Indian nun claims sex is rife within Catholic Church

[moobu2]

An Indian nun has stunned the Catholic Church with a confessional autobiography claiming widespread sexual abuse and bullying within its cloisters.

Bookshops throughout India's Christian communities in Kerala have already sold out of Amen, the autobiography of Sister Jesme, who has alleged that priests and nuns not only broke their vows of celibacy with each other but regularly forced novices to have sex with them.
The Catholic Church in India is mired in a series of sexual controversies, and has only just begun to recover from the dismissal of a senior bishop who "adopted" an attractive 26-year-old female companion as his "daughter".


The book by the former nun reveals how as a young novice she was propositioned in the confession box by a priest who cited biblical references to "divine kisses". Later she was cornered by a lesbian nun at a college where they were teaching. "She would come to my bed in the night and do lewd acts and I could not stop her," she claims.
When she was sent to Bangalore to stay with a priest known for his piety, he lectured her about the need for "physical love" and later assaulted her.
"Back in his room, he tried to fondle me and when I resisted, got up and asked angrily if I had seen a man. When I said no, he stripped himself, ejaculated and forced me to strip," she writes.
According to Sister Jesme, senior church officials twice tried to admit her into rehabilitation clinics and claimed she had mental problems after she complained about the scale of sexual abuse and the number of illicit affairs between nuns and priests.
Dr Paul Thelekkat, a spokesman for the Syro-Malabar Catholic church said he had some sympathy for sister Jesme, and respected her freedom to express her views, but he believed her claims were trivial. "How far what she says is well-founded I can't say, but the issues are not very serious. We're living with human beings in a community and she should realise this is part of human life," he told the Daily Telegraph.

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[GMA]

1. Oh, my gosh, there are bad people in a church.

What a shock.

[jmondine]

13. Next they'll be telling me that rich powerful men in America have mistresses

Shocked... shocked, I tell ya!

[BrklynLiberal]

2. Shocked! I am just shocked, I tell you!!!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[Warpy]

3. Breaking with Rome and abandoning celibacy

is the only way that church is going to survive.

It worked for England and it can work elsewhere.

It won't eliminate the problem since sexual predators love to hide behind the cross, but it will decrease them by providing a larger pool of candidates to choose among.

[Cleita]

4. Humph, I spent ten years living in Catholic institutions and I'm

offended that no one ever wanted to have sex with me. There was a priest who was so gorgeous and charismatic that I would have jumped into the sack with him in a heartbeat, but there was no offer. Apparently, no other men or women I knew who knew him ever had an offer either. Amazing how only a few people have everyone wanting to jump their bones. I would say that this woman does have mental problems.

[CoffeeCat]

6. Wow...

You never experienced sexual behavior between nuns and priests, but anyone who does "has mental problems".

That's...disturbing.

I know many people who have experienced all kinds of horrors and unfortunate circumstances. I can't imagine
dismissing their experiences because I didn't have the same experience--and then branding them as "mentally ill".

[Cleita]

7. No one person has had that many experiences.

It's like she made it up. Until she can pony up some proof for her allegations, I say she has a few screws loose up there. Yes, I know there are people who have had bad experiences at the hand of clergy, but so many????

[TheMadMonk]

17. Yes so many. And probably more besides.

When you are told, and truly believe that "speaking out" is the path to path to eternal damnation then you keep your yap shut and put up with it.

Riddle for me, the bones of thousands of newborn infants that are found on cloistered properties around the world. While you're about it, riddle me the Church's treatment of such infants as so much inconvenient rubbish, in light of the Church's public pronouncements on the sanctity of life. Actually you don't have to. The now abandoned "doctrine of infant damnation" held that without baptism all souls were Satan's. Don't baptise and they can be sent on to their "master" with impunity.


The celibacy of the priesthood had nothing to do with piety and the eschewing of worldly pleasures. It was a blatant property grab on the part of the church. Priests (particularly high ranking ones) would accumulate a fair amount of wealth over their lifetimes, wealth which they would then pass on to their children. By declaring all children of clergy to be bastards and thus ineligible to inherit, the Church set itself up as the only logical inheritor. And by making it essentially impossible for the clergy to pass on their own accumulated wealth, it incentivsed them to accumulate on the Church's behalf, rather than their own.

[charlie]

19. Word...

:thumbsup:

[TheMadMonk]

18. I would be extremely surprised if someone didn't have "mental problems"...

...if they experienced half of what this woman claims. Given innumerable proven instances of abuse and given those infant charnel pits I mentioned in my other post, her claims are most definitely plausible, regardless of lack of cooberating evidence in your personal experience.


That you attack the messenger, rather than the message, tells me exactly where your loyalties lie.

[Christa]

23. There are many, many allegations

She does not have a few screws loose at all. She is telling it as it is.

I know of two monasteries, one in Durban, South Africa, and the other in Windhoek, Namibia with small graves in the back gardens where babies are buried; babies of priests.

Birth control is not acceptable, but apparently murder is.

Maybe you think I have a screw loose as well.

[Cleita]

26. Priests have babies? Now that is crazy thinking unless women are being

allowed into the priesthood. And if you think I have a screw loose to believe that burying babies in monastery yards would be a practice out in the open for every one to know about, you have a screw loose too. I went to parochial school and Catholic boarding school. Priests were hardly ever around except when they came to say mass and hear confessions in the chapel. Then they left. There was practically no chance of sexual encounters without getting caught. The only man living on campus, which also had the motherhouse was an elderly security guard. Was there lesbian activity? Maybe, but we wouldn't know. Our dorms were separate from the nuns. There was among the students and it was consensual. Back then every time I came into contact with non-catholics all these stories were thrown at me. Do the priests and nuns do it? What do they do with babies? We heard they killed them and throw them away? Catholic haters every where love these stories and if some crazy woman in a convent wants to fan the flames Catholic haters love it. I need proof. There is no way in a lifetime that she could have encountered all of these unsavory experiences.

[DeSwiss]

15. Maybe you should have dressed.....

...like an altar boy. Mental problems, eh? Seriously? In my estimation, anyone who believes in this crappy ripoff of a religion (particularly The Catholics) already have serious mental problems.

- Denial being chief among them......

[Cleita]

20. Guess what!

Every time I try to have a rational argument about belief and God, I can have one. Every time I try to have a rational argument about a religious organization that I'm familiar with, it seems I can't have one.

I grew up being accused, as a Catholic, of all kinds of horrendous stuff that I didn't notice going on around me. There was plenty of child abuse going on that I was familiar with that was known as discipline and a good Catholic education that even the Protestant neighbors approved of as well. No one still really talks about that. Sexual abuse is so much more interesting and I guess and I'm sure it goes on not only in Catholic churches but many other denominations. Look at past scandals with church secretaries, etc.with the self-rightious evangalists.

I haven't been a Catholic since the day I could walk away without throwing my life away. However, I have known so many humble nuns who worked for the poor and sick, and priests who helped that I can't throw them away with the bath water.

[DeSwiss]

22. If I had a nickle for every humble nun and priest story I've heard.....

"I have known so many humble nuns who worked for the poor and sick, and priests who helped that I can't throw them away with the bath water."


I can see why you've had difficulty having a rational argument about belief and god. Because that's not possible. Because there is nothing rational about belief or about god. There is no rational discussion possible about a Magic man nor a Magic God. NONE. Not possible. Rationality is about reason. And reason is about facts. And belief isn't about facts, nor reason, nor rationality. And neither is god. So there's your problem right there.

Now about these humble people. They don't need a church to do what they do. Truly humble people can do their jobs anywhere. Because they're humble. They don't need the BS magic either. And they can have just as great an impact in people's lives and in helping people generally if that's what they want to do -- without enabling these monsters who run the The Catholic Church.

You see, the reason why this is, is this: it's all bullshit. That's the first thing one has to come to grips with. And by not addressing this fact doesn't somehow make the rest of the BS okay. Its wrong to ignore the truth and just respond to the parts you want to and that you like. That the part about mental health problems that I mentioned above: DENIAL. So one must deal with that FIRST before you can deal with any of the other.

And this story that these humble people are using: well it's a stolen story. It isn't a Christian story. It isn't a humble story. It's fables - myths. It is stolen stories that belong to others. Another civilization and other people and the Christians with the help of the Roman state just appropriated it for themselves, adulterated and changed it the way they wanted it, and then just made it their own. That does not make it TRUE. Nor does it not make them into anything but plagiarists and thieves. So for these humble people you speak of, anyone's story would do. Or, they can make up their own story with their own god(s) if they want to. But neither a person, nor an institution can begin its life WITH A LIE and then expect any good to come from it. Lies just beget more lies. They grow exponentially.

- So go ahead, throw this baby out with the bathwater. Throw it as hard and as far as you can and then run in the opposite direction......

"You can never change things by resisting the existing reality. To change something,
build a new model that makes the old model obsolete." ~ Buckminster Fuller

[Cleita]

24. You are talking about friends of mine here.

I don't go to church nor do I contribute to it, but I have life long friends of teachers, who taught me, and friends I went to school with who entered the religious life because they believed they could do good. You really slap these people across the face with your platitudes just because they could do it anyway. So as far as you are concerned every good thing done by a priest or nun is worthless because they didn't have to be a religious to do it. I hate every pedophile priest and crazy person who went into the religious life because it provided places for these deviates to hide in, but I feel very bad that they have given a bad name to the truly sincere who believe every sacrifice that they make and good work they perform is for their God. Yes, they do it for God and as far as I'm concerned this is as good a reason as any.

[Christa]

25. Obviously

the ten years you spent in a Catholic School were wasted as you don't know how evil your god is :evilgrin:

[Cleita]

27. You didn't read my post did you. I don't have a God.

The ten years were not wasted as I got a helluva good education and I was able to observe the religious life up close. So when people throw out these baseless allegations, it amounts to nothing more than Catholic hating. Yet, it was religious figures who have created some institutions that we revere today, the great universities of Europe for one, a priest created the Mondragon cooperative alternative to our corporate way of business to help the poor and starving in Basque Spain. In frontier America, it was the Catholic hospital that often was the only one in the area brought to us by various religious orders of nuns. There is much, much more but you know that. And getting away from Catholics, if it weren't for the Salvation Army, most of the homeless in my county wouldn't have had a Thanksgiving dinner nor will they at Christmas.

[Christa]

28. No, I did not

It looked too much like a lot of yaddah, yaddah, yaddah


:popcorn:

[DeSwiss]

30. As you say, these are friends of yours....

...so let's at least agree that you lack true objectivity and just leave it at that. And I am sorry if my criticism and shedding of light upon the vicissitudes of The Church and their duplicitous and rotten history causes more heat rather than illumination. Obviously it was not my intent to "slap" anyone. But when spoken, the truth often feels and sounds like a slap to many. However, I take nothing back that I have said. And in point of fact, given the true history of The Church I feel I am compelled not to cease. As I see it, The Church is a legitimate threat to the freedom and liberty of billions of people. So the volume of my objections will only grow louder and my resolve sterner, as The Church and religions in-general rebel against the restraints that people like myself seek to place upon them. Religions are out of control. If 911 hasn't taught us that, then we've missed the whole point of why happened at all.

If the true nature of The Church is so heinous that the mere mention and recounting of it's history constitutes an assault in your mind, then I can only imagine what it feels like to actually be sexually assaulted by someone that you've been told to entrust your soul to. Only to have them strip you naked and defenseless for their sexual gratification and/or for the physical abuses they are also guilty of, in obtaining slave labor. And then to be plagued with years of anguish and guilt as if what has happened was their own fault. These humble people you refer to may indeed love their god and they may also do many good works, but in their continued support and involvement with this anti-social and evil institution, it only besmirches their acts of kindness and renders them tainted and spoiled by association.

Personally, I'd prefer a society without any religion in it, but I realize that there are many people who need religion because they feel abandoned and alone in the universe without it. But The Church must learn its place. The Church has no rights that I'm obliged to respect, save the right to exist. Only individuals can have rights that must be respected, and The Church is failing to do so. Every time they reject a gay person and in so doing embolden others so that they may justify their hatred, their rejection, their assaults and their killings. Every time a mother dies because of a botched abortion because no doctors are willing to risk their lives to protect those who do exist as opposed to those who are only "potential life." Every time AIDS is contracted by someone because they have adhered to The Church's policy of rejecting the use of condoms -- in all these things they are complicit. Complicit in those deaths and these people's degradation. Because many people feel that they are compelled to follow these religious dictates. They do so because they were raised as children in most cases to believe this way, and so it is second nature for them to never question the religious authorities in their lives.

I too came from a highly religious background. My father was a minister and I grew up in the church. Literally. But I never stopped questioning it either -- nor examining its past and what it stood for. And when I became able, I educated myself as to its background and history -- as I continue to do so -- for almost 40 years now. And I'm speaking of its true history, not the biased reflections that they offer to justify their heinous acts. But from thorough examinations of the facts as they have been assembled and reported upon by historians, archaeologists, and anthropologists. And the reality is that most religious adherents of today don't know their own religion, nor it's history. Which confirms my suspicions that we've all been silent far too long about the duplicity and the lies for which The Church truly stands. And in so ding, we've allowed them to paint a false and rosy picture about who and what they really are.

And as I stated above (and will do so here again), anyone may ignore these facts. But it does nothing to confirm the storyline that The Church has taken over and stolen and now holds up as its own. What humble nuns and priests do becomes irrelevant and all for naught, if the only reason that they do it was for their religion. Because it ain't their religion, but someone else's. So forgive me if I'm not adequately impressed with the good deeds of the supporters of The Church. Because thousands of people do likewise everyday for secular nonprofits all the time with no accolades either. Because your friends don't need a Church, nor an Invisible Friend for them to do the great things you say that they do.

Just the willingness do these things for others because it's the right thing to do, and it is their calling to do it.....

on edit: spelling

[Algorem]

5. Ooh.An Indian nun.That's hot.

[TheCowsCameHome]

8. Is this what priests mean when they claim they're getting nun?

Sorry. I'm feeling silly - too much turkey.

[Tesha]

12. Just don't make it a habit or it's liable to frock you up!

It could cause you a whole host of problems!

Tesha

[formercia]

21. It's just another nasty habit. n/t

[Sarah Ibarruri]

9. Sex is rife everywhere. Sex is rife among Catholics, Protestants, Jews, accountants,

doctors, lawyers, indian chiefs, and I hope sex is rife in my life as well.

[Cirque du So-What]

10. I got my undergrad degree from a small liberal-arts school

that was run by an order of Roman Catholic nuns (won't say which one). One of the sisters (a professor who later became president of the college) and a priest (who was also a professor) lived together openly, de facto husband & wife. Even the bishop was aware of their living arrangement, yet nothing was ever done, seeing that they are still living together all these years later.

Personally, I think it's great that these people are able to make each other happy, but it points out the hypocrisy of church dogma. True, they're not married and no children were born in this relationship, but the well-connected are allowed to flaunt the rules; both of them came from very wealthy families that made sizable contributions to the college and the church over the years.

The church needs to drop the *official* prohibition against married clergy. It's an outdated custom that dates back to medieval times, and it was contrived in order to prevent the title of bishop or cardinal from becoming a hereditary position in church hierarchy. Plus, nobles who rose to high office in the church were more likely to bequeath their estates to the church if they had no legal heirs. Presented as a means of keeping the clergy holier-than-thou, a 'celibate' clergy was a means by which the church expanded its holdings and ensured that a culture of clandestine relationships developed, culminating in the child molestation cases the with which the church now finds itself saddled.

[formercia]

11. The Nuns in the Boys' School my parents sent me to

used to have a grand old time.

[juno jones]

14. It the hypocrisy, silly.

I could care less what they do, but as long as their dogma rails about the purity of the virginal state and vilifies contact between consenting adults whilst taking upon themselves the role of the divinely ordained intercessor (at least in their credo) and blocking direct comprehension of godhead from those not-so-holy, I'm gonna relish when these holier-than-thou bastards get called out for doing 'what every other human does'.

[DeSwiss]

16. Darn it! I missed this one.....

...back in February. But I was in the hospital when it was published, so I'll let myself off this time.

But you have to know that The Catholics have probably spent all their time since then, trying to undermine and destroy this woman's reputation and her account of these sexual encounters. This organization (The Catholic Church) should be banned. It is little more than a criminal enterprise made up mostly of pedophiles in colorful dresses.

There was a time when I tried to show respect for religions. But that time has long since passed. Why? Because these people ARE DANGEROUS.

And their adherents failure to hold them truly accountable and to http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/11/26/irish-catholic-church-cov_n_371601.html">continue their support of these criminals and their criminal organizations, in my mind makes them little more than pedophile-enablers who refuse to acknowledge the truth. In the same manner in which they ignore the truth about the bogus nature of religion in-general. But it's one thing to put oneself in harm's way through one's own stupidity and fear of the truth. It's quite another to put innocent children in harm's way and then ignore what has happened and allow it to continue.

- JUST SAY NO TO THEOCRACY!!!

K&R

[ZombieHorde]

29. More and more I love de Sade. Everything the RCC has been doing, he described 100s of years ago. nt

[onager]

31. Reminds me of a great movie line

True Confessions, Robert Duvall to an annoying nun:

"Sister, may all your sons grow up to be Jesuits."

:rofl: