The ( nearly complete ) de-Lesbianization of Rachel Maddow.

[Smarmie Doofus]

http://personals.nydailynews.com/entertainment/tv/2008/10/30/2008-10-30_rachel_maddow_is_msnbcs_prime_time_star.html


Yes, there's a quickie reference to partner Susan waaaayyyy at the end ( Item 4 in "5 reasons I'm a Real New Yorker" sidebar.) Until then I thought that going mainstream was some kind of devil's bargain for RM ( of whom I'm a big fan, BTW.)

I remember her when she subbed on early Air America and some progressive listeners called into complain to other talk jocks that Rachel would actually talk about "gay stuff." Now she's mainstream , but the gay part seems to have been... well I was gonna say 'closeted', but lets just say "scuttled temporarily".

Ok, I'm not complaining; price of going mainstream and all. I *want* people to hear and see her. Still....it would be nice if that, i.e. the scuttling, weren't necessary.

Interesting, if superficial, profile in any case.


Rachel Maddow is MSNBC's prime time star

By LEAH CHERNIKOFF

Thursday, October 30th 2008, 4:00 AM

Rachel Maddow

An instant hit since she broke onto the cable news scene in September, Rachel Maddow has helped catapult MSNBC ahead of CNN in prime-time ratings this past month. Now she's slated to co-anchor the network's Election Night coverage. Here, Maddow, who splits her time between New York and Massachusetts, dishes on makeovers, Manhattan and newfound fame.

How are you preparing for your election all-nighters?

I try to avoid sugar, so as to avoid the inevitable crash. Other than that, I just eat whatever my perpetually nervous stomach allows.

What's it like to be newly hosting a show during these uncertain and often scary times?

Fun! It's the best job I could possibly imagine. Unless there's a job like this that also comes with a bonus of six or so more hours of sleep per night.

Everyone's talking about politics and the news right now - but I've somehow ended up with a job where I get paid to try to do that well, and in public. I'm happy as a clam at high tide.

Are you getting stopped on the street yet?

Every once in a while, someone says hello or they like the show. It's nice to get into a cab when the cab driver is playing my radio show. Tip city, man.

Who is your dream guest?

Do you mean someone I could get to come into the studio with me? Well, I do have a recurring fantasy of personally beating the snot out of Osama Bin Laden - but I guess then he technically wouldn't qualify as a "guest."

Who have been your past two favorite guests?

Tony Kushner, and my weekly radio segments with Paul Rieckhoff - he's the founder of Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans of America, a New Yorker, and an all-around hunk.

There was some controversy over your makeover. Is your wardrobe picked out for you or do you get a say?

No one picks out anything for me - are you kidding? You think it would be worth paying someone to choose for me between my eight different, nearly identical, dark gray suits?

And I didn't actually have a makeover - I just stopped fighting the makeup pros once I realized that my resistance to them was making me look like Nixon to everyone else's Kennedy.

Any tips for keeping your cool with heated guests?

Pretend it's just you and your conscience. All the rest is just a peanut gallery. When I get overwhelmed or frustrated on the TV show set, my friend Kent Jones does a really funny turkey noise that makes me happy every time.

Five reasons I'm a real New Yorker

1. I know the kitchen at Daddy-O is open till 4 a.m. Because I need to know that.

2. You can buy Old Charter bourbon at the small but excellent liquor store right by the really good falafel cart near 27th and Madison.

3. At my news agent, the dude only charges me tax on my newspaper when I'm wearing my Red Sox hat, but I DON'T CARE — that's what it's for.

4. My closet space is so limited in our little apartment that Susan and I can only hang up one season of clothes at a time.

5. The Pegu Club bartenders sometimes let me order stuff that hasn't been on the menu since its first iteration.

"The Rachel Maddow Show" airs weeknights at 9 on MSNBC.

[Cleita]

1. IMHO the gay shouldn't matter. It's personal

and frankly no ones business. I do hope though that she's not intimidated in addressing gay when like in our Proposition 8 in California it becomes bigotry and political and should be discussed.

[Zuiderelle]

5. I'm going to agree with you on this. I actually like that they don't focus on her being gay.

She has the ratings she has and the program she has purely due to her merits as a journalist and a fine mind.

She's not in the closet and that's good enough for me. I can look past the makeup that doesn't seem quite right on her, because hey... it's TV. Everyone, I mean EVERYONE wears makeup on TV.

It's not as if she's singing "Happy Birthday" in a whispered little girl voice wearing a red dress blowing up to her thighs.

[Smarmie Doofus]

6. Hmmm. In my experience it's always *eveyone's* business.

Although not many people admit to it, at least not after age 25 or so.

Re. Prop 8: I can't picture her shying away from that in any instance either. Haven't heard her address it on radio and I don't have cable.

There's been a lot of other stuff to talk about, for sure.

[maxsolomon]

2. she's not de-lesbianized when you look at her

to this straight boy's gaydar, it's as obvious as the closeted gay on larry craig's face.

rachel represents concrete progress just as sure as obama does. don't worry so much.

[Smarmie Doofus]

8. I thought I was looking at Palin for s plit second..

Saw the article in hard copy first and it looks there like she's got a giant hoop earring.

Not that lesbians can't wear hoops but they are NEVER to look like Sarah Palin.... even for a milisecond.

NEVER, do you hear?

[The Brethren]

14. Never, ever?

I was thinking about dressing as Palin for Halloween. But then it would scare me too much if I caught a glimpse of myself in the mirror. :-) Not to worry, Palin has her own unique, demented Petticoat Junction look going on.

And after 150k worth of hair, make-up, and wardrobe, she needs to ask for a refund. LOL

[maxsolomon]

20. She's a classic boi.

she could be wearing a french maid's outfit & 4 inch stillettos & she'd still look like a leslie mclesbian from lesbos.

on edit, i'd like to see that. just to make sure. :evilgrin:

[TechBear_Seattle]

3. Personally, I think she is taking the right tact

She does not hide her being a lesbian, it is not an "open secret" like it was for many years with Rosie and Ellen and Clay. But it is not really all that relevant to her being a professional commentator of national politics, any more than Olberman's being straight is relevant. You don't see Keith yakking about heterosexual issues or playing up the fact that he has a wife, do you?

[Smarmie Doofus]

11. Don't really see much of Keith. Just on Youtube and DU videos,

>>>Olberman's being straight is relevant. You don't see Keith yakking about heterosexual issues or playing up the fact that he has a wife, do you?>>>

really. No, he's always talking about national politics... as Rachel usually is. OTOH, I think the assumption is always that,absent evidence to the contrary, the subject is STRAIGHT. Rachel *herself* made being gay an issue in her AAR incarnation.

I think it's worth noting , and perhaps meaningful ( and perhaps even to be expected)that that the old image is being shed as she moves on to a broader ( more heterosexual) audience.) How much of the shedding she's doing, how much MNBC's doing or how much the newspaper that published this profile is doing ( it's pretty conservative) remains to be sorted out.

[TechBear_Seattle]

13. She made it an issue when it was reasonably relevant

Ideally, being gay or straight shouldn't matter. To some people, moving towards that goal is seen as capitulation to the dominant meme; I'm certain that some black leaders are unhappy at Obama because he is not making his race more of an issue and using his candidacy to speak directly to the issues of African-Americans.

Maddow is no Anderson Cooper, hiding in the closet and denying every rumor. She is out, and there is no way that she can hide it. I'm inclined to say that she would fight hard against any effort to put her back in the closet. At the same time, it is not relevent to the job she has now, and to be honest, that is where it should be.

[Berry Cool]

15. Actually, Keith doesn't have a wife.

He has a girlfriend who's only half his age...and he doesn't talk about that fact a lot, in part because it's personal, and possibly because it makes him look as if he fetishizes youthful women over women more his own age.

Which I suspect he does.

But everyone has their shortcomings.

[goddess40]

32. Keith doesn't have a wife - never has

and last I heard he was dating a fetus. I don't know of any announcer that talks about their spouse or significant other.

I love Rachael and I think talking about Susan on radio, with a more targeted audience, made more sense than on a nation wide TV show.

Edit: from the Huffington Post dated March 08 - Page Six reports today that Keith Olbermann's live-in girlfriend, 24-year old Katy Tur, has been offered a news anchor position at New York station CW11: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/03/21/meet-keith-olbermanns-gi_n_92715.html

[luvspeas]

4. I loves Rachael Maddow!

Air America went kerphlooey here in Austin about a year ago. I really missed listening to Rachael Maddow. I do not have cable TV, but I have been so glad to hear that she's doing well. It's part of my awakening faith in the American people that they like her so much. She is super-smart, clever, fun, and unapologetic about who she is and what she believes. I have a great deal of difficulty believing she'd crawl into a closet for this gig. She doesn't strike me as someone who has ever been in a closet. I always loved how easily she'd talk about her partner, just normal and natural, like it should be.

IMHO-I don't think there is much informal banter and satire on CNN like there is in radio. I don't think she's closeting herself, I think she's probably just talking about the news and there isn't really place for a story about her and her partner and going to rent a DVD or going to dinner and blah blah blah, like in radio. JEEZ-if she spent a bunch of time on personal stories that nobody gave a shit about she'd be...(wait for it)...GLEN FUCKING NO BRAIN BECK!

[crikkett]

7. This is going to be a great day for you.

You can watch Rachel Maddow's show archives at MSNBC.com (her show is under the link "MSNBC TV" on the site's navbar).

You can listen to her show via the Internet at http://www.airamerica.com/listen - except that Ron Reagan is filling in for her today (right now in fact) -- actually she's on the phone w/ him now.

:cheers:

[luvspeas]

9. thanks

Yeah-I check her out online. I used to listen to her as I drove home from work. Now I only have NPR. They're OK, but RM is funnier.

[givemebackmycountry]

10. I don't care, I really don't care what Rachel does off camera...

She's a sweetheart.
I just want to hug her, and have a couple of Old Charter Bourbons with her, and talk politics and anything else she wants to talk about.

I am noted on DU as repeatedly saying that I have a thing for smart women.
Plus, I'm thinking that Rachel has got a really great set of wheels.
And I'm not talking about her pickup truck that she drives to the dump.
(That's sexy too!)

Man, am I weird or what?

[La Lioness Priyanka]

12. she has certainly been de-butched.

[crikkett]

16. I know, whoever's doing her eyeshadow needs to lighten up a bit.

Her eyes in Wed's show were darker than Ashley Todd's.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

17. its not just that. i bet she wears mens suits in her off-tv life, and she looks really

uncomfortable in women's suits and those low cut shirts.

[Ellen Forradalom]

33. I bet she'd look like a million dollars in a man's suit

I'd love to see her on the air like that.

[goodgd_yall]

34. I agree

There was a night or 2 where she appeared to be wearing less eye make-up and I liked that look better. But that's just me. She can look however she wants.

[Crowman1979]

18. Butch women like to look fabulous sometimes too, ya know!

It doesn't mean they made a straight conversion.

[gaspee]

19. No, actually, we don't

Forgive me if you are a butch lesbian, but I really don't think that's the case.

I and all of my friends are about the butchest women you'll ever meet. We do not like to be "fabulous" - in fact, it's downright uncomfortable for us to don the society approved female drag costume.

So no, we don't like to be fabulous -- in fact, I can't think of a worse torture (that I am likely to face in my day to day living.)

Or maybe we have a completely different idea on what it is to be "fabulous." Hint, it's not suits cut tightly to societal approved standards to show women's bodies, nor to have our hair and make-up done, nor is it to wear low-cut tops.

[crikkett]

21. I don't like showing cleavage either.

I feel naked and cold.

[goodgd_yall]

35. I love to look fabuous

I never thought it meant female drag. My kind of fabulous means wearing my long black evening coat and Italian boots as the fine touches.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

butch women are fabulous in their butchness, they dont have to be feminized to be fabulous

[La Lioness Priyanka]

22. butch women are fabulous in their butchness, they dont have to be feminized to be fabulous

[gaspee]

23. Exactly

That's what I was trying to say, but I think it might have come out wrong.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

24. plus butch girls get fabulous in butch ways. when lisa dresses up she wears a button down and a tie

not a cleavage exposing shirt... she leaves that for me to do :)

[gaspee]

25. Same here

Though I'm not comfortable with a tie. I like pinstripes.

My day to day wear is jeans (men's jeans fit my body type best) and at this time of year, a flannel coat over a long sleeve t-shirt or sweater. Though, where I live (New England,) lots of straight women look pretty butch at this time of year with their flannel coats and jeans and boots. Sometimes in wintertime it's kind of hard to tell a butch lesbian from a busy mom.

Short hair - check
Flannel coat - check
comfortable jeans - check
boots (the utilitarian kind, not the stylish kind) - check

what's a girl to do when straight working class moms look just like us butch women, LOL!

[goodgd_yall]

36. Lol!

The first time I visited New Hampshire---where my sister's family lives---and I was waiting at the Manchester airport, I was thinking "wow, look at all the dykes!" I realized later that many of them were straight women. Also a couple of women who migrated from Boston to California who I got to know had me fooled too!

[Moloch]

26. Maddow is a good newscaster....

who I happen to agree with all the time and puts on a great show. Can you just let her do her job or do you expect her to scream "I'M A LESBIAN" at everyone who comes on her show? Does it really matter if she's gay or not?

[Zuiderelle]

27. Yes, I would love for her to say "I'm a lesbian" just to piss you off.

The OP has a point. They have de-butched her. I happen to understand the makeup because it's TV, but now your ridiculous answer has me rethinking what I said above.

It actually DOES matter very much that she's gay. It matters very much to every gay person trying to make it in journalism. It matters to every gay person who has lost any opportunity because of the bigotry against them. It matters VERY MUCH that she is gay.

I'm glad that she's out, and not hiding it herself, even if they have de-butched her on camera. At least her butchness shows through anyway.

[Moloch]

28. As a gay person trying to make it in journalism...

I think its great that an out lesbian has her own (very successful) show on MSNBC but why should she pigeonhole herself by only talking about gay issues as the OP suggested? Unlike you, lots of gays and lesbians care about other than just GLBT issues.

[Smarmie Doofus]

29. I do NOT want her to restrict herself to talking about gay issues.

I want her to talk about EVERY issue about which she is knowledgeable...including gay issues where that's appropriate. My post targets a particular article in a particular ( extremely widely read) newspaper. I'm speculating about an entirely predictable phenomenon that one sees over and over again when any marginalized group assimilates... or tries to. That is ... the loss, or downplaying, of whatever characteristics distinguished the marginalized group to begin with.

I sense the pattern... or a variation of it... is being repeated w. RM. I'm not shocked, but I think it's instructive to observe and acknowledge.


>>>>I think its great that an out lesbian has her own (very successful) show on MSNBC but why should she pigeonhole herself by only talking about gay issues as the OP suggested? Unlike you, lots of gays and lesbians care about other than just GLBT issues>>>>>

I think it's great too. It would also be great if she can continue to be an out lesbian at the same time. Maybe she will.




Here's what I wrote in OP:
>>>Ok, I'm not complaining; price of going mainstream and all. I *want* people to hear and see her.>>>>

[Zuiderelle]

30. Where does the OP suggest that she should talk only about gay issues??

And why does everything you post end with such a dismissive, passive aggressive insult?

[The Brethren]

31. I really enjoy and respect Rachel

because of her intelligence, humor, her views, and her genuine concern about politics and what is happening. I didn't know she was gay when I first started watching her show recently. I suspected she was, but I would still very much like her whether she is gay, straight, or bi. The fact that she is also a lesbian is icing on the cake for me. :-) One of the things I like the most about Rachel is her guts to say what she thinks and needs to be said.

I don't feel Rachel's being compromised or pressured to appear as someone she's not. She's doing her job, putting herself out there, and trying to make a difference by educating people through facts and humor -- and it's working.

And if Rachel wants to discuss, or bring up, that she's a gay person -- terrific!! However, whether she ever mentions on air that she's gay or not, doesn't change a thing for me about enjoying her show or myself being gay. I'm very open about being a lesbian in my life and if that's a problem for someone in person, they can keep it to themselves unless they want to be treated with the same disrespect in return.