Church fire suspect had books on atheism

[humblebum]

TYLER, Texas – Court records show that one of the suspects in a string of church fires in eastern Texas had assault rifles and books on demons and atheism in his home. ... Their attorneys are not commenting publicly because of a gag order.

http://www.dallasnews.com


"Evil knows no bounds, but then again, what is evil?"

[no_hypocrisy]

1. Oh swell . . . .

[Ozymanithrax]

2. To quote Shrek, "Get your swords and pitchforks..."

Serial arsonists, like serial killers, are insane. The books he had that justify his madness are irrelevant.

[left coaster]

4. Yes, thank you, exactly. nt

[Lerkfish]

5. odd. but if he had had a bible it would have been relevant, right?

atheists amaze me sometimes.

[dmallind]

8. Nope - but on the other hand he didn't say, so far "atheism made me do this"

Unlike religious wrongdoers so often pointed out do.

And still there is no "no true Scotsmanism" going on, which is the norm for religious wrongdoers. Nobody yet has claimed he couldn't be an atheist, whereas religionists always try to disassociate themselves from their wackos.

When atheist starve a kid to death for saying "amen' before a meal, in the name of their atheism, then you'll have the moral analogy you are so desperately trying to manufacture here.

[MineralMan]

10. I do not know of a single atheist who does not own a Bible.

In fact, I own several Bibles, but have no books on atheism. One of my friends who is a Lutheran minister has several books on atheism. He also owns several Bibles, but sometimes borrows more obscure translations from me. Go figure.

[ret5hd]

12. Well, I don't, so now you know OF one.

[MineralMan]

13. OK.

[Christa]

27. Same here.

I have more bibles and books on religion than books on atheism.

[Ozymanithrax]

11. For a serial killer or a serial arsonist, no. Insane people will justify their

behavior one way or another. By the report, if correct, one of them had atheist literature. If he had Harry Potter, would it be the fault of wizards? We should be thankful there was no Koran within a mile of his place
By the way, I have Dungeon & Dragons books, the bible, the Koran, a book by Richard Dworkin, the Wealth of Nations, and the Communist Manifesto on the shelf by my computer. Which one of those books would they blame if I were arrested for doing crazy disturbing things.

By the way, I'm not an atheist. I'm an agnostic secular Jew from a mixed Christian Jewish background.

[ChadwickHenryWard]

16. You make a good point.

Which of those books would be relevant to the writer of the article about your arrest? It's worth thinking about.

On a completely unrelated, note, who is Richard Dworkin?

[uberllama42]

31. Let me Google that for you

http://tinyurl.com/yhxn4ze

[ChadwickHenryWard]

34. You don't think I Googled it first?

So he's a film transcriber and gay activist who shares a name with a British drummer. No books listed, which leads me to believe that this guy's referring to someone else.

[PassingFair]

37. Ha Ha.

Right, like everyone would LEAP on an
arsonist with a bible in his house.

Silly goose!

I'm an atheist, and I have at least 3 buy-bulls
in my house.

[left coaster]

3. "books on demons and atheism"

In the same book? Cuz one often sees demons, and other mythological creatures, featured in religious texts..

Crazy comes in all colors, shapes, and sizes. No newsflash.

[dmallind]

6. And could very easily have been an atheist yes

No "no trus Scotsmanism" here I hope.

The demons on the other hand are a bit hard to reconcile with atheism. Why did the writer lump them together I wonder?

[Warpy]

7. Atheism and belief in demons are mutually exclusive

The books in his possession indicate a deep confusion, not any coherent thought on the subjects.

Besides, I've read through Ayn Rand. That doesn't mean I bought a word of it.

[dmallind]

9. No they don't.

I have plenty of books on atheism, as well as several Bibles, the Holy Books from a bunch or religions, theological tomes and yes indeed some books that mention demons. I am neither confused nor incoherent on the topic. The only telling thing the demonology books demonstrate are the suspicious reason the author had for lumping them in with books on atheism. Did he have books on cats or dogs too?

[darkstar3]

14. 3 things.

1. Judging anyone's views on a complex subject by referring to a small subset of books that they own is impossible, and this has been already shown in this thread. In my home, you will find books about all kinds of topics ranging from the religious to the irreligious, the fantastical to the perfectly boring, and inclusive of points of view on the left and the right. What does this tell you? That I like to read.

I will guarantee you that he had more books in that house that, when referred to in the way this muckraker has done, would incriminate other groups. Until the motives for this act are made clear either by the perpetrator's confession or a proper trial, there's no way to know how those books influenced him. To infer or imply a motive based on some books found in his home is dishonest.

2. This is yellow journalism, with bias clearly showing through. There is absolutely no connection between "books on demon possession and atheism." To lump them together in the same breath as the writer has done is to display a wildly inappropriate bias toward anyone who lacks faith.

3. Remember as well that, in itself, the possibility that he is an atheist is irrelevant. All that matters is his motive. If/When that is established, we can discuss the implications of that motive with respect to people not related to the case.

[laconicsax]

15. So an unstable nut who did despicable things may have been an atheist. So what?

Are you trying to tie atheism to arson with a bookshelf? Maybe he did it because of books on demon possession or because of the several pairs of brown shoes he owned.

Then again, maybe he did it because of specific grievances that have nothing to do with his bookshelf or closet.

[dmallind]

17. Xian apologists note the difference here

1) This person has not said he acted because of his atheism. It's possible he may. But right now this is counter to many many cases where the perpetrators of various outrages themselves say religion was the motivator (starving kids, not getting medical attention, beating winves or children or gays etc). When they do this, you fall over youraelves trying to suggest the perpetrator was wrong about his own motives. All atheists are doing here is saying there is no motive claimed yet. I can only speak for me of course but if he DOES say "I did it because I'm an atheist" my response will NOT be "Well of course he's just using atheism as a hook for his underlying mental illness because atheism cannot motivate such deeds". It will be "what a fricking idiot".

2) Nobody so far has even hinted that he may not be a "real atheist". This is counter to the laughably predictable no true Scotsman cries that follow every atrocity committed by religious individuals wven when they themselves identify the motive as religious. Fred Phelps is a real Christian guys. If this guy is a real atheist then so be it. My response will NOT be "he's not following the teachings of atheism that say he should make rational decisions and follow utilitarian ethics". It will be "what a fricking idiot".

Why is it so difficult to accept that people who agree with you on religion can be not just fricking idiots but sadistic criminals too? I suspect I know the answer and why the same is rarely true of atheists. We do not claim that atheism is necessary for morality, or for being worthy of some reward either in this life or the next. SInce it's surely obvious to anyone that religiosity does not make people more morally pure or worthy, why not just accept that and say with me of transgressors on your side "What if he is a Christian? He's still a fricking idiot"

[humblebum]

18. Judging from the story in the Dallas Morning News the headline

seems to be biased against atheists. It mentions only one book on atheism and one on demons. Hardly a motive there. And the book on atheism is anything but advocating for violence. If there had been many books on the subjects then perhaps a connection could have been made, but if he was in possession of only two books then that fact says more to me about his character than the subject matter of the books.

"A search of Bourque's home after his arrest recovered books titled Demon Possession and The Atheist's Way.
Also seized from Bourque's residence were a Chinese-made SKS assault rifle, a Ruger 7 mm rifle and two .22-caliber rifles, a GPS and several pairs of brown shoes."

[struggle4progress]

20. It's red meat thrown to conservative wackos in the area -- and they're there aplenty

[laconicsax]

25. So why did you post it?

Why just post the paragraph mentioning the book on atheism and nothing else? Your link isn't even to the article itself. Were you just trying to implicate atheism as motive?

[darkstar3]

29. Yes.

That, and he's trying to prove a point that he can actually discuss something other than atheism in Communist Russia. Not that he ventured very far from his only subject of interest...

Of course, he still hasn't posted an OP about atheism in Communist Russia as I challenged him to do. I wonder why? :think:

[humblebum]

30. Because it would've looked out of place in the drug policy forum. nt

[laconicsax]

33. That's pretty weak.

That's like saying you walked up to a bouncer and paid him to punch you in the gut because that's way better than having paid him to kick you in the groin. You could have elected to do neither. Same thing here--you could have simply not posted a snippet of an article you admit as biased and incomplete.

[humblebum]

35. Also Nietzsche quote on MY SPACE page.

On his Facebook page, Bourque describes himself as a business management major and a fan of bonfires. His MySpace page lists his religion as "Christian-other" and includes a quote from Nietzsche eschewing remorse for wrongdoing.

"Never give way to remorse, but immediately say to yourself: That would merely mean adding a second stupidity to the first. If you have done harm, see how you can do good. If you are punished for your actions, bear the punishment with the feeling that you ARE doing good - by deterring others from falling prey to the same folly," the quote states. "Every evildoer who is punished may feel that he is a benefactor of humanity."

http://www.tri-cityherald.com/2010/02/23/912624/motive-is-elusive-in-church-fires.html

This would indicate that Bourque had read something other than just those two books.

[darkstar3]

36. And the question of why you posted this thread is still unanswered. n/t

[Manifestor_of_Light]

38. The BROWN SHOES made him do it!!!!!!!

A logical conclusion. :D

[struggle4progress]

19. Big frickin deal. This isn't about atheism: it's about arson. I'd guess the true backstory

is that a handful of late adolescents chose pyromania to alleviate their dimbulb boredom. Of course, the Texas Wingnut Convention will be out in force spouting their usual hysteria about whatever: OMG! One of them had a book on atheism! OMG! I heard one of them knew an illegal alien! OMG! Is this related to that cult of devil-worshippers in the 1980s that was abusing children in daycare centers! OMG! See what the feminists have done to our country!

[rug]

21. He wasn't a real atheist.

[dmallind]

28. Very easily could have been, but who cares unless he did it for that reason?

[frogmarch]

22. Books on demons and atheism?

Atheists laugh at people who believe in demons. Atheists don't believe in demons any more than they believe in gods. Pffft.

I wonder why the subject line of the OP states that the suspect had books on atheism but doesn't mention the books he had on demons.

[pokerfan]

23. Church fire suspect had three bibles

http://www.kltv.com/Global/story.asp?S=12039830

[Jim__]

26. They found the bibles in his family home - apparently he didn't live there.

Jason Bourque's family home in Lindale was also searched, yielding a small plastic bag of "suspected" marijuana seeds, more Skechers shoes, and three Bibles.

[muriel_volestrangler]

32. He also had a copy of 'The Creators'

http://www.amazon.com/Creators-History-Heroes-Imagination/dp/0679743758

So I think we need to blame those subversives like Dante, Leonardo, Goethe, Ben Franklin, and Picasso. In fact, best to declare Ben Franklin as responsible for putting bad ideas in everyone's heads.

[jgraz]

24. If he really was an atheist, at least we know he went crazy all on his own.

[Deep13]

39. "...books on demons and atheism ..."

I wouldn't be too quick to draw conclusions. He may have been angry at churches who are too soft on nonbelievers. Anyway, I have weirder shit than that in my house and I've never wanted to burn down a church even as a fleeting idea. I find it discouraging that so many new ones have been built, but it has never sparked an interest in arson. I guess I can't blame the buildings.

[Deep13]

40. Bad news for Southwest Airlines! WTF?

There's no story of a school burning at that link!