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kevinbgoode Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 01:52 AM
Original message
A rant about heterosupremacy
(crossposted from General Discussion)

Now ya know I just posted these comments at another site as part of a discussion about how the new governor of Wisconsin is going to try to "soften" the blow from one of those hideous heterosupremacist amendments passed by the "people" to exercise tyranny over their fellow gay citizens during this last election.

I'm not going to pretend to be understanding of the heterosexual viewpoint in this rant. Frankly, I'm rather sick and tired of seeing all of the supremacists conducting the "debate" over marriage in the pages of our newspapers, on the broadcasting outlets, and in the legistlatures - and too tired of rarely seeing much of the viewpoint of the people these stupid amendments affect published with any level of passion.

One reason we don't get to express our anger in the "mainstream media" is because the heterosexual-controlled media is wary of offending the "religiously correct." And by "religiously correct" I mean those nutcases who pass their hate and bigotry off on a selective interpretation of some rather dubious biblical verses. . .and they get away with it because the rest of us LET them get away with their hypocrisy.

There is a double standard instituted in this whole debate. On one end, the christo-fascists are free to express any contrived piece of dreamed-up junk science as justification for their positions - and when that fails, they just haul out and interpret the Bible for the rest of us as if we aren't citizens of a free country capable of forming and choosing our own religious beliefs.

But this tyranny has to end. I am sick to tears of listening to a bunch of straight people whine about how they should have the right to "vote" on whether the person I might love can make a damned health decision for me without requiring me to carry around a ridiculous file cabinet of paperwork and hope some stupid fundie in a hospital is in the mood to accept it. What the hell interest should any heterosupremacist REALLY have in the basic universal life experiences that a gay couple handles in everyday life? The point is - they DON"T. And I refuse to believe that someone with some personally chosen "deeply-held" "religious" beliefs has more invested in whether I can make my own damned funeral arrangements than I do.

We've beaten around this bush long enough - and in doing so we are on the verge of permanently alienating some 20 million of our own citizens because of our need to impose tyranny on SOMEONE other than ourselves. So what if some people don't like the idea of seeing two guys kissing? So what if some guys have a problem when they project the imagined sexual behaviors going on in the house next door where two gay guys are sleeping? Does that really warrant the ridiculous tyranny of denying the utter and basic human right to control the destiny of our lives simply because some OTHER people think we are "icky?"

Now here is what I will NEVER understand. I'm supposed to be respectful of people who consciously "choose" a "religious" belief - and then accept their right to impose that belief on others - but who I am (whether it be born or not) isn't worthy of that same respect, even though I'm supposed to live under the same damned constitutional protections as everyone else. So when we explain what the discrepancies are, the heterosupremacists trot out their "holier-than-thou" crap and scream they have to protect their "special legal rights" because everyone knows that only heterosupremacists have such universal life experiences as getting ill or dying. The rest of us are supposed to be punished by the state for encountering those moments in our life experiences - as if there is supposed to be some earthly payment for not adhering to some stupid-ass con-servative CHOSEN "religious" interpretation. Well f*ck THAT.

I have no intention of sitting in the back of anyone's bus. And I'm not asking for anyone's "tolerance." Fu*k that crap too. I'm an American citizen by birthright, and if the Religious Right doesn't like it, that's too damned bad. I happen to think they belong in mental institutions, but of course we aren't allowed to state that in our media because everyone knows that we aren't allowed to offend con-servatives. . .only conservatives are real Americans who the Founding Fathers wrote the Constitution exclusively to protect.

Well, here is the ranting comments I posted in that other discussion forum:

And we've been much too careful for the last two years about calling this situation exactly what it is - tyranny. This heterosupremacist attitude that only married people should be entitled to have control over their lives and relationships is not only against the framework of our own freedom of association, but is obscene in the methods being used to maintain supremacist control over our lives.
There are times when we have to step up to the plate and not be afraid to call these people what they are - and bigots is just the polite form. They are every bit as tyrannical as the very king and Parliament this nation fought to gain independence from - and they are just as determined to maintain some ridiculous sense of special rights for themselves just because some American "Christian" ayatolluh's business is completely dependent on propagating a caste system.

When Leonard Pitt's column ran in our local newspaper this morning (and what a shock that our local rightwing rag would even print it) there had to be at least one christo-fascist commenter whining about how we "choose" to be "unnatural". Typically, I sent an online comment right back, challenging him to talk about how he projects sexuality in terms of his own experience - meaning apparently he chose the more "correct" one. You can't choose anything unless you have the notion that you can be something else - it's time to make these supremacists whining this crap to start spilling their tales of conscious selection.

As for third class status, Wisconsin can forget my support. When the people of an entire state are so stupid and so willing to sell out a basic human right to determine my own damned burial arrangements or let a partner make a simple hospital visitation, there isn't much of a way to put lipstick over the bruises.

But I do blame our own community for much of this defeat. I know we have an uphill battle, but until we are willing to tell our stories - and tell them loudly - and insist our local media give us the right to say something about our OWN experiences, this situation ain't gonna change too soon. And I've read those experiences even here on the Blend - those comments in a thread the other day which talked about how families accepted or rejected our relationships are exactly the kinds of stories that need to be told to everyone.

We shouldn't have to continue attempting to overcompensate for being gay by trying to be better principled human beings than those lowlife trash who pass themselves off as "religious" people with a "moral" foundation. The only damned foundation these people have is to give themselves as much of a step up in life as possible at the expense of as many other people as possible.

There has never been a real "debate" over marriage, period. Straight people are too insecure to actually examine statutes dealing with such matters as life, property, health and death - and they most certainly don't wish to discuss their abhorrent behavior when they strip a gay relative's home of every possession and toss a partner out into the street because the good Lord told them being "gay" was a sin. But it is high time this discussion was handled - not just for gay Americans, but for every single person in this country.

Families are (and have never been) ideal structures where everyone gets along famously, no one abuses anyone or beats their children, and no one abuses their spouse and destroys any love that should naturally be there. And we all know the fundies are at the heart of the perpetration of those dysfunctional homes - there are too many stories of children and spouses abused and neglected by one member of a family joining some nutcase church and hauling home the nose of a meddling minister (or worse, his peepee) into that home environment.

It isn't rocket science for any American to relate on his or her own experience and understand that there are millions and millions of people in this country who just don't have the ideal 1950's television sitcom life. And it sure as hell ain't rocket science to figure out that in every damned family in this country, a funeral is nothing but the backdrop for the heavy-handed greed ensuing over anything of mortal and monetary value. We've all seen it - and so has every single official "family" member. The laws in their present form do not protect the people they are created to serve. And when those who have been awarded the only right to form relationships based on an image (and regularly break their vows without legal/social penalty)are also given absolute control over the lives of all other members in a family, then the "family" associations are promoting nothing but tyranny.


I've got one thing to say - when the minority of heterosexual white men who run this damned country are willing to let THIS member of the MAJORITY of the REST of the population vote on THEIR rights, I'll listen to their argument about voting to make my community second class citizens. They should have their turn at getting dragged behind the back of a pickup truck, or strung up on a tree branch...or having a judicial system shake its head when a woman murders one because he hit on her (and reduce the charge to manslaughter) because she was protecting her treasure, or watching them cope with some black landlord telling them they can't move into the neighborhood because of the history of white male rape, or how about the chance to tell someone that they can't come into a business because we don't want to see some fundie nutcase praying at the dinner table of the restaurant?

This country has two choices and we are rapidly getting to a crossroads. We either learn how to accept and respect and get along with everyone who is a citizen of this nation, or we continue to let con-servatives perpetuate their paranoia about needing to rule over everyone based on nothing they have merited by hard work or dedication. This is one person who is tired of being the target, the scapegoat, the catch-all for every moan and gnash of teeth by a bunch of losers who use my community to raise money and gain power.

I might vote Democratic, but I have a few words for our party as well. I wasn't born in this country or educated in the same classrooms as your children to be told that I need to always be patient until we can figure out some way to appease a bunch of loser con-servatives. I don't need to hear this empty crap about how "everyone should be treated with respect" and then the next week have some fundy cousin walk into a courtroom and exhume the body of a gay partner and move it to an undisclosed location simply because the law pretends we don't exist. If we believe every American is entitled to basic human dignity, then its time to pay attention to what this system has done to us.

And frankly, as far as the wingnuts and the fundies are concerned - we KNOW they CHOSE their beliefs, and they can damned well change their choices much easier than I can pretend another sexual/relationship orientation just to be able to have some control over my life.
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Erika Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 02:00 AM
Response to Original message
1. If it helps, the right wingers are now being seen as
mean-spirited and on a witch hunt on the gays.

I am ashamed of them. They've hurt their own cause.

Ignore them.
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evilkumquat Donating Member (363 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 02:24 AM
Response to Original message
2. I Fall Into the "Guys Kissing is Icky" Category:
But goddammit, I am about as sick and tired of seeing the rights of homosexuals being trampled on as is possible without being gay, myself.

The hypocrisy of these Fundy asswipes who, in many cases are using the EXACT SAME ARGUMENTS against gay marriage as were used fifty years ago to prevent inter-racial marriage, is sickening to the point of being soul-crushing... and that is coming from an atheist.

Hey, Focus on the Family? You want to protect marriage? OUTLAW DIVORCE you hemorrhaging f**ks! I mean, allowing people who are married to end their unions seems a lot more damaging to state of matrimony than limiting the number of people who can get hitched simply because of their sexual orientation.

Evil Kumquat
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Der Blaue Engel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 02:56 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. I think you need to get over your "icky" feelings
I'm glad that you acknowledge them and that you don't allow them to influence your thinking on civil rights, but it is homophobia, and it is hurtful to hear something like that from our allies.
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Puglover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 09:09 AM
Response to Reply #2
6. Hey there Evil!
Edited on Thu Dec-21-06 09:10 AM by Puglover
Great avatar and from the quick look I took nice website. And thanks for the support.

I always find it interesting when a straight man sez that two men kissing is "icky" or makes them uncomfortable. I'm just as gay as can be and the sight of boy/girl,girl/girl and of course boy/boy doesn't bother me in the slightest. Whatever works.

I just bought "Maurice" in dvd and lo and behold on the bonus dvd here is Hugh Grant,Rupert Grant and James Wilby (the main stars) chatting about how they had to prepare themselves for kissing another guy. Women don't see to have this problem. Believe me if I were an actor I wouldn't give a thought to kissing a woman. I can only think it's gotta be a societal thing. Thoughts?

On edit. I got a level 60 lock on Feathermoon. And I HAD a level 42 priest. My account got hacked a week ago and so far Blizzard hasn't done crap.
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evilkumquat Donating Member (363 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 10:44 AM
Response to Reply #6
11. Sure It Bugs Me...
...that seeing two guys kiss gives me the heebee jeebees while two girls kissing does nothing for me (neither a turn-on, nor a turn-off). However, this is not being hypocritical because what is at issue is not my feelings toward homosexuality, but rather the equal protection under law homosexuals should enjoy. Gays MUST have EVERY right taken for granted by heterosexuals, WITH NO EXCEPTION. To feel otherwise pisses on the Constitution.

Is it fair to assume all homosexuals can watch a man and woman kiss without a feeling of unease? I imagine there must be a few out there who get bugged by it. Perhaps it is less "homophobia" than just not being used to something. I am sure most gays and lesbians grew up watching straights show public affection and they are used to it. Growing up in the cornfields of the Midwest, however, does not generally shower one with examples of diversity. You know, we do not share those "San Francisco Values." *wink

Puglover, are you sure with a name like that you play WoW? I cannot STAND Pugs*!

Evil Kumquat

* For those who do not play World of WarCraft (WoW), PUG stands for "pick-up group". This means entering a dungeon or battleground with four or more other players with whom you do not share the same guild. As total strangers, it is easier for people to screw around and steal good loot rather than playing with guildmates who will make sure loot is divided fairly. Hardcore WoW players usually HATE non-guild grouping. :)
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Puglover Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 02:31 PM
Response to Reply #11
18. My name on WoW is
Aleclanne and Katene. LOL not Puglover.

And bleh I grew up in the cornfields of Iowa and somehow I adapted. :rofl:
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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 10:36 AM
Response to Reply #2
10. It's good that you can own up to those feelings.
Cheers. :hug:
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Tyo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-22-06 12:55 AM
Response to Reply #2
20. We all have our Icky issues.
Tell you the truth, when I think about what straights or lesbians might do in bed, which I don't do very often, well... Let's just say I fail to see the attraction.

So what? That's not the point. I'm really grateful and encouraged that you and others like you are fighting on our side. Thank you for a great post. You have summed up my feelings better that I ever could have.
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cssmall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 02:51 AM
Response to Original message
3. I ask these things:
1. Think of how your identity as a gay individual has been bought and sold to the majority of the masses. The homosexual identity has been transformed into the villain: a menacing figure lecherous to the bone. Sit-coms, pop novels and anything else gives the mainstream images of cardboard cut outs of what it is to be gay, ignoring entirely the magnanimity and compassion of said individuals.

2. Continue the fight your rights. You have them, damn it, for a little while longer. Raise your voice so that it may be heard (yes, religious reference), but in the immortal words of Christ: "Who'm I to judge or strike you down?" I live my life as a married, straight male with children. I am proud of my family. Because of that, I want all to be proud of theirs no matter their love. It is not my place to restrict you from unioning or marrying a partner. It is my place to support you in that happiness.

3. Acceptance is neither gained through fire nor through vitriol. That is a lesson hard learned in a life when you find the wrong person to love be they same or opposite sex. Screaming shows you're angry and gives those against the Progressive agenda a sense of empowerment. Level your anger and focus it into a debate (which I know by now you have) and offer it should the time arise. Because I more than certainly will offer it on my behalf. To me, this is what has worked best. It even worked with my mother whom is quite religious (even though a slight social liberal).

This is my advice, I hope that it helps. If it does not, I apologize.
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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 05:49 AM
Response to Reply #3
5. advise we don't need.
wow -- he wasn't asking for advise -- we are getting our own -- and sometimes we get it through anger AND violence.

african americans didn't get white folk off their backs by always playing nice -- and neither have we.


support us where you can -- and realize that marriage inequality is un-american.
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cssmall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 11:26 AM
Response to Reply #5
12. It's advice from my own life.
I didn't love the person that was expected in my group, much to my detriment. I am not re-appropriating any bit of the pain and struggle in which you follow. I was offering my two cents, which is technically advice. And, how easy it for you, a gay person to take from the African-Americans their struggle and relate it to your own. Now wonder how hard it is for an African-American Gay Male. You took one HALF of his identity. Stop doing that, it really cheeses me off because you are lessening THEIR struggle with your own. This is your fight and one that I offer, as a straight male, to fight with you. Build your fight in your terms! Illustrate it in YOUR name! But set the terms wisely. You have to broker a *new* identity to the mainstream American: one not made of a cardboard cutout plagued with lecherous, hedonistic tendencies. In this case, you have to be given the chance to show that you are not that cardboard image of what it is to be gay; that gay is love, compassion, and has a longer shelf life than most straight marriages.

You want to be militant, then fine. You want to scream and rave, fine too. It is foolish. Hatred, violence, and anger lead to destruction. As to your last little comment, I thought I did that. I find myself utterly aghast at the fact that I get impaled for simply giving my opinion/advice. It is no better than yours. It is no better than anyone else's. Yet, I have the right to give it and lend my support, which I do. Read between the lines.
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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 12:37 PM
Response to Reply #12
16. what made you think that gay folk don't know how to get what they need?
we live in your world -- as you have defined it -- we pay your taxes, help support your schools{that teach history from your point of view, as though we aren't there}, we fight in your wars, we are your children, in some cases even your parents -- we know you better than you know yourselves -- and that's the irony here.

that you think we somehow don't KNOW -- are brainless or clueless -- or without the mental faculties to move ahead in search of our civil rights with out ''advice'' from heterosexuals -- well meaning or not -- like you?

it was a gay man after all that made martin luther king's speech on the mall in d.c such a huge and unmitigated success.

it was a riot in new york that let the city know they couldn't raid gay bars any more.{not unlike the kind of militant actions that stopped the nation in it's tracks and take african american civil rights seriously}.

it was pressure from groups like act-up and queer nation that put aids on the front page -- not polite had wringing.

i find your support nice -- but coming from a heterosexist place.
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cssmall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 01:03 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. You know what, nevermind.
Edited on Thu Dec-21-06 01:09 PM by cssmall
I try to be nice, offer my opinions and my support and this is how I get treated. If you wanted to educate me, you should have taken a *much* different route as now you have lost any chance of being relevant to me. I never intimated in any fashion that gay people were brainless and clueless; I know the history; I have seen the pain. Do not take it out on me. What I wrote was not to insult or to deign to you. It was much different. I ask you to reconsider what I wrote, think about it from a political economic perspective before this conversation delves further into what I detailed about rage and vitriol, a point which you continue to prove.
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xchrom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 02:38 PM
Response to Reply #17
19. you're right, nevermind.
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La Lioness Priyanka Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 09:29 AM
Response to Reply #3
7. in what position are you to give advice?
Edited on Thu Dec-21-06 09:34 AM by lionesspriyanka
why do you think we need it?

the advice i give straight people: try a little harder not to be self righteous bigots...

on edit: i am not calling you a bigot...i am just returning advice to straight people

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cssmall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #7
13. I think we give advice no matter what we do on this board
I simply write it is my opinion or my advice. I use the term loosely, it is not anything of importance nor do I consider it grand and earth shattering. :) If you remember me, then you know I am the furthest thing from bigot on the board. However, I do have strong opinions, one of them is to support the GLBT cause because it is highly misunderstood and misinterpreted (thank you Falwell). Tell a Christian that the Leviticus Code was ancient population increase measures by semi-nomadic Hebrews and see what they have to say or do afterwards. Usually it begins a ten hour debate on the validity of the bible or some other off topic issue.
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La Lioness Priyanka Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 11:35 AM
Response to Reply #13
14. i know you are not a bigot...its why i added that last sentence in.
Edited on Thu Dec-21-06 11:38 AM by lionesspriyanka
i just think that the part of your post about vitriol sounded a bit condescending..we have been begging for our rights, as though straight people have some inherent quality to grant rights. what they have is the majority, and not special god-given authority to vote on whether or not they think we deserve the same rights.

i hope i make sense...i have been working too many hours this week and am exhausted.

sorry, if i sounded like i was calling you a bigot. i wasnt.
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cssmall Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 11:43 AM
Response to Reply #14
15. I was in no way condescending and in no way meant to be.
I assure you. I apologize to you if it seemed that way; however, it was not meant in that manner. :hug: I just was cautioning from my own experience in life, offering my story as a option.

BTW: Work sucks.
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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 10:35 AM
Response to Reply #3
9. Thanks for your support!
:hug:
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closeupready Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-21-06 10:32 AM
Response to Original message
8. It's sad to me what's happened in Wisconsin.
There was a time when they were proud of their liberal, Progressive tradition. Are they going to be proud 20 years from now that they passed laws designed to take rights away from gay and lesbian Badgers? What are they going to tell their kids and grandkids?

So sad.

But things will change eventually, and they'll get on board, I'm sure.

I also feel that many of these homophobic "heterosexuals" are really bisexuals who are ashamed of their own homosexual feelings. Well, I'm not, and further, I have no heterosexual desires AT ALL. So if you people want to lecture other bisexuals about why they have to "choose" the heterosexual lifestyle over the "homosexual lifestyle", go for it, but leave me TF out of it.
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