when did Kerry first call for Rumsfield's resignation?

[paulk]

And what does that have to do with Joe Lieberman?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rj-eskow/why-democrats-dont-win-_b_11772.html

[Mass]

1. Not sure when exactly, but I think it was either in 2003 or early 2004.

For the rest, this guy is an idiot. Kerry never said Rumsfeld was the only problem.

However, we can call for Rumsfeld to be fired and note Bush's failure to do that. We unfortunately cannot fire Bush before 2006.

In addition, it is a fatal error to blame Bush alone. Does anybody really think that Rumsfeld would be any better as SecDef of another president.

So let the whiners whine. This is definitively useless and how Democrats lose.

[paulk]

4. I wanted to post a comment, but the Huff Post won't let me

don't know why...

but, it would have been along the lines of what you said.

A big reason Dems lose is because of assholes like Mr. Eskow, who write absurd hit pieces like the one referenced...

[TayTay]

2. Sigh! Here's some clips

Hardball, July 10, 2003
BARNICLE: Meanwhile, back at the ranch, Democratic presidential candidate John Kerry went on the offensive this morning.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KERRY: One of the reasons I`m running for president of the United States is to hold this president accountable for the lack of planning, the lack of diplomacy, the lack of strategy, and the lack of commitment to the multilateral institutions that have helped America to be strong.

I regret that we had a president who didn`t understand how to build that coalition and protect those troops by having an international effort in Iraq today.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BARNICLE: Katrina Vanden Heuvel, that`s pretty tough stuff coming from Senator Kerry, as the primary season approaches and gets closer. How close do you think the Democrats are to claiming that the president of the United States lied about our involvement in Iraq?

KATRINA VANDEN HEUVEL, EDITOR, "THE NATION": Mike, I don`t know why you think what John Kerry said was tough. I thought it sounded absolutely common sensical.

It sounded as if a candidate who understands that we have an administration which had no post-war planning and has increasingly, we find with revelations from its own administration members, misled this country, deceived this country into a war in which its men and women are being killed almost daily.

Both Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld and President Bush sounded increasingly defensive. These are questions that were asked of Rumsfeld the other day on the Hill that should have been asked in far tougher fashion prior to going to war.

And what we see now is an administration flailing about as it faces the toxic combination of nationalist anger fury against a America perceived as occupiers, not liberators, trying to bring in the international community which it dissed in the run-up to war, as John Kerry said so effectively.

[TayTay]

3. Then there's this

US Democratic presidential candidate calls for Rumsfeld's resignation
XINHUA NEWS AGENCY 09-26-2003


WASHINGTON, Sept 26, 2003 (Xinhua via COMTEX) -- US Democratic presidential candidate Howard Dean Friday called for the resignation of Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, accusing him of adopting a "pattern of deception" in dealing with the Iraq issue.

"This pattern of deception is but one major reason that this administration deserves to be fired by the American people," said the former Vermont governor, who also cited the "abject failure" in postwar Iraq.

Dean announced that he would start a national drive on the Internet to seek the resignations of Rumsfeld and his deputy Paul Wolfowitz.

Dean, who was against the war in Iraq, is the second Democratic presidential candidate urging the resignation of Rumsfeld. Massachusetts Senator John Kerry on Thursday urged Rumsfeld to step down, citing his "arrogant, inappropriate way" to handle the Iraq issue.


Copyright 2003 XINHUA NEWS AGENCY.

Also the Boston Herald 9/27/03

Kerry, Dean want scalps of Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz
Boston Herald, All, Sec. News, p 6 09-27-2003
By ANDREW MIGA

WASHINGTON - Democratic presidential candidates Sen. John F. Kerry and Howard Dean yesterday demanded the resignations of the two chief architects of the U.S.-led Iraq war, Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld and his deputy Paul Wolfowitz.

"These people . . . have proceeded in an arrogant, inappropriate way that has frankly put America at jeopardy," Kerry said on CNN. "These are young Americans who are now in greater jeopardy in Iraq than they had to be."

The harsh words are the latest in a growing drumbeat of Democratic criticism over Iraq aimed at President Bush, whose favorability ratings have slipped in recent weeks.

Dean, citing "an abject failure of planning" for postwar Iraq, launched a national petition drive calling for Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz to step down.

"The American people expect and deserve truth from their leaders . . . but we have seen something very different from this administration," Dean said.

Kerry reserved his sharpest criticism for Rumsfeld. "He did not do the planning," Kerry said. "He rushed to this war. He has not listened to the military personnel. Our military is weaker today. They're overextended."

But Republican National Committee spokeswoman Christine Iverson said the GOP is not taking the calls for the Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz resignations "too seriously.

"Howard Dean and John Kerry are playing a game of political copycat, " she said.

Sen. Edward M. Kennedy, meanwhile, charged that Bush's failure to present a realistic Iraq reconstruction plan was an "insult" to U.S. troops putting their lives on the line.

"The tragedy is that our troops are paying with their lives because their commander in chief let them down," Kennedy (D-Mass.) said in a floor speech that sets a combative tone for the Senate debate next week on Iraq.

[TayTay]

6. And this. (Have I hit overkill yet?)

Kerry also renewed his call for Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld's resignation. The Massachusetts senator, who called for Rumsfeld to step down months ago over his handling of the Iraq war, said the abuse reports compound the situation.

"It's the way it was handled. The lack of information to the Congress, the lack of information to the country, not managing it, not dealing with it, recognizing it as an issue. But look this is, this is the frosting," Kerry said. "I think Iraq and the miscalculation and the overextension of the armed forces and the entire way in which they rushed the nation to war under these assumptions that he was making _ which were incorrect _ is a huge, historic miscalculation and I thought he should have resigned then."

from : Kerry Says He Would Demand Accountability
05-06-2004
By NEDRA PICKLER Associated Press Writer

___

[TayTay]

8. Last one: Alan Colmes interview from 10/26/05

COLMES: Do you expect indictments to come down towards the White House?

SEN. JOHN KERRY (D), MASSACHUSETTS: I don't have a clue. I mean, I read what everybody else reads. Honestly, I don't know.

COLMES: Do you think there should be resignations, with or without indictments?

KERRY: Well, I said some time ago, a year and a half, two years ago, I thought Donald Rumsfeld should resign because I think his management of the war has really been inexcusable. Every prediction made has been proven to be wrong.

He neglected the most important thing, which is do all you can to protect the troops. And still, there are problems with up-armored Humvees or armor. I think it's a disgrace, and I think he should have long ago resigned.

[paulk]

5. thanks for the info

I wanted to go over there and set this guy straight, but I can't seem to post for some reason... maybe somebody else wants to?

I hate seeing crap like this in a blog as big as HuffPo...and some of the comments...

sigh... I guess that's all you can do.

[TayTay]

7. I don't have a registration over there.

Sorry!

[beachmom]

12. I don't know how to tell you this, but if you post pro-Kerry comments

on HuffPost it will never get past the moderators. They didn't post mine or another Kerrycrat's a few months back. They only posted KG's because she called someone over there who she knew. Since then, I have stopped going over there, since Huffington obviously does not support the notion of freedom of speech even when I was neither profane nor did I attack anyone.

Since I'm bitching about blogs, I have decided to stop reading andrewsullivan.com, too. He had some good commentary on torture, gay issues and the Catholic Church, and on *'s conduct of the war. However, he made a horrible comment about Kerry, and I e-mailed him and was ignored as usual. This is what he said: since Kerry did not make torture a major campaign issue, he is "complicit to torture". He went on to say that this was "indisputable". Yet his hero, John McCain, gets no admonishment for supporting and even embracing the torturer. I should have stopped reading then, but I thought that maybe he would print my e-mail, but he didn't. Then, this week he said Democrats are "useless" on the Iraq War, citing a NYT article with Madeleine Albright, Holbrooke, and Wes Clarke. That's when I decided his blog was useless to me. He nonstop criticizes Republicans in power, but then with little commentary condemns Democrats who aren't even in power. I don't need that kind of negativity. And just to reiterate he equates Kerry with * on torture. I just can't forgive him for such a horrible comment, when I think of both Kerry's Vietnam service and his anti-war protests afterwards. Kerry is of uncommon high moral authority when it comes to war.

(Now I remember why I didn't immediately give up on Sully: I think you all know he is HIV positive, and right after his Kerry comment, he got really ill from a stomach virus, and I just felt bad that he was not well. But now that he's better, I have to realize that his health status should not affect whether I let him off the hook for vile comments)

[Noisy Democrat]

18. My comments did appear

They were slow to get up there, but they finally appeared.

[beachmom]

20. Oh. I checked for a while and then gave up. Thanks for letting

me know, Noisy Democrat. I will refrain from spreading that false rumor anymore. I still don't see myself reading HuffPost that much, though. I love it right here!

[karynnj]

21. His Kerry comment is utterly disgusting

First off, Kerry called for Rumsfeld to be fired when Abu Ghraib was dealt with badly. He also in listing things that Bush did wrong, listed Abu Ghraib. He also mentioned the Geneva conventions many times. Coupled with Kerry's heroic 1971 testimony and all the positions he has taken since then there could be absolutely no doubt where he stood on torture.

As to making it a major campaign issue - that is a loser from the get go. Anyone concerned with war crimes committed under BUSH would already be voting for the Democrat, Kerry with his 1971 credentials is beyond what's needed. Did he see what they did to Durbin? Look at the RW nonsense this week.

Kerry past, if anything minimized what he needed to say last year. The question for Sullivan is, did he for a moment question whether Kerry would have allowed Abu Ghraib? Where is John McCain on the issue of US soldiers going into Iraqi homes? That's a sensibility Kerry has - because he sees people as people. Does he get credit for his prison amendment? I wonder about the morality of someone like Sullivan, whose smart enough to know better saying something like that? Is Kerry the scapegoat for all America's sins?

[ginnyinWI]

9. Lazy-ass journalists

I'm sure he could use lexus-nexus if he wanted to. That guy should buy a clue, and everyone else should tell him so. I knew (with no research) that it was around Aug 2003. So how hard is it for him to just look before he opens his big mouth.

There's no accountability online. :eyes:

[Mass]

10. Eskow is a journalist? From this post, I thought he was another

of these I know everything bloggers Huffington is so fond of.

[ginnyinWI]

11. well, they pose as journalists

They try to come across as journalists. But yeah.

[fedupinBushcountry]

13. Another, I know everything blogger

RJ Eskow is a writer, business person, and songwriter/musician. He has worked as a consultant in public policy and finance, domestically and in over 20 foreign countries. In addition to working as an independent entrepreneur, Eskow has held Senior Vice President positions in several major corporations and been CEO of two companies.

Eskow currently provides management consulting and is developing a start-up company, as well as leading a country/rock band (available for your Blue or Red State event!) Besides writing for The Huffington Post, he maintains his own blog (A Night Light) and is a regular contributor to skippy the bush kangaroo. He can be reached at "[e-mail]."

Where do they find these idiots? I can't stand the Huff post. Mostly a bunch of know it all mouthpieces, a few good people blog every now and then, but if it has anything to do with Kerry, the uber lefties and hateful righties attack it. Geez it is pretty sad when they attack a great anti-war person like Tom Hayden and a good American like Gary Hart, just because they agree with Kerry. :crazy:

[paulk]

15. it's seems like any bozo can get "printed" online

in the long run it's just this kind of "lazy" journalism that will make the blogs and the so called "netroots" irrelevant, IMO. Accuracy does matter.

[ProSense]

14. Facts? What facts?

Ask this jerk why the Democrats won in 2005. Did he even read the election headlines before he wrote this stupid one. Give me a break.

[ginnyinWI]

16. an enjoyable related article--Rumsfeld is as mad as a hatter!

on Alternet-- http://www.alternet.org/waroniraq/29101/

This article describes the event JK was talking about on Face the Nation--how the general had to correct Rumsfeld publicly about stopping torture. Add this story to Rummy's MTP appearance not long ago where he said nothing intelligible, just babbled rather incoherently--and he does seem like a nut who goes around muttering to himself, if not worse.

[paulk]

17. I can't help but think, especially in my darker moments

that this country is broken beyond repair...

What sort of system would allow these people - the whole fucking loony bin Bush cabal - to rise to the positions of power they now hold?

:banghead:

[_dynamicdems]

19. I know how you feel. If it were just the right-wingers, it would be one

thing, but hate and the derision permeates both sides. This is probably what allowed the unethical, nut bags to infiltrate all areas of our government. When we are busy fighting among ourselves, we are not guarding the door and anything can slip past.