Oh fer cripes' sake...

[rockymountaindem]

All those people in the GD thread about Kerry vs. the Swifties are still carping about the $14 million that he had at the end of the campaign. We all know the story, why don't they? Is it that they're truly just uninformed, or do they just push the truth to the back of their minds so they can fuel their continuing dislike for Kerry? Last time I checked, following campaign finance law does not make one a "quitter", "loser" or a "liar". :wtf:

[karynnj]

1. They are beyond sense

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x2134009

I've posted a few times

The article posted is worth looking at.

[TayTay]

2. Left you a present there.

Enjoy.

[wisteria]

3. Their like Repubs, when faced with the truth they ignore it.

The truth doesn't fit their agenda.

[whometense]

4. What's up with the

OP's selective editing??

I admit I didn't read through all the comments (they were making me feel sick), but I did add back in the part she conveniently left out in her quote.

Apologies if it's a dupe.

Some people are just plain foul.

[karynnj]

17. No one else brought it up.

I didn't notice because I clicked on the article first.

[WildEyedLiberal]

5. What a foul thread

Isn't it FUNNY how I've never seen 3/4s of those bashers before? You'd almost think that they wait until a convenient time they can post their repetitive, inane drivel about Kerry.

Fuck them all with broken, jagged pieces of glass.

[karynnj]

18. I even had a post deleted - someone with 51 posts

made a stupid contentless snarky post - and he had done the same thing a few days ago on another Kerry post. - Apparently pointing that out was not acceptable.

[wildflowergardener]

6. Good article - annoying comments

It is a good article - didn't read through all of the comments - I get tired of hearing the same negative comments again and again.

If John Kerry were to run again, I think the whole swiftboat thing would get less press, because it's old news. Everything that could have been brought up has. I would think by now the Republicans would have tried to dig up anything they could on him, and there are probably no more surprises to sabotauge a campaign - though I guess they could make up more things about him. Also, like the article says, Kerry has the unique advantage of being able to learn from mistakes he made in the last run, and not repeat them.

I just don't care for Hillary Clinton very much, personally, and I really think, probably, that there are enough people who don't really like her very much that I would worry that it would be difficult for her to win, if she did get the nomination. I'd vote for her if she was the Democrat, but she's definitely not my first choice.

Meg

[TayTay]

7. Nice to have you back.

You get them back the same way you lost them, one at a time. Sen. Kerry seems to be doing that, albeit perhaps in twos and threes at this stage. (LOl!)

Iowa was won not with a unanimous vote, but with 38% of the votes cast. Something to think about.

[Democrafty]

8. It was a good article!

I appreciated the pro- and con- arguments from the different pundits. Sometimes it's nice to see everything all laid out like that, and get a little reality check :)

[Mass]

9. Classic stuff. Kerry goes on the attack on Bush and the GOP. Trolls on

DU rush to attack him on the 04 election.

And many of them are, not surprisingly, newbies. The only thing I cannot figure out is whether these trolls are RW trolls or staffers from another candidate.

[WildEyedLiberal]

11. I noticed that ALL the names attacking him were new

I have never seen most of them before. That's not suspicious at ALL.... :eyes:

[karynnj]

19. and ironically - one complaint - Kerry didn't go after Bush

ugh

[ProSense]

10. It's the

fact-free fantasy bash fest: Poll-a-Troll marathon.

[paulk]

12. well.... there are a lot of people on DU who not only don't like

Kerry -

They don't like any Democrat.

just sayin'....

[TayTay]

13. This is true

Sometimes the urge to harp on what divides us overrides the impulse to trumpet what unites us. What kind of a Democrat speaks out against someone who is asking for accountability and responsibility in such strong terms. One can only question the motives of such people.

[WildEyedLiberal]

14. I actually didn't like the article

WAY too much RW spin in there and they take at face value the lies Rove threw at him.

..."cemented his reputation as a flip-flopper..." because Rove had decided that that would be the smear of choice, and the media eagerly assented.

However, there is unfortunately something to the idea that a lot of Dems are ready for a "new face" because I hear that all the time. I think it's a stupid position to take and one that enables them to ignore the reality of the media-Rove character assassination of Kerry - by placing all the blame on Kerry's perceived inadequacies, they can fool themselves into thinking that some "new face" would be immune to the RW spin machine. Which is, of course, a complete fantasy. Our job is to demolish that kind of thinking and show that no Democrat is a "magic bullet" that will penetrate the web of lies the RW weaves, so our best bet is to go with someone who a) is an excellent statesmen with great ideas - aka, would actually make a good PRESIDENT, and b) knows the depths to which the RW will go in their smears and knows how to combat it. Kerry is the only candidate for my money who fulfills both a and b.

I think it's abundantly obvious that the majority of that thread is comprised of trolls. Of course, if Kerry truly were so irrelevant and unpopular among Dems as that article suggests, trolls wouldn't feel the need to smear him constantly. There's a reason you never see anti-Kucinich trolls, for example - and that's nothing against Kucinich.

[TayTay]

15. It is what it is. Life is unfair; politics doubly so.

This is the wall that must be scaled. There is no other way that to have at it and do your best.

[karynnj]

23. Also it's absolutely in line with your comment

that the goal is to be one of the approximately 5 serious candidates in one of the 2 parties - here this is part of what will be a series on the 10 likely candidates. So, nearly 2 yrs after 2004, Kerry is in that group - inspite of the party and media wanting him to go away.

[TayTay]

24. Sen. Kerry is one of the 5 people on the Dem side

who could run a credible campaign for President. (again.)

I am in the mood to indulge my wonky side. Please go to this site and check out these numbers:
http://desmoinesregister.com/extras/politics/caucus2004/countyresults.html

This spreadsheet shows the vote count from the 2004 Iowa Democratic Caucus. Now consider this: the 2000 US Census gives Iowa a population of 2,926,324, according to figures on Wikipedia at: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iowa#Demographics . 122193 people showed up to vote at the Iowa caucuses, which, if I do the math correctly mean 0.041756484% of the total population showed up to vote. Hmmmmmm.

This was the result of the 2004 Iowa race:

2004
Candidate Delegate Strength
John Kerry 37.6%
John Edwards 31.9%
Howard Dean 18%
Dick Gephardt 10.6%
Dennis Kucinich 1.3%
Wesley Clark .1%
Uncommitted .1%
Joe Lieberman 0%
Al Sharpton 0%

Source: http://desmoinesregister.com/extras/politics/caucus2004/pastresults.html

Hmmm, so John Kerry actually convinced around 43,000 people to show up in Iowa and vote for him. Hmmmm, 43,000 people voted and started a steamroller through the other primaries. 43,000 people (give or take a thousand or so.) Not 280,000,000, but 43,000. Somehow, I think that can be done again. (Okay, I'm crazy, right?)

[wisteria]

20. I wasn't totally repulsed by the article, but I agree with you on your

points. I would however, like to challenge Cook on his comments that Kerry has the highest negatives of all candidates. I just don't see that. Sure he has those who blame him for everything that went wrong, but I would suggest Hillary receives a much higher negative. And, some of the other people running are not even known, so how could anyone have honest opinions on them?

[WildEyedLiberal]

16. Oh FYI on the Charlie Cook commentary in that article:

"(Crashing the Gates) is one of the two best books I've read in years about the Democratic Party, its myriad problems and challenges" -- Charlie Cook, National Journal

from the DailyKos main page.

Crashing the Gates, of course, being the mercenary Markos and Jerome show's factually-challenged take on the 2004 primaries, which of course reflects their economic investment in the Dean campaign and their eternal hatred of John Kerry for making their lucrative jobs irrelevant.

[wisteria]

21. Oh, so Cook's suggestion that Kerry receives the highest negatives

is based on questionable polling. I didn't agree with his assessment anyway and this just confirms it for me. I'll blow him off as full of it.

[ProSense]

22. There is a new

thread in GD about the a new group funded by the swift liars, evidently they got caught making a call on behalf of a Repub Rep.

[politicasista]

25. It's never too late for anyone but Kerry

The double standard really sucks. :banghead: :puke:

[TayTay]

26. This too shall pass

It has to be gone through. There is no other way.

[politicasista]

27. Yep.

And as you said, you get them one by one or one at at time.

[Democrafty]

28. Or they'll get over it.

Because they'll have to. If he's the best we've got*, he's the best we've got.

*which he is!

[ProSense]

29. Oh, but

they worked their asses off for Kerry, even though they sensed he didn't want to win and was going to throw the race! Besides, he didn't fight the election results!

:crazy:

[Democrafty]

30. Oh, RIGHT.

*forehead smack*

How could I have forgotten?

[TayTay]

31. The S&B magic voodoo powder of forgetfulness kicked in

and affected your memory. The Skull & Bones magic is all-powerful and makes people do oogly things.

Seriously, ahm, they just have to get through it. Who are the progressives going to back that has a realistic chance?

[ProSense]

32. Remedy

[Democrafty]

33. I think it was actually my blog buzz from TDD today.

And for that, I make no apologies.

Exactly. John Kerry can inspire people like crazy if they let him.

[politicasista]

34. Time to...

hide pro-Kerry threads now. Which is really a shame. :-( :hide:

[wisteria]

35. I wouldn't hide any Pro- Kerry threads. Let them get it out of their

systems. Sooner or later they will get tired of hearing themselves repeat the same old Bulls*t.
Mostly, I enter the negative threats to post something positive and not something they can challenge, like I supported Kerry before and I would gladly support him again- I think we need someone like him now. Then I don't stick around any longer. At least, if someone just happens to read the post, they will at least see some positives and not all negatives.