It worked, and it worked well. The "hate the Dean supporter" thing.

[madfloridian]

and it did work well in that thread...the Dean supporter thing, that is...it will be used constantly here. Apparently I have been singled out in the why do you hate Dean thread as one of the worst troublemakers...by several.

I don't want to hurt the rest of you, and I feel that this board is going to become uncomfortable for us now. There are several reasons for my feeling of discomfort.....but I don't want to say it out loud. It is up to you guys for a while how to handle things..

I am backing off, as I told a couple of folks privately. I thought I could make a difference in bringing out some things about the party's corporate influence....and what is coming in the future. No matter what I post now, it is turned into something else.

I do not regret that post about Dean's comments in his book. Those things needed to be said, and they needed to be said urgently...and now. But that thread was the turning point, even though it has been in the news since September 9. I am glad Dean brought out the way our party went along for the ride, but you know that river in Egypt?....it is so easy to stand beside.

But once a meme is established, it can used successfully. I can see now that anything I post about Howard Dean...like his statements last week at Yale or Dartmouth or Northwestern....will be turned around as bashing the party. I don't want to hurt the rest of you. I have been singled out now as a main offender.

I will work on other projects elsewhere on the internet and of course locally here.

We support Howard Dean, we don't worship him. We see him as a catalyst, and at a vital turning point in our party's history. We are glad he is not afraid to be criticized, and we have learned to be that way as well. We are not afraid to speak out here to the DEC which for so long has been catering to the every whim of the GOP.

I will be reading the forum, I am active at other forums under other names.....but for a little while anyway, I don't want to be here to be blamed for the possible problems that might come.

I saw more in that post today than dislike for one person or for a group of people. I saw an intense drive to belittle, and it scared me to death. It is part of the tactics of the GOP...belittle, humiliate.

I just don't want the attacks to be about me. We are only with DFA now basically, donate only to them. Whether we ever again become active in the DNC is up to them.

I won't post about Dean events here for a while. Not worth it. If he says something I am really impressed with, I will post it at the board whose name can not be spoken.

Hang in there...I will just do nothing to hurt Dean or us.

[WI_DEM]

1. Don't let the bastards get you down

It is a relatively few people. Your posts are always informative about Dean and his activities. You don't do anything disruptive. Don't let a few extreme partisans get to you.

[madfloridian]

2. I think you are wrong that it is just a few.

I think there are a lot, with more chiming in now. It is more than just "not liking" us. It is different now. I am surprised that so many Kucinich folks chimed in so angrily at me. I never said a word about him, always liked him, really did. Shocked me.

And their Progressive Democrats of America group is joining DFA at Meet ups this week. I hope the anger does not carry over there. I have not seen this anger before, so I guess I must be doing something very wrong.

Please do not downplay what is going on in that thread, please don't. It is significant, it is telling for the future of the board and for us if we are not careful.

[Capn Sunshine]

3. By the same token, don't over play what's going on there MF

I'm not sure what you think DU is , but it's hardly representative of ANYTHING mainstream or real world. In your meetings, don't take all the DU baggage with you ; most have NO idea about DU, or have even heard of it.

What goes on here is meaningless by and large,unless you want to imbue more into it.

Just keep at it MF, and don't pay any attention to a buch of folks who are comparable to a crowd at a 7-11 in Nova Scotia , and that is about how much effect they have.

[madfloridian]

4. I know a little better than that. Give me credit for some intelligence.

I am sorry, I don't know about your area....but we have to have attitude to survive here among all the Republicans...the Democrat Republicans and the Republican Republicans in our district...both are essentially the same.

One reason I am backing off here is because I sense tension from fellow DFAers. I have never sensed that before and it bothers me greatly.

I wonder if it is because we are all trying to be proper? Are we going to be good at that? Are we being good so Howard Dean has a future in the party? Would he want that?

Something is ahappening here.....I am assuming it is me when I sense the tension among my buddies. That or something else.

Oh, well. Love you guys. I will be good. Oh, Capn, DU sounds about like our local Democrats now. We are going to back away from a lot of issues or have a party break-up. It is tense.

I don't need to feel the tension here as well, so I will just read and post here occasionally and at the other places under various names.

[BurtWorm]

5. DU would be much impoverished without you, madfloridian.

I, for one, greatly appreciate your presence here, your posts and your keeping the faith.

I don't think we need to "be good." That's gotten us nothing in the recent past. It's not likely to get us anything in the future either. I think democrats are going to have to save the Democrats in spite of themselves.

[FarLeftRage]

6. If it is any consolation

I have almost, if not all of those sh*tters who express their ignorant and vile hatred of Howard and his supporters on my ignore list.

Sooner or later those who are put on my ignore list are eventually banned from DU...

[ScreamingMeemie]

7. mad, you were one of the more high profile posters with regard to Gov.

Dean, hence the feeling that you alone are being attacked. But, truth is, all of us have felt the sting of those who are frightened of Dean and his agenda for change. You have just done a better job of advertising for him than most of us. Keep your chin up, we need you.

[madfloridian]

8. I don't mind fair criticism. Too much attacking goes on here.

It is very sad, and it is making us look bad. I am posting other places a lot now...and since it looks like I am about the only one posting much in here....I may post elsewhere more.

I am discovering some old friends at other forums who just plain avoid it here.

I know all get attacked, but I guess I just had enough. I leave the other forums to them.

I can not see the trending to the right anymore. Can't take it. That is why I am so excited about our DFA leader here getting State Committeewoman. And 3 others. We will make change somewhere, but I think that some forums are way too right moving for me.

I hope I am wrong.

[Fleurs du Mal]

9. In these times

I'm afraid you're going to have to fight for your beliefs like everyone else. It's really pretty simple: not everyone agrees he's good for the party. It's up to those who do to convince the others.

As for the board being "uncomfortable", internet forums are virtually all abrasive at times, especially if you want to mix it up with a broader progressive crowd. The DFA forums are less antagonistic but quite a bit less active and diverse. There's always a choice.

The burden of proof remains with the DFA.

[madfloridian]

10. You totally missed my point. And burden of proof is with DNC/DLC.

I posted this days ago, about a certain thread. You are not aware of what I am saying at all.

Actually, my friend, the groups that must prove themselves to me are the DNC and the DLC...

The DFA blog is not that active, you are right. But guess what...my friend, 4 of the 7 DEC offices in our area, a very conservative area, were filled by Dean supporters.

The blog is not busy because it is a pain in the neck, slow and hard to navigate...done on the cheap.

[Fleurs du Mal]

11. As a matter of fact

I am most aware of that thread. There are lots of groups right now vying for control of the dem party. If you think it's going to be given to one person or group without a fight, some harsh words, and hurt feelings, I think you're in for a surprise.

Quite simply the DFA is young and hasn't proven to people that it is what it claims: the best future of the progressive movement. Goes without saying that the DNC clearly has some 'splaining to do and if it doesn't it will simply lose members. The DLC well...not much proving to be done there.

I was referring to the forums, not the blog, my friend.

[madfloridian]

12. Oh, it is going to get ugly. You have no idea.

Groups are meeting here in our area, totally dissatisfied with Florida's party leadership...it is not going to be nice very long at all.

I think you know what I meant. I need to be careful how I say it. If I say it wrong, I could be gone as many other Dean people are. And let's face it, they are gone...

You will just have to read between the lines. I posted in open forum today, and I was glad to see David Jones admit they did the 527 ad to bring Dean down. Glad it was said on C-Span, but folks are still in denial.

Just read between the lines.

[NoPasaran]

13. The DLC doesn't need to do any more proving to me

I am convinced that they have a time-tested formula for losing elections and steadily shrinking the appeal of the Democratic Party. Even with plenty of money, a united party and an unprecedented volunteer effort in 2004 their designated stiff still managed to lose to the worst President in history with nothing on his resume but four years of failure in every category both foreign and domestic. I admit it---these guys are the champs!