3 Earth Mass Exoplanet Discovered

[FogerRox]

The li'l planet — weighing in at three times Earth's mass ­— grabs the lightweight title from a five Earth-mass planet just announced in April.


http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/080602-aas-tiny-planet.html


The planet orbits its host star at about the same distance as Venus orbits the sun. But the new planet's host star is likely between 3,000 and 1 million times fainter than the sun, so the top of the planet's atmosphere is probably colder than Pluto.

The astrophysicists suggest the tiny planet supports a thick atmosphere, which along with possible interior heating by radioactive decay, could make the surface as balmy as that of Earth. (And theory suggests the surface may be completely covered by a deep ocean.)

The star-planet system was found using a technique called gravitational microlensing, in which light from the planet is bent and magnified by the gravity of a foreground object, such as a star. It marks the seventh planet to date discovered using this method.

[autorank]

1. Here's the question

Is it one of those deals where we're expected for find an exact replica of "FogerRox" and "autorank"
out there?

:shrug: Serioiusly? :shrug:

[FogerRox]

3. My replica is on Ganymede, its rollin a big blunt

If Ganymede were not bound to Jupiter, it would be considered a planet in its own right. It is actually bigger than Mercury,

[Occulus]

6. I didn't know that. Wow.

I wonder what conversations will be had if/when we find a truly Earthlike planet within 100 light years of our sun. If you accelerated a spacecraft to an appreciable fraction of the speed of light, it would be possible to get there, given a few generations living in space.

By the way- is there any new news regarding WB-7? I've been reading talk-polywell for a while now, and about all I know about what's going on is, they have some interesting data, and they're presenting for review hopefully by the end of the summer.

Have you heard anything else?

[FogerRox]

18. Excellent. Dr Nebel is leaning towards advocating for 100mw proof of concept

There are some legit questions like well shape. Rider assumed a square well, Chacon a parabolic well. Is it possible a square well leads to more brem loses ? It certainly appears so. Does the shape of the well effect carburetor design ?

Bussard wanted to build a truncated dodecahedron to see if there are any advantages over the trunc cube. On the scale of WB-7, a trunc dodec can be built fairly cheaply, and may give us insight to optimizing the Polywell design.

Another important issue is power scaling, double the size of the device you should get 128x output according to Bussards theory. A 70cm pulse mode WB would settle this issue with very little money...3-4 million.

Dr Nebel has hinted he wants to ahead with a pulse mode 100mw net power device. I'm glad he is that excited, maybe hes right. But for 15-20 million these 2 designs are not a bad deal:

quote:
Originally posted by Roger Fox:
1)WB-8, 35cm LN2/carburetor/steady state
2)WB-9, 70cm pulse mode



On the other hand, after WB-7, if the ONR wants to fund Nebel for a 1.8 meter 100mw pulse mode device, sure, great. If it works its a a game breaker.

On the other hand a 35cm LN2 cooled WB-8 can explore PB-11 fusion. Proof of PB-11 fusion is a game breaker IMHO, certainly worth the 10 or 15 million.

[Occulus]

22. I would think they would want the well to be as 'spherical' as possible

After all, we're trying to mimic nature, here, and stars are big balls of gas. After all, we don't see toroidal square stars for a reason. ;)

Perhaps saddle-shaped coils that lie on the surface of a 'virtual sphere' would be something to look into? Hah- try building one of those! Just thinking out loud here... (do the each of coils have to be a perfect torus? And I'm assuming that the more precise the shape, the 'better' the resulting field... or is the shape of the well the really important part?)

It occurs to me that lots of smaller coils/cusps might not be a bad thing at all. And you're right; it would be cheaper and easier to build several smaller coils than a few really big ones.

Nebel is that enthused by the data they're getting? :wow: Just the fact that he's willing to mention building a full-size device that generates net power is more than I expected to hear from him at this point.

Also- does the Obama campaign know about this project? If it works, it would completely trump- well, everything else.

[FogerRox]

24. They are all spherical

I thought these 3 should be built simultaneously

1)WB-8, 35cm LN2/carburetor/steady state
2)WB-9, 70cm pulse mode
3) WB-10, 35 cm truncated dodecahedron

Bussard thought the truncated dodecahedron might be better than the truncated cube of WB-6. Reason, the cusps are smaller, the triangular corners of the "cube". THe electrons would have a tougher time escaping, in essence, the electron gyro radius is the same, the little spiral the electron makes as it travels, while the cusps are smaller in the truncated dodec.




truncated dodecahedron

Just thinking out loud here... (do the each of coils have to be a perfect torus?

Good thought, a perfect torus, maybe not.



Lets squeeze it, and the cusps are even smaller now. Since Polywell recirculates the electrons, this sort of thinking is no longer paramount. But ya never know, and for 3 million, why not build one to see what the difference in performance might be.

or is the shape of the well the really important part?)

Yes bigtime.

Todd Riders masters thesis says IEC/Polywell cant go to net power, because of maxwellian thermalization. THis was based on a square well, like at the bottom of this graphic



This means a wide well, not good for Ion focus, as the ions will see a wide target, as they fall to the center. A Parabolic well coaxes the ions to a smaller target, a spiked well would really focus the ions to a single point. Bussard had been working to get a parabolic well as far as I know. Lots of things about polywell seem to be compromises between many factors/issues, in this case we have a square well at one end, at the other a spiked well, and in between the parabolic well.

Nebel is that enthused by the data they're getting? :wow: Just the fact that he's willing to mention building a full-size device that generates net power is more than I expected to hear from him at this point.

I had read Nebels comments about going for the 100mw net power size, but it took a week to sink in. He said hes getting data.
Due to the publishing embargo we knew he couldn't tell us WHAT DATA. (neutron counts)

TallDave

so a machine about 1.5M in diameter would in theory be able to produce something around 100MW of net power."

Dr Nebel

Our contention is that since our projections for a power producing device only require a machine like the one TallDave described, we might as well build the next one in that size range and accept the risk.
---
http://www.newmars.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=5395&p=111617

But even though Nebel can't yet talk about the data, he's proud that he and his colleagues at Emc2 have gotten so far so quickly.

"By God, we built a laboratory and an experiment in nine months," he said, "and we're getting data out of it."

http://cosmiclog.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/06/12/1136887.aspx?p

Also- does the Obama campaign know about this project? If it works, it would completely trump- well, everything else.

I have an in at Senator Menendez's office (NJ-D) as well as Launtenberg, they will get info packs this month. And I may have an opportunity to get a few minutes with Obama later in the year during a campaign stpo here in NJ. AS well as Rush Holt and a few other Congressmen from NJ. All my campaign work might have some side benefits. LOL.

[autorank]

8. So Ganymede is like Canada?

You know they changed the national anthem from "Oh Canada" to "Wow ... Canada"

If exact replicas of FogerRox and autorank exist, then who are you and who am I?

[hootinholler]

13. I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together!

-The Walrus

[autorank]

14. Thanks. Question answered

:toast:

[hootinholler]

15. There's no metaphysical question that can't be answered by quoting either

Monty Python or The Beatles.

-Hoot

[autorank]

16. Now that I know that

I'll be in touch on the "big picture" questions;)

[FogerRox]

17. We are prototypes. Replicas are just copies, no biggie.

[stevedeshazer]

12. LOL!

Wonder if oil is there. The neocons could use a new home.

[MannyGoldstein]

2. It's So Amazing

The resolution with which we can view far-away objects is getting so incredible. I expect that in the next 25-50 years we'll be able to observe evidence of life on another planet, perhaps something like the Great Wall of China.

[FogerRox]

4. Dr Bussards QED fusion engine could be used to power a ship w/telescope

out to the point where the telescope could look back at the sun, and use it too micro lense..


The star-planet system was found using a technique called gravitational microlensing, in which light from the planet is bent and magnified by the gravity of a foreground object

[progdonkey]

5. wouldn't that be the life that was there hundreds of thousands of years ago?

I don't think it's even physically possible for a camera to see to that resolution (don't quote me on that, though), but if it were, wouldn't you be looking into the past? How weird would that be? Watching tiny little alien spaceships flying around but knowing that that was actually one million years ago, or whatever. :yoiks:

[Occulus]

7. LOL- it would be cool indeed

I don't think it's even possible, due to distortions caused by interstellar dust and whatnot, but it would be very interesting- the ultimate reality show.

"Crap, Martha. The Googlians are preparing a war against the Furlings. Again."
"Oh, Bill, you and that show. I just don't know what you see in it."
"...But it's real."
"It's just one of those reality shows, Bill."
"....DUH!??!"

:silly:

[FogerRox]

19. This new planet was found thru gravitational micro lensing

We've also seen many galaxies thru gravitational micro lensing. If we could move the Hubble tommorrow, to the right spot, it could use the sun to gravitational micro lens.

[Occulus]

23. Congratulations, Foger

You just devised NASA's next telescope.

The Sol Microlensing Array.

Now... how do we move it around the sun? Solar sails?

.....a fusion-powered engine, perhaps?

:D

[immoderate]

9. It's all relative.

--IMM

[FogerRox]

20. "It's a relative." Keep my family out of this.....

[electropop]

11. It's 3,000 light years away, so we see it as it was 3,000 years ago.

However, I doubt we'll ever build telescopes powerful enough to resolve a spacecraft at 1 light year, let alone 3,000.

[electropop]

10. As techniques and equipment improve, they find planets more and more similar to Earth.

I'm confident that in the next 10-15 years, they'll find strong evidence for a planet with liquid water and signs of life (e.g. oxygen atmosphere).

[FogerRox]

21. Yes, I think so.

[Karl_Bonner_1982]

25. I wonder what's the biggest terrestrial type planet that can exist?

I have long wondered what planets would look like that are bigger than Earth but smaller than Uranus or Neptune. I wonder what the cutoff is from terrestrial to gas planets? Or is this based more on temperature (distance from the star) rather than mass? Are there any planets that are kind of terrestrial but kind of gassy too? Like a very thick liquefied atmosphere over a mostly mineral interior? Lots of questions remain unanswered.

[TheMadMonk]

26. One slight problem with people's solar microlensing ideas.

They've got it backwards.

What was seen is the gravitational effect of the planet on the light of the star. Or of the planet+star combination on a star in the background.