Dropped the ball. May I apologize here?

[TygrBright]

Without sounding too, um, presumptuous or self-aggrandizing or spotlight-hogging or whatever?

I have once again been smacked in the face with the vestiges of my own homophobia, and the reason I want to offer this apology is to (I hope!) validate the anger of this community, not just to whine about my own inadequacy, which I've already done at tedious length.

Someone said on the Skinner's latest Well-the-fuck-with-it-all thread that homophobia and being in favor of full civil rights for gay people are not incompatible and I'm here to testify that's true indeed.

I'd also like to acknowledge that homophobia is not incompatible with loving and caring about gay people and wanting them to enjoy full equality and full civil rights because homophobia does NOT mean "hating gays," which I think is at the root of a lot of sincere confusion as well as a lot of disingenuous snarkery.

Homophobia is not about "hate."

It's about an attitude.

It's about assumptions.

And the attitude and assumptions are tied up with the notion that gay peoples' humanity is somehow not as important as mine. That it's not such a big deal that the law of the land still permits them to be treated as second-class citizens. That the fact that SOME gay people live great lives, and SOME gay people don't show the effects of discrimination obviously, means that the discrimination just isn't that important. We're getting over it, right? Geez, be patient and all that BULLSHIT.

And it hits home in really subtle ways.

As in, when it impinges on my consciousness that some media figure I don't know anything about (but who is apparently Very Famous To Large Numbers Of People) indulges in a public anti-gay rant, and that here on Democratic Underground:

a) We still have plenty of people who think that there is some way to mitigate and/or defend the Famous Person (who probably Doesn't Really Hate Gays and therefore can't possibly be a homophobe, right?); and

b) Still have plenty of people who think that while the Famous Person was a homophobic ass, people Defending the Homophobic Person may Have a Point or are at least Not Homophobes Themselves and therefore should be allowed to Have Their Say because, after all, we're all about Freedom of Speech and Substantive Discussion of Attitudes and Issues here; and

c) Still, painfully, have plenty of people who believe that Discussing the Substantive Discussion itself, and pointing out exactly how it exposes homophobia right here on our dear DU, is indicative of how Whiny, Thin-Skinned, Victim-Mentalitied, etc. the gay community here on DU is, and oh, for Petesqueaks Just Shut Up About All That How-Discriminated-Against-We-Are Gay Stuff, already, didn't Obama just do something nice for you guys last week or last month or whatever?

And although I notice this, I fail to think that this is important enough to Stick My Oar In on, and point it all out, and yell HEY!! I've BEEN THERE! I'm still fighting with myself on this homophobia thing and I'm a fervent supporter of gay rights, and this is What Homophobia Looks Like and it doesn't belong here, dammit!!!

In spite of the fact that I find plenty of time and interest in other topics, some of them mind-numbingly trivial.

I'm sorry. I missed the boat on this one, and I don't think I'd be allowed to post this now in GD (where it belongs, really, because you all KNOW this already,) because let's face it, the foofooraw has gotten past the point where anything enlightening or productive is possible right now.

But I hereby promise that I WILL do better next time.

I'm just sorry as hell that you're all having to go through this weary soul-grinding discussion yet again.

respectfully,
Bright

[xchrom]

1. Recommend

[tblue37]

2. KnR because this sort of soul-searching needs to go on all the time, so people need to see this

[hootinholler]

3. But isn't homophobia the fear of the gay?

:shrug:

That's what I always thought.

-Hoot

[ScreamingMeemie]

4. Assumptions create and foster fear.

[TygrBright]

6. In literal translation, but not in usage.

If we were to apply every term of Greek philological roots only in literal translation, we'd lose a lot of words.

"Homophobia" applies to a whole spectrum of attitudes and assumptions that encompass everything from well-intentioned discounting and dismissal, to hate and fear and active persecution.

The common thread is the devaluation of the humanity and the rights of gay people, manifested in a wide variety of forms.

At one end is the "I like gay people, I support their rights, BUT..." form.

At the other end is "Rev." Phelps & Co.

Same spectrum.

I understand not seeing it, though. It took me many years and not a few ugly metaphorical smacks upside the head to see it in myself, in spite of my love for gay family and friends and my steadfast "support" of gay rights (at a "reasonable" pace, don't you know...)

I'm old enough to remember how black people got this runaround. "I don't HATE black people, and I'm certainly not AFRAID of black people... I just think we can't make fundamental changes that are so unpopular quickly. Be reasonable..."

sadly,
Bright

[Creideiki]

8. No more than photophobia (extreme sensitivity to light) is fear of light

BTW, photophobia is a common symptom among migraine sufferers during a headache. Ask anyone you know who suffers from migraines what photophobia is. Chances are, they know. (For the record, although I get some rollicking migraines, I don't get photophobia. My aunts and uncles all do, though.)

[w8liftinglady]

5. Thank you for being honest.

You'll find most of us fit no pre-conceived notion about what "Teh gay" is.

Keep talking.
It helps.
Peace.
Beth

[mitchtv]

7. K&R

thanks

[closeupready]

9. As long as you are TRYING, I think THAT's what people appreciate

So, K&R. What I don't like are people who imply that they know everything, and they can't learn from your first-hand experience of how HATEFUL Americans can be towards their own GLBT brothers and sisters.

:hi:

[thanks_imjustlurking]

12. Yep, there are many around here who know more about "you" than you do.

Not to mention more about what you should do, so just shut up and do it. That's the attitude that has always pushed my button.

[RKP5637]

10. K&R!!! Thanks!!! n/t

[TriMera]

11. Rec. n/t

[thanks_imjustlurking]

13. Thank you very much.

:hug:

[Creideiki]

14. Bright, here's the deal--there are some things that we never get to take out of our sights:

Women's rights, minority issues (DREAM Act and Affirmative Action scalebacks), union issues, and GLBT issues.

One thing that seems to be common is that everyone assumes that right to choose, personhood, ethnic minority issues, and union issues will always get everyone's support. However, GLBT issues are clouded by this massive "but my religion tells me I can hate gays." As long as we allow this to be true, then there is a deep betrayal within the Democratic Big Tent. And then there's this constant accusation that it is the LGBT community's fault for "failing to outreach". That's just bullpuckey. The outreach has been done on all these issues.

However, repeatedly, we get trolled over here ("Why is homophobia a phobia when it's not a fear and we all know the English language is perfect and precise!" for example.) And then we have moderators who repeatedly stalk the GLBT community like rancid peanut butter over apples or insane monks giving bad advice to Russian royalty.

The problem is that the GLBT community is the first wedge being chipped away and set adrift. Once we're not there, the rest start falling--women's rights and union rights, all the anti-immigrant fervor--all set up for a "populist" assault orchestrated by extreme rightwing billionaires. LGBT issues are just the canary in the coal mine. Once they're gone, you can expect everything else to start choking on the poison.

[stevenleser]

15. K&R you hit the nail on the head and I think I realized that with the Gay Caveman threads

It was an attitude and it was about assumptions.

There is nothing wrong with questioning the validity of a scientific discovery. In the context of it being a pleasant thing for the LGBT community, however, the questioning became an ugly thing.

Watching those threads unfold really made me question my own sensitivity and comments earlier on in the administration.

[closeupready]

18. Oh, yeah. Those threads, for some reason, were REALLY good at showing up the local phobes.

Objectively, there's no reason why they should have been so good for that, but they were. I don't know, maybe that was our lucky week...? :rofl: ;)

[mistertrickster]

16. Post it at Free Republic. This straight white male who worked hard for

four decades for African-American rights (even though I'm not black), for women's rights (even though I'm not a woman), and for gay rights (even though I'm not gay) refuses to feel guilty for other peoples' shortcomings . . .

[mistertrickster]

17. Words have meanings.

"Homophobia is not incompatible with loving and caring about gay people . . ."

Let's see . . . how can I put this diplomatically?

How about

BULLSHIT!

World English Dictionary

homophobia (ˌhəʊməʊˈfəʊbɪə)

— n
intense hatred or fear of homosexuals or homosexuality

I love you and care about you but I hate you.

C'mon, word games don't win political battles.

Winning political battles do.