Seattle Sonics Sold To Oklahoma City Group

[Mojambo]

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2003135221_websonicssold18.html

Not a terribly good day for basketball fans in Seattle. You could see this coming though. Basketball just wasn't making a profit here and the populace is (probably rightfully) quite spent on the idea of more public money for pro sports.

The Sonics just had the misfortune of being last in line behind the M's and Seahawks.

That's the way it goes I guess.

[democracyindanger]

1. Comes down to management

Sooner or later, Wally Walker's luck was going to run out. Well, look at the bright side: If the Sonics move, you're welcome to become a Blazer fan. :evilgrin:

[NJ Democrats]

2. So are they going to move to Ok City

when NO/Ok City goes back to NO?

[Mojambo]

3. Presumably

Probably after next season.

They're making noises that there is still time to keep them in town, but I gotta put the chances at under 10%

Just when the Sonics were beginning to turn it around on the court.

[fishwax]

4. I'm happy for those in my old state of Oklahoma

I'm sorry you're losing your team, though :(

[HuckleB]

6. What about all the taxpayers who could give a rip about the NBA...

but who will be ponying up corporate welfare for this team, anyway?

[fishwax]

7. well, the arena expansion that was designed to lure an NBA team was

approved by the voters of OKC a couple of years back. OKC has been trying to land a major-league team--MLB, NHL, or NBA--since before I moved (near) there in '93, through various improvements to the downtown infrastructure and athletic facilities.

[HuckleB]

10. Still.

Voter-approved or not. It's corporate welfare, and it doesn't add up for any community.

[RoyGBiv]

11. I don't agree in this case ...

The project that did this, despite what it can be called, has been a positive thing for OKC, one of the few positive things in the last decade.

It *is* corporate welfare of a sort, and I'm conflicted on that, but I also know, from watching this city and the area of improvement since I was a kid, that the changes that have taken place have been, on the whole, positive.

The lingering problem is that one of the goals of the project has not yet come to fruition, i.e. luring a pro sports team. Had that continued to be the case, a lot of those improvements would eventually have gone to waste, and all the money we have invested in this thing would have been money down a dry hole. Problem there is that there wasn't really another hole even to try to drill.

The Hornets being here last year was amazingly good for the city, in ways more than financial. My personal salary was about $1,000 higher last yer due to the direct influence of their presence, and I'm nothing but a peon. I cannot calculate the indirect influence.

Out of the realm of finances, Okies simple want this kind of thing. I was hoping for some sort of expansion team to avoid the inevitable complaining about "stealing" another team, but I never really thought that would happen. Too much energy was being generated in the community to lure an established team here.

[HuckleB]

17. It still may not come to fruition.

And if the success of the project was based on getting a pro team, it wasn't something that should have been built. Those are long odds, in general.

[RoyGBiv]

19. True ...

I mentioned in another thread elsewhere that the project as a whole was the equivalent of bending OKC residents over and giving it to them with a sandpaper sheath. I didn't live here at the time, and if I had, I would not have voted for it. The area did need rennovation on a massive scale. It was a rundown area of old downtown, and the business that were near there were starting to leave because of all the crime and general blight. There was really nothing there except abandoned buildings and factories, one with an old U-Haul truck on the top of it that just screamed "GET OUT WHILE YOU CAN!"

The problem we face now, though, is that we've been paying for this crap for years and don't have much to show for it but a few bars, restaurants, a freakin' Bass Pro Shops, and a movie theater that is one of those massive deals I hate going to. (Reminds me of a scene in that old Tom Hanks movie _Bachelor Party_ when they're chasing each other through a movie theater and run across a directional map that shows this massive maze you could end up lost in for years.) The Redhawks (minor league baseball) and Blazers (minor league hockey) have been interesting additions, and I personally love going to Redhawks games simply because I'm a fan of minor league ball. But this is not what the millions of dollars pumped into that area of the city were meant to draw, and now that the money has been collected and spent for so long, were in the position of either attempting to get the things the project was meant to draw or admit it was all a complete waste and pile on another layer of sandpaper for the final thrust.

You're certainly correct that it may not happen anyway. Justice may in fact dictate that it doesn't. But, there is no justice, and since I am a resident here now, I would definitely like to see something in that arena that would give me something to do I enjoy doing after work for at least part of the year. I only wish it didn't have to be a situation that is going to hurt people in another city.

[fishwax]

20. hey, I always liked the rotating U-Haul

:rofl: what a weird landmark. I remember when the second phase of Bricktown was completed and getting the owner to take that down actually took some convincing :rofl: Of course, that huge storage shed built in its place isn't exactly scenic :rofl:

To me, Bricktown had become a near-colossal disapointment by the time I left. They were having trouble keeping the businesses along the canal near capacity, and the largest draw was that Bass Pro Shop (which was only built because Bass Pro is owned in part by the same people who own the Oklahoman--somehow, during their coverage of the huge controversy over whether or not the city would meet Bass Pro's demands for incentives to move it, the Oklahoman managed to avoid making that connection clear :eyes:)

As someone who used to love going to the old Bricktown in the years before the canal, I had high hopes for the area that were far from realized. I would imagine the Hornets changed that scene last year, and I would think a permanent team would really help in the development of the area.

[RoyGBiv]

21. Heya, fishwax ...

Howsitgoin ...

Yeah, last year was the first time I've ever actually enjoyed going down there since the massive renovations, and the Hornets were the reason. I go down there for Redhawks games, but promptly get the hell out as soon as the game is over. I honestly can't say what the difference was. It was mostly atmosphere. The fun didn't feel contrived with the Hornets in town. Everyone knows that only a certain kind of person actually enjoys going to a minor league game where the team loses most of the time. :-)

The Blazers were there, and that was fun for some. I actually had a pair of season tickets last year (won them from my job for doing something spectacular I didn't realize I did) but I rarely used them except to give pairs away to others. Got a lot of free stuff because of that. But anyway, hockey just doesn't do it for me.

About the U-Haul, I actually thought it was kinda funny and was almost sad to see it go. But, it really did scream GET OUT while the gettin's good. :-)

And I HATE the canal.

A permanent team is definitely what the area needs. As it is, the biggest draw is the OKC Bombing memorial. It's close to the area of course, and people end up in Bricktown when they go there. So, it's kinda somber.

I also have bitter feelings about it for purely selfish reasons. The guy who owned the Varsity, which was my favorite sports part near me, did a lot of speculating in Bricktown, but his investments invariably failed. Eventually he'd lost so much money he had to sell the Varsity I went to, and now it's owned by a chain bar and sucks.

[fishwax]

22. Hey RoyGBiv

It's going pretty well ... how's things for you?

Knowing how desperately OKC had been pining for years for a major league team, I can only imagine what the atmosphere was for those games. I mean, the Blazers have a loyal following, the Redhawks are fun to watch--even the OKC Wranglers of the AFL would show you a good time--but Oklahoma Citians had really wanted a major league team, and I can only imagine how thrilled they were at that. I was jealous that it happened right after I left :) As long as I lived in the metro area (moved there in '93), that had been a goal, and (it seemed to me) residents had a certain chip on their shoulder about not being part of the "club." (I don't say that to be disparaging, just that I think the whole "minor-league" label is insulting on a certain level to a big segment of the population.)

When I heard about the SuperSonics, I thought about all the people I knew who were so proud of their oklahoma heritage, so proud of their city, so insecure (again, not to be disparaging) about their city's status, etc., and I felt really happy for them. And I imagined how much fun I would have driving up to the city to see the hometown team take on the Lakers, followed by a quick walk over to Crabtown for a bucket full of shrimp. I could have fun, on a night like that :)

About the U-Haul, I actually thought it was kinda funny and was almost sad to see it go. But, it really did scream GET OUT while the gettin's good. :-)

I can't argue with that :)

And I can relate to the frustration vis-a-vis the Varsity too. None of those bars (and few of the restaurants--other than a pretty good sushi place that went out of business after about 18 months) that sprung up the canal ever interested me. That pretty much sums up my disapointment in Bricktown. It could have been a haven for some great local flavor or community businesses, but instead it turned into an orgy of big chains and corporate theme bars/restaurants (not to mention sporting goods stores). Sigh.

[HuckleB]

5. Cool.

Now Paul Allen will take the TrailBlazers' for sale sign down and move 'em to Seattle, leaving Portland as the best open market for the NHL in the northwest!

Ah, I can dream, eh?

[Mojambo]

8. That'd workout fine for me

Except that part about getting the Blazers.

[MessiahRp]

9. I liked the Blazers

when they had Clyde Drexler, Terry Porter, Jerome Kersey, Buck Williams, Cliff Robinson, etc.

It seems once they traded Clyde it was all downhill from there. Management in Portland is just awful at player evaluation both in the draft and in free agency/trades.

Rp

[Robeson]

13. That was a very good team....

...yes, they were fun watch.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

12. Lol.

We would get B Roy back, though. :think:

I don't think I could physically bring myself to root for the Failblazers.

[maxsolomon]

14. LAST in line?

how about they were FIRST in line, Key Arena having been remodelled 10 years ago before the Hawks & Mariners bent us over? they were back for SECONDS, and the city called their bluff. rather than walk his talk & build his own arena, or, god forbid, WORK WITH THE CITY TO FIND A MUTUALLY AGREEABLE SOLUTION, Mr. Coffee ran away like a pussy & lied in our face.

I want suits filed by the city, the county, the state. I want Gregoire on them like they were RJ Reynolds. Treat them like Ken Behring.

It is most definitely NOT they way it goes. Typical NW Scandahoovlian reaction. Get MAD! IT FUCKING SUCKS! first we get jobbed in the Superbowl, then David Stern wants N.O., who could give a fuck about the Hornets, to have a team rather than the 3.5 million people in the 4 counties around Seattle? OKC, town in the middle of goddamn nowhere with half a million population, has the Sonics as a BACKUP team? Charlotte gets an expansion team 2 years after George Shinn runs off with the Hornets? THAT SUCKS!

[Broken_Hero]

24. I hear you

this is the first, time I heard about the Sonics going to Oklahoma, and I am just about up in arms over the move. The Sonics are my fave NBA team, dammit! They can't move them...and especially to oklahoma city? No, offense to Oklahomans, I would still be upset if they moved them to montana, or someplace else...

Sonics, need to stay in Seattle...damn it! Don't forgot Pacific NW fans, they alaskans, by and large, support "ALL" Pac NW teams....:) You guys got a ton of fans in the "Last Frontier"...

[maxsolomon]

15. bump

i'm still pissed.

now the new owners are whining that no one believes their BS. their little venture capitalist feewings are hurt.

[LisaM]

16. Yeah, I saw that too

I'm with you. I think pro sports are good for a city and I don't like when teams are stolen away. If OKC does steal the Sonics, they're going to have to deal with the complaints. I still can't root for the Colts or the Ravens, or the Dodgers or Giants for that matter! Not that the Dodgers and Giants played in NY in my lifetime, but still! It's wrong!

That OKC whiner is probably just going to use that as an excuse when he does steal the team - "I tried to work with the people in Seattle, but ......"

Howard Schultz, though, is beneath contempt.

[democracyindanger]

18. Here's how one sports business guy

thinks it'll shake out:

Sonics move to OKC.

Paul Allen sells the Blazers to Mark Wattles.

Allen buys the Hornets and moves them to Seattle.

It's at oregonlive.com if you want to bother to look.

Works for me.

For what it's worth, I think Seattle is getting screwed--but the pols and the citizens are doing the right thing. There is no reason to expect King County taxpayers to foot the bill for a new stadium. PDX is in a good position because there's no way Allen can sell the Blazers to a new owner who wants to move it without the new owner forking over a ton of cash to Portland for everything from change of ownership fees to buying out the lease for the Rose Garden.

[maxsolomon]

23. i'm tired of having Paul Allen as our sugar daddy.

I hope your 'sports business guy' is right. Not to optimistic though. That's a lot of argy bargy.

But why go through the machinations? Stern brokering between George Chinn & Clay Bennett to sell the Hornets to OKC leaves the Sonics out of it.

Wally Walker this is YOUR FAULT.

[Jack Rabbit]

25. The Oklahoma City Sonics?

I guess it makes as much sense as the Los Angeles Lakers or the Utah Jazz.

[maxsolomon]

26. they'll change the name

to the Dust Bowlers.