Bread machines

[Duer 157099]

I think I've gone off the deep end now. I got a bread machine! Well, to be fair, it wasn't my plan, but I was at a thrift store and it looked brand new and it was only $3 so what choice did I have?

However, it didn't have instructions, and having never owned a bread machine, and being new to bread (pizza, actually) altogether, I'm not even sure what they're supposed to do or how they work. By looking at the controls, you can choose about 8 different settings, for different bread types, and one of the settings is called "dough" which I took to mean it kneads the dough and lets it rise (and then you take it out and use it for pizza).

So, I decided to try it, put all the ingredients in the pan, turned it to dough and let it go. The default time setting for "dough" was 1 hour 20 minutes -- I figured that includes kneading and rising. After 18 minutes, it was still kneading, so I got a little worried.

I know for pizza dough, you usually just knead for 5-10 minutes.

So, .. anyone know what's up? Is this normal for machines to knead for so long? I don't know how long it would have continued kneading, possibly for the whole hour plus?

Also, what's the state of this 18-minute kneaded pizza dough now? will it be tough? It's the Cook's Illustrated recipe using cake flour and AP.

I looked all over the net for the manual, it's not out there (except maybe on ebay)

[SoCalDem]

1. what's the brand and model?

I'll find you a manual :)

[Duer 157099]

4. Really?? It's just like this one:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Red-Star-Breadmaker-ES-100-EUC-White_W0QQitemZ4469716447QQihZ001QQcategoryZ20669QQssPageNameZWD1VQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Red Star ES100 (I think Red Star is now Magic Chef)

Thanks!

[SoCalDem]

7. There are several links here where you might be able

to get a manual.. you might be able to download one.. I have also written to the manufacturer on occasion, and they have sent me manuals for appliances :)..free :)

http://www.bread-maker.net/

[Warpy]

2. Well, the cake flour should keep it from getting too tough and stringy

The longer kneading time may compensate for the fact that the kneading may be less efficient than either hands or stand mixers. I've never investigated the innards, but I do know most rely on paddles on the bottom to do the job of mixing and kneading.

Maybe your best bet would be to use some prepackaged "bread machine mix" that's premeasured and ready to dump in with the requisite amount of water.

Another thing you might do is check out the manufacturer online, see if they've got a FAQ section or even the manual printed online.

I'm the orignial hand made bread snob, but if I had counter room, I might consider one with a timer just to wake up to fresh bread in the morning.

[Duer 157099]

5. I thought I was going to be a hand made bread snob too

But being a novice and all, I was never sure if I was kneading too much or not enough, and then sometimes I would decide to not make bread because I didn't want to get all messy, etc. So, when I saw this for 3 bucks, I figured I'd try it out. I still haven't tried out the baking part. Soon.

And yes, they are huge, part of the reason I never wanted one.

The pizza turned out ok tonight, so I guess it wasn't over kneaded.

[Warpy]

10. For 3 bucks you can't go wrong

not even if the heating element is partially or totally burnt out. If it kneads, you've just bought a $3.00 skivvy.

I know what you mean about not wanting to get messy. I got a Kitchen Aid as compensation for arthritic hands. I don't have to get messy any more to get bread.

I do miss the physical fun of watching a mass of sticky, nasty dough turn into a smooth, elastic bread dough.

[politicat]

3. Bread machines usually do have a longer kneading cycle.

The beater bar in a bread machine is about 4 square inches total. When manually kneading, you've got about 20 square inches - both hands and boards. That totally changes the mechanical dynamics of a bread machine versus hand kneading.

What model?

[Duer 157099]

6. I was watching it do it's thing and was pretty impressed

at how well it was kneading for such a tiny blade. I thought that it was actually more efficient than manually.

[wildeyed]

8. I think mine kneads for a longer time, at least at first.

It takes a while to get all the ingredients mixed. I don't know how long, though. Try a new batch, then just let it go to see how it turns out.

[Lars39]

9. I have a Westbend breadmaker that makes a horizontal loaf.

The kneading times range between 28-33 minutes, depending on size of loaf(1 1/2lb or 2lb)and type of bread being made(basic or whole wheat).

[housewolf]

11. Bread Machine Kneading

The dough cycle for the machine I have (an old Zojirisi) runs about 1 hr 30, with the rising phase being only about the last 35 minutes or so. It goes through a pre-heating phase, a first knead, rest period, 2nd knead, and then the rise. The 2 kneads together with the intermediate rest is about 40 minutes or so.

Since you don't have the manual for the machine, here's a site that will give you some help
http://www.breadmachinedigest.com/">Bread Machine Digest

The Bread Machine Digest has been a great online source for 10 years now, the owner really knows his stuff!

[eleny]

12. Now you're making me want to drag out my old machine!

It's getting that time of year. We've had a plunge in temps and it's socked in cloudy here. Time to dig out the cookbook for it and make a plan.

Mine has a long knead cycle, too. I figure it's best for bread. If your pizza dough is a miss instead of a hit, you can at least use that cycle for rolls. At $3. you scored big time. Congrats!

[hvn_nbr_2]

13. On my machine, the knead time varies

The knead time varies, even for the same cycle and same recipe. I think it has some sort of sensor that tells it when the kneading is done. When I was using mine regularly, I could watch the dough and could tell by its appearance how soon the kneading would be done.

I could also tell in advance, based on the recipe, that a knead cycle was likely to be longer. If I made a recipe with some added ingredients so the loaf size was a little larger, the knead time would be longer. Also if it was gettng near the end of the knead and I didn't like the appearance of it, if I added a teaspoon or two of water, it would then prolong the knead cycle to work the extra water into the loaf. (When the kneading is finished, the dough ball should have a smooth and slightly glistening appearance. If the the surface is rough and jagged, it probably needs a little more water.)

Since everything about the machine--kneading mechanism and cycle, bake temperature and time--is designed for a specific size loaf (Newer models may be more sophisticated that way), if you didn't have the right amount of ingredients for that machine's optimal loaf, then it might have been trying to knead it for a long time to get it "right." If you can determine the right size loaf for the machine you got, there are lots of books and online sources for recipes with the right proportions of ingredients. I sort of vaguely seem to remember that the proportions for a machine are not quite the same as for making it by hand, but my memory isn't clear on that--I haven't been using the machine for quite awhile.