a business/marketing type degree lol. ;)

[WannaJumpMyScooter]

18. There is no clear consensus on this

among photographers.

Beyond the technical aspects of the physics and chemistry of photography, there is little to be gained of an absolute nature in these courses as they are all opinon-based instruction.

That said, someone's opinion can be valuable or not, depending on the circumstances. And meeting top people in your field is never a bad thing (unless you are a schlub).

I believe in reading what they have to say. The course thing is too much about making bucks on days when they don't have work for me.

But I know people who swear by the classes and do well.

Your Mileage May Vary.