The Lords Prayer in the original Aramaic

[LaurenG]

I found this very interesting. The version most of us were taught is flashed first and then the version translated from the original.

Elizabeth A. Reed co-created this with Neil Douglas-Klotz


http://www.selfhealingexpressions.com/lords_prayer.html

[Crowdance]

1. Very, very lovely!

The prayer we have today is lifeless compared to the translation directly from aramaic. The original is beautiful, a recognition that we are all one, and cherishing what we are when we come together. Thank you for sharing this.

[I Have A Dream]

2. I'm glad to have watched this. Thanks, OB! n/t

[MorningGlow]

3. Yowza that's different!

I really love the original!! Amazing what a translation can do to intent. I'm reading Misquoting Jesus right now, so this fits incredibly well--but so far the book is only dealing with errors and "adjustments" among Hebrew, Greek, and Latin translations. I wonder what the bible originally said in Aramaic now...isn't there a book that's a direct Aramaic-to-English translation of the bible? I'd like to find that.

[mntleo2]

4. From What I Understand ...

...there never was such a thing, the Old Testament was in Hebrew and the new testament was not gathered up and codified until almost 4 centuries after Jesus' time, which by that time was mostly in Latin and Greek. Another thing to read that is sometimes strange, other times wonderful is The Apostolic Fathers, which is a collection of books rejected from the Bible. It is online and if you google "The Apostolic Fathers" you can find them to read free.

One time I spent two years reading the Bible cover to cover. It took me that long because I was always going off on some tangent because of questions I had about the text. I read books on plant life, ancient cultures (Mesopotamian, Northern African, Greek, Egyptian), and tried my best to make what I could of it. I learned stuff as I went, like reading the original notes of Woolley (they were just on the shelf at the library from the late 1800s 30 years ago!) written from his layer by layer excavation of the city of Ur (in Iraq) to the plant life of the middle east. The plant life came because as I read the story of Rachael's son giving Leah some mandrake he had, I did not know why it was even in the Bible and further why it became an argument between the two sisters, and I didn't know what mandarake was, and I still don't quite understand it all, lol. It did indicate to me Jacob was probably a magi and he was taking it for insight as well as it was considered an aphrodisiac, which Leah had 12 sons and did not need to get more children, while Rachael only had two sons and tho she was the one that was loved, perhaps she was mad because she thought her prolific sister had enough children and it was her turn (my theory and not a very formally educated one).

I then read the New Testament from the Greek with a Greek friend who tried to translate as we went along, tho she said it was like us reading Chaucer's English, it was so archaic. We were often asking questions of her Greek Orthodox priest and me of my minister, who was a former priest who had spent 20 years of his life in the Holy Lands as an archeologist and linguist.

I tell you it was some of the most enlightening and educational time I spent in my life and it was a wonderful way to explore my own faith as well as others' faith. I learnt that the old cultures were rife with the mystical and had much to say about the metaphysical.

BTW I had trouble getting the site linked to come up, it never did. So I wonder what you all saw. I will try again after I reboot, I have DSL but it is the slow kind and not much better than 56k, lol.

Love
Cat In Seattle

[I Have A Dream]

7. It's a Macromedia Flash animation.

I'll try to get the text and post it.

[I Have A Dream]

8. The text is copyrighted, so I'll PM it to you rather than post it.

(OhioBlues gave it to me.)

[MorningGlow]

10. Really?!

Now that's interesting! And just goes to show you how complete my Catholic education was--not! Or maybe I just wasn't listening, born pagan that I am! :rofl:

I just read in Misquoting Jesus that part of the problem with the bible stories is that they were written down from the oral tradition. So...did those stories start out in Aramaic orally, and then go to Hebrew, and on down the line? I remember reading something somewhere (very accurate of me, no?) that Aramaic was in the mix somehow...

In any case, your informal studies were quite a challenge! You have my undying respect for the vastness of the task! Really interesting anecdotes--please share more of what you discovered if you have some time. The topic of the mystical in the bible is always fascinating. :hi:

[mntleo2]

15. They Went From Aramic to Latin to Greek Mostly

These letters and accounts were copied and passed around from church to church and in that area there were lots of languages so the tranlations were often "corrupted" with a scribe trying to translate into another language to his own or vice versa.

One interesting story: Did you know the apostle Thomas began a church in Eastern India? It is still in existance today and one of the oldest continuing churches in the world. When the Portuguese invaded India in the 1500's they burned the church and all its documents because they did not believe it was a real Christian church. See the church had no statues or art in the sanctuary because they, for all those centuries, followed the Jewish traditions from what Thomas had come and the way he taught. One of the sad things about that was, the church had an original letter from Thomas himself in the church that was destroyed in the fire.

Goes to show you the more ignorant we are of our heritage, the more corrupt it gets over time, if we do not try to read and learn writings from their original cultural context. IMO.

Love
Cat

[Why Syzygy]

5. all I get on that link

is a black page. Can someone paste?

[I Have A Dream]

6. It's a Macromedia Flash animation, so it can't just be copied.

I'll try to get the text and post it.

[I Have A Dream]

9. The text is copyrighted, so I'll PM it to you rather than post it.

(Thanks to OhioBlues who gave it to me.)

[Matariki]

11. hey, could you send it to me to?

pretty please?

[I Have A Dream]

12. Sure -- will do. n/t

[Why Syzygy]

16. Thanks ...

got it. I have that problem with xp and macromedia.. Have been to all the tech sites and there seems to be no solution. ugha .. nice prayer though.... Thank you!

[Matariki]

13. That's a nice translation

from a scholarly point of view, I wonder about the accuracy though. It strikes me as a bit modern or 'new-agey'. That's not to dismiss it, I would just like to know if it's a historical translation or a modern interpretation.

The review from the Library Journal (on Amazon) is quite critical of this book. Would like to see what other Sufi scholars have to say about it.

[Matariki]

14. a link for those interested

a whole bunch of links about translation of the bible and so forth, including the text in question - http://www.squidoo.com/abwun/