The Pope's lasting legacy to me (dialog among the faiths)

[JohnKleeb]

So I talked with my journalism teacher about the passing of John Paul II today, and she is Presbyterian and I am as you know am Catholic. So she was telling me about how her son three years ago converted to Catholicism, and how even though she didn't always agree with him, she was very impressed by the man and his capabilities. She agreed with the part that he played an integral part in the ending the Cold War. I really am gonna miss the man, sure he and I never met but there was something about him that made me really admire him, it is a shame Karol Wotiyla is gone from this earth but he is not truly gone, he is alive in the hearts of those men and women and children who try to better the world and others.

[Princess Turandot]

1. It's almost sad that representatives of other faiths, including..

high level Muslim Clerics, leaders of important Jewish organizations and the Hindu President of India, whom among other things said that India revered him for making 'their Mother Teresa' a saint (not exactly the perspective you would find in Wikkipedia) are among the most effusive in their praise. The brother of the man who tried to asassinate him said that the shooter and their remaining family were grieved at his passing. Even Fidel has weighed in.

Meanwhile, the US coverage seems to be ramping up more and more on the abortion/birth control themes, altho they've at least had the restraint to not start yapping abt the US priest scandal.

[DemBones DemBones]

3. That's very interesting to hear. I have not been

watching but the tiniest bit of CNN coverage in the morning and watched Keith Olberman on MSNC Monday night; otherwise I'm watching EWTN. The cable coverage I watched was good, though CNN was starting to edge into controversy a couple of times -- I think their anchors' tongues are all bloody from being bitten so much to keep from trashing Catholicism.

EWTN is devoting hours a day to live coverage from the Vatican, without all the breathless speculation about (so far) where the pope will be buried -- Poland or Rome? What may his will say? Will a secret cardinal be revealed? How can it be that there is no second in line to take over -- why does the Church do it this way?

[Princess Turandot]

5. Are you watching EWTN on television or online?..

It is not on my cable system. I had hoped that they might have picked it up on one of their empty stations - they did that for the entire time that the Pope visited Cuba - but don't seem to have done so now.

Aaron Brown still seems to be the most genuinely respectful reporter in the bunch. I've never disliked him as much as some DU'ers seem to, so that doesn't shock me, but he seems to mostly focus on what he is seeing.

[BelleCarolinaPeridot]

2. I watched the processional as they moved his body to ...

St. Peter's Basilica and through St. Peter's Square among all the people who came to the Vatican and I could not move at all . I was moved while not being able to move . I

[DemBones DemBones]

4. I watched the entire procession, too; I'm just drawn to

watching lots and lots of coverage, even though it's "repetitive." It's amazing to see the huge crowds and the calm grief -- and the joy at his life. Have you seen them clapping for John Paul? That's a European thing, clapping for the deceased at funerals, being happy for the life that was lived.

I didn't know I would be so affected by John Paul's death. Not grief-stricken; I saw it coming, wouldn't have been surprised if he'd died a week sooner. Perhaps he was holding on to life until the vespers for Divine Mercy Sunday began. I feel a profound sense of loss, a feeling I should have paid more attention to him.

[BelleCarolinaPeridot]

7. Yes I feel that I should have paid more attention to him too ...

I should have paid more attention to him in a postive way instead of the ways that I disagreed with his views .

[DemBones DemBones]

9. Exactly! It was easy to focus on

what we saw as his shortcomings -- how often have you heard people dismiss him as old-fashioned, out-of-touch, and uncaring? I don't think he was any of those but he stood by the teachings of the Church and people don't like that. John Paul II embraced everyone, even those who did things he believed were wrong, even the man who shot him in 1981, because he believed in loving one another and in forgiveness. He just also believed people should work at being good and not

Many of us today are like Henry VIII, annoyed with the Pope for not letting us do what we want to do, like spoiled children. How dare that mean old Pope say that some of what we want to do is wrong! If we look at how things went for Henry and his unfortunate wives after he split from Rome and named himself head of the Church of England, we see that getting what you want isn't always the best thing. Or as the Stones put it, "You don't always get what you want, But sometimes, you get what you need." ;-)

[Princess Turandot]

6. I mentioned to my therapist tonight..

that I felt very sad about the Pope's death, sadder than I expected.
He's an MD & a psychoanalyst, altho I do not see him for analysis for those of you that understand the distinction. I assume that he is an atheist for reasons not worth getting into and rarely discuss religion with him, except to the extent that it relates to old family history.

I mentioned to him that supposedly a plan to attack the Vatican was foiled by the Italians awhile back, and then said that were they to succeed on Friday (which I thankfully believe is virtually impossible), they would throw the world into total chaos, given who was planning to attend the funeral. His mouth fell open when I mentioned that the Presidents of Iran & Syria were attending. We briefly discussed how many of the politicians who are coming to his funeral had at one point or another, sat in the front row while he said mass in their country, and listened to him look them in the eye and call the despots out for exactly what they were.

Maybe some of them are coming to make sure he is really dead!

The Vatican has also created a modest international incident by inviting (I assume) the President of Taiwan to the funeral. They are only one of a few dozen nations which officially recognize Taiwan as a country. China as we know has that bizarre state run 'Catholic' church along with the people who worship clandestinely.

[DemBones DemBones]

8. Speaking of calling despots out, I just watched film of John Paul

in Sicily in 1993, telling off the Mafia, telling them that killing was absolutely forbidden and calling on them to repent. He was angry and made that clear, raised his fist and pointed his finger. Now he's telling Muslim leaders in Sudan (also 1993?) that Koranic law can be applied only to Muslims, not to people of other faiths. (I'm watching a Vatican documentary on EWTN, they are running a lot of them this week.)

I am also surprised at how much his death has affected me. I'm not crying -- I'm happy he's not suffering any longer -- but I just feel that the earth has stopped turning on its axis and that his absence has created a giant void in the world. I've never been one who followed all the activities of the Pope, never read any of his books, etc., though I've been aware of the major issues he has addressed, primarily through the Catholic newspaper of our archdiocese, and had a general awareness of what he had done before being elected to the papacy.

Since his death, I've learned a lot abbout his life and his actions as Pope, things I was unaware of. Like the story posted here by Indiana Green about him as a young seminarian, feeding a young girl (newly released from a Nazi labor camp, emaciated and weak) he found sitting in the snow on a streetcorner. Then he carried her on his back for four or five kilometers to take her where she would be safe. Or that when he was a priest and theology professor in Poland, he directed his entire teaching salary to be given to the poor, without them knowing where the money came from. He didn't want credit for this act of charity, probably would be unhappy that the story was even told.

I've always been impressed to know that he went to confession weekly. Even as Pope, he prayed about seven hours each day, beginning and ending his days with long times of prayer. I didn't realize he was such a mystic, so involved in contemplative prayer -- and not an easy thing to do when fulfilling a very public role, keeping to a very busy schedule of meetings and appearances besides the desk work. Impressive.