How low can you go? ..Nats and Pirates attendance

[Upton]

On Sunday, the just brutal Washington Nationals were playing the hottest team in the league and drew but 16,974. However, that was not the lowest attendance figure of the day...that dubious distinction belongs to the Pirates who drew a pathetic 14,776.

The Nats are 26th in the league in attendance, the Pirates 29th...so, the only question that remains for these two teams is...how low can you go?

Btw, the Giants, though struggling, are 9th in attendance as the Real sports fans of the Bay Area continue to exhibit their loyalty.

[TZ]

1. Yeah well with nothing better to do

Of course the giants get attendence. Folks in DC have lots of things to do including playoff Hockey.BTW still better attendence than Montreal or Miami.

[Upton]

2. Last year

the Nats were 19th in attendance, averaging 29,005 a game.. This year, they're averaging but 23,348 a game...I guess you could blame it on hockey, the weather, or the economy, but the warning signs are there. This is a struggling franchise, not only on the field but in the stands as well.

[RavensChick]

30. Sadly,

all of the above, but even that won't stop the diehard fans from attending the games. Then again, getting on a winning streak would be nice.

[cboy4]

3. Yea, there's just absolutely nothing to do in San Francisco.

:eyes:

[TZ]

8. Compared to here

With all the FREE stuff ...in this economy if you don't think it's going to make a difference..

[trumad]

7. Umm

You can't be serious about nothing to do in San Fran---one of the great Metropolitan City's of the world.

[cboy4]

4. 8,790 in Pittsburgh tonight...the AAA Sacramento Rivercats

routinely draw more people than that, even though people can drive an hour and a half to watch the parent A's in Oakland.

[Upton]

5. Check it out

The official tally of witnesses for Ohlendorf's first victory in eight career starts for the Pirates was 8,790. However, the actual number of fans in the seats on the chilly, rainy night at PNC Park was less than a third of that.

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/news/breaking/s_621551.html

Unbelievable..

[KamaAina]

22. When posting a 'Burgh link, please use the legitimate one, the Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

http://www.post-gazette.com

pittsburghlive.com is the website of the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review, the house organ of notorious RW billionaire douchebag Richard Mellon Scaife. It is about as credible as DC's Moonie Times.

Yes, it's sports, but why give him extra hits?

[Upton]

26. Thanks....the Post Gazette story is even better

and much more detailed:

The paid attendance of 8,790 was the sixth-smallest in PNC Park history, the smallest having been 8,201 from the April, 25, 2007. Actual turnstile count was roughly 4,500.

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/09111/964297-63.stm

[flvegan]

6. OR, California, though divided in team loyalty, just likes baseball.

Let us see, the Giants this month played so far:

5 games v the Dodgers
3 games v Oakland
3 games v San Diego

[madinmaryland]

9. Hmm. Another shut-out for the Pirates last night.

[Upton]

12. Too bad nobody was there to see it

after drawing less than 9000 last night, the Pirates are now officially LAST in MLB in attendance.

[TZ]

10. I can tell you this.

If the Nats had a playoff game..they would sell out (I'm looking at you Atlanta). And lets look at the Florida Marlins who even with WS wins underneath their belts have worse attendence than either team. There are far sorrier teams in attendence then the Nats

[Upton]

11. Not so fast

as of this morning, Atlanta is 19th and Florida 25th in attendance...this compares with the Nat's dropping to 28th, after a dismal 12,473 last night. I know the weather wasn't great, but in a similar situation you'd see at least 30,000 in the Bay Area for the Giants.

We'll see how things work out as the season progresses, but for such a new franchise that came on the scene with such fanfare.. Nat attendance has to be considered a major disappointment.

[TZ]

13. Actually a lot of the Nats attendence

or lack of is because of the politicians/lawyers/corporations who buy up a lot of the good seats for occasional use. Thats kind of the sports culture around here..with the notable exception of the Redskins..:shrug:.
I'll admit there are better sports citites but really as I said...When you have the Smithsonian, monuments, Kennedy Center, and all kinds of other (and many free) activities going on down at the Mall (we just finished the Cherry Blossom festival) I am not at all surprised with as bad as the Nats are playing attendence is down. Also..there are a few minor league ball teams around here that offer really good cheap deals for families and I think with budget tightening...why go into the city and pay a ton to see a rotten sports franchise when you can go right down the road and have a good time with a not so bad team myself..I've been to a few Frederick Keys games myself..some outings sponsered by my employers and I can DEFINITELY see the appeal there.

Edit: If they improve their play, the attendence will most likely improve. But Spring time in DC--there is a hell of a lot of other things to do here...

[cboy4]

25. That's such a lame excuse...The politicians

lawyers and corporations buy up the luxury suites and the seats down near the field.

There are plenty of seats available for anyone that wants to be a loyal fan and go to the game.

Furthermore, I don't really believe people who live there go to the monuments and the museums. That's like saying people in NYC don't go to the games because they can go to the top of the Empire State building and ride the Staten Island ferry. Those are tourist activities.

And let's just say people in metro DC are going to the museums and monuments .. they certainly aren't going at night, because they're closed. So you can do all of that and still go to a Nationals game, because most games are played at night.

Stop apologizing for all of the fair weather fans. I know your team sucks, but just admit people aren't going because they suck.

It's not because there are so many other choices at night. I've been to DC many times, and the place, with the exception of Georgetown, is a ghost town after 5 when the federal workers go home.

[northzax]

28. you haven't been here lately, have you?

ten years ago, the District was dead after 5 with the exception of Georgetown and maybe Dupont. but now you can add Adams Morgan/Mt. Pleasant/Columbia Heights/Woodley Park, U Street, Gallery Place/Chinatown/Penn Quarter, Eastern Market, H St/Atlas. plus the college areas of Foggy Bottom/West End to that list. Plus, if you really want to get technical, add the Clarendon-Ballston corridor on the Orange Line, the Entertainment options in DC are ten times what they were a decade ago when DC was basically a happy hour town.

but yes, you're right, the fact that the Nats suck, combined with the dearth of entertainment options in that neighborhood (although there is a lot of easy parking with all the vacant lots) and the piss-poor ownership of the Lerners, means that people in DC can't really be bothered to care about the Nats. Most of the attendance comes from outside the District at this point.

there are a few other factors, including the economy, the awful Nats TV deal and the team's insistence on the really expensive seats behind home-plate going unsold and unused (they're 375+ and you have to buy them in packages, so the space is always half full max, there really aren't that many people in the DC are who are going to drop $60k on two season tickets)

[RavensChick]

31. The mayor would

by holding the club box hostage and not giving the tickets to the City Council members! That by itself is very embarrassing, not to mention childish and making the Nats look worse than their current record. It was all over the news in recent days and all I can do is shake my head in total disbelief (all the more reason why I live in Maryland but I'm not a baseball fan). So, until the economy improves and people start realizing that there is life after 5:00 in DC, it'll be the same old same old!

[trumad]

14. The Marlins play in a football stadium not conducive to B-Ball

I expect them to do much better when their new stadium is built in Miami.

[charlie and algernon]

15. and during that 2003 playoff run, they were averaging 65,000 people a game

Oops, I thought they had more, but after checking ESPN.com, they had 65,000 a game. A lot of Marlins fans were incredibly hurt as a result of the 1997 firesale and the subsequent mini firesales. If the Marlins continue their run, that stadium will fill up again.

[TZ]

16. but before and after the WS runs

The Marlins have had pretty dismal attendence..so much so that when DC was looking for a team there was some talk that the Marlins would do better HERE then down there....I don't buy the bad stadium deal that much either. Some places aren't as good as others. I will buy that DC is one of them (definitely a football town first) I think Miami is just one of those places with too much other stuff going on for a baseball team to be a big draw..

[charlie and algernon]

17. it was the firesales that did it

if the nationals have the worst GM, we've had the worst owners, BY FAR. The same guy that destroyed the expos is now running the show in Miami. It's not just losing Miggy, Derek Lee, and Becket, it's losing that loaded 1997 team. Imagine if we had kept Kevin Brown and Gary Sheffied a few more years? Perhaps we could've built a solid foundation and developed into a consistant contender. I'm hoping that the contract extension for Ramirez and the new stadium is the start of change, but I'm not hoping too much. It's nice that's we've won World Series titles, but the fans can support forever the model of winning a title, selling the pieces, and sucking for 5 years till the prospects mature, rinse and repeat.

[trumad]

18. Well then you've never been in Phin stadium for a b-ball game.

Their new Miami stadium should increase their attendance big time.

[RockaFowler]

19. I love Dolphin Stadium - as a football stadium

As far as baseball - it blows. We sat in the "Fish Bowl" (sections 125-127) area for the 3rd game of the World Series in 2003. No-one can hit a home run that far.


The new stadium looks a lot better

[Jack from Charlotte]

29. The slogan for the pre season '98 Marlins was the best in sports history.....

After they won the '97 World Series and after they traded the entire team to save $$$, their pre season slogan was..... "Wait 'till last year."

Great.

[MrPerson]

20. You're going to make us sit outside and breathe in teh pollution?

Fuck you.

[MrPerson]

21. The Steelers have sold out since 1973.

The Penguins since Crosby came to town.

The audience will build if they do well.

[SteelPenguin]

23. As MrPerson noted...

Pittsburgh is more of a Football and Hockey town than baseball these days. When you go outside you see kids playing hockey in the streets on rollerblades, not baseball. Though maybe that's my neighborhood.

We're getting close to two decades of the Pirates being one of the worst teams in baseball. They've lost the younger fans...they are Steelers and Penguins fans now. The kids don't really care about the Pirates, at least most of them. You see Steelers baseball caps, and Penguins baseball caps, but rarely Pirates baseball caps.

Attendance has been on a slow decline for years with the Pirates, but it's all because Management doesn't care about winning. Even with their dismal attendance they remain profitable, in fact they're one of the most profitable (net) teams in baseball thanks to the luxury tax. They sell off their good players, pay little for the ones they have, and hope for the best.

Going to a Pirates game in this town has become something you do on a nice day, maybe it's a fireworks night. It has nothing to do with the team, and more to do with 'something to do'. Because of that right now you're gonna see CRAP atendance for the priates. The weather has been cold and rainy, and the Penguins are still playing. Even the Penguins numbers dip when the Steelers are still playing. The Pirates numbers dip when the Penguins are still playing, and once the Steelers get back into action.

Anyway once the Penguins finish up winning the Cup (>.>) the Pirates numbers will go up, same as when the weather gets nicer. When it's about something to do, rather than about 'sports' or 'rooting for the home team' there are less people who want to go when it's cold and rainy, and there is a Penguin game on...

I see it as a failing of the current economic situation of the league, where the luxury tax allows teams to basically not care much at all about attendance or competing, because they can remain profitable on very very very low ticket sales, and they look at it as a business.

Sad really. if the management cared they could easily build up a competitive team over the course of 4 or 5 years, or less, but they've shown over the past number of years they don't care about doing so, because that would eat into their profits.

[dakota_democrat]

24. I'm surprised the Nats do as well as they have in attendance.

You can't just move a team into a town and tell the fans, "This is who you're supposed to cheer for now."

And Pittsburgh...the Pirates are just the low man on the totem pole. Tack on that Pittsburgh's been more heavily hit by the recession than other baseball cities, and what do you expect to happen?

Your efforts to make the SF Giants look good could use some improvements.

[Upton]

27. Pirate attendance Tuesday night....9,917

that's minor league, that's really minor league...the people of Pittsburgh ought to be ashamed.

:thumbsdown: