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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-04 02:14 PM
Original message
So who did you vote for?
Seems to me that a first comprehensive action by the Democratic Party needs to involve a national/local coordinated campaign to ask some fundemental questions of it's constituents. How to accomplish this?

How about sending a postcard to each registered Democratic voter in the country with the following questions:

(1) Who did you vote for?
(2) What Party were you enrolled in on 11/2/04?
(3) What is your most important domestic priority?
(4) What is your most important international priority?
(5) What changes and actions do you want Congressional Democrats to undertake, starting in January?

I'd make these questionnaires available to Republicans, too. I doubt we can expect any support from rabid Bush Republican supporters...but perhaps there are more than a few Kerry Republicans who are interested in knowing if their vote was counted properly in this election.

Coordinate the collection with Democratic notary publics and local activists to get this information back for collation, analysis, and publication.

We can no longer expect Republican corporate media or biased polling companies to deliver our message to/from the Democratic leadership. We need to pipeline our communication more directly so we can get our own answers and insight on this election.

Secret ballots and a criminal party that controls the machines to record the vote, the process to count it, and the media to announce it ; it's a recipe for a bloodless transition to a fascist, totalitarian country.




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whistle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-04 02:21 PM
Response to Original message
1. Yes and do this state by state with a random telephone poll. . .
Edited on Mon Nov-29-04 02:22 PM by whistle
. . .by an independent polling company to yield results that are at the 99% confidence level with a +/-1.0% error. So what if it means 50,000 or 100,000 interviews, the country needs to know. Hey, doesn't the University of Michigan have a national telephone bank research center? They would be a good resource along with other non-partisan universities to do this survey. Could be designed, field work completed and results tabulated in three to four weeks and be the New Year's gift to America.
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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-04 02:26 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. I think we need to have signed affidavits.
The RW corporate media will question the results unless they are legally signed. Would take longer, but it would be far more forceful in the court of public opinion.

Sorta like a 2nd election where we get to assure ourselves of who we (in the largest possible sense) voted for.

Did we lose or did we win? These results will confirm either way. If we lost, so be it.....it means we got a lot of work to do before 2006. If we won, well, that changes everything, I think.
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whistle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-04 02:37 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. Affidavits signed by who? The polling organization. . .
. . .certainly not by the participants in the polls. That would violate confidentiality. However, as I understand how these telephone surveys work, it is possible to listen in and monitor interviews either in real time or taped (with informed consent) so that reviewers could always check the sources and validate that procedures and other controls were in place. As for doing such a survey in selected counties, that could work as a pilot survey, pick say four counties in Florida, four in Ohio and four others around the country. Run the surveys, check against the reported results and continue to do this until the American people are satisfied that the election outcome was as it was reported. Maybe do this by eliminating the military results, I don't know, but it must be done before the memories of voters start to fade here.
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jamboi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-04 02:56 PM
Response to Reply #5
9. Great idea! n/t
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Ganja Ninja Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-04 02:25 PM
Response to Original message
2. It's a great idea.
I don't understand why the Democratic party isn't doing it in some of the smaller counties in Florida. Some of those counties have less than 10,000 voters with a majority of them being Democrats yet voting for Bush. It shouldn't be that hard to check out a couple of them.
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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-04 02:30 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. Agreed.
Do it in phases. Start a small comprehensive canvass of selected precincts in Ohio, Florida. Scale it up to selected princints in all states....then complete it nationally.

The database/information that the Democratic leadership would get would be a most powerful weapon. It would send a signal to us that they are motivated to work for our interests and provide a foundation to start taking back this country.
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WMoses Donating Member (19 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-04 02:46 PM
Response to Original message
6. Excellent Idea...
Only, I've been a registered Republican for the last 30 years. Even so, I have been falling away from voting anything republican for the last 12 years (about the time the religious right started taking over the Republican agenda).

I would still love to receive one of those cards.

I voted for Kerry and can not fathom how Bush supposedly got the "majority" vote.
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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-04 02:56 PM
Response to Reply #6
8. Welcome aboard WMoses!
As I note in my initial thread, I'd certainly want to get everyone the opportunity to participate in this survey. It would not be in the interests for the Bush Republicans to spoil their survey, but I'm sure you, as a registered Republican wnat to know your vote counted as well.

In fact, I really want to know how many Kerry Republicans are out there. Seems to me, it is easier to "fix" a registered Republican vote than a Democratic registered vote from a macro standpoint.

What if 50% of all Republicans voted for Kerry? That would mean Kerry got the overwhelming mandate.
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newyawker99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-04 07:46 PM
Response to Reply #6
13. Hi WMoses!!
Welcome to DU!! :toast:
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passy Donating Member (780 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-04 02:50 PM
Response to Original message
7. that sounds like a TV show , here is another suggestion
Edited on Mon Nov-29-04 02:52 PM by passy
The American people are naive, complacent, sheep with their heads stuck in their TV-trough.
Half of the programming is about money, how money will make you more beautiful, how it will make you more attractive to the opposite sex, how it will make you lie to your friends, your family or your partner, it will also let you sell your soul to the evil green giant (personified by Trump).
But Trump is a sissy. Imagine Rumsfeld or Cheney doing the show, wouldn't it be funny watching all those grown men cry.
Which brings us to "Elections '04 - winning it for the Man", premiering on Nov 2nd. Watch how Karl Rove and his henchmen attempt to rig the presidential elections for the Man without getting caught. Laugh as the Democrats scratch their heads trying to understand what went wrong with GOTV. Chuckle as we dive into the murky world of the Blogs where the tin-hat men reside. We will also bring you coverage of how our Man is doing. Watch as he continues to destroy the infidels on his heroic crusade, whilst on the home front he repels those demonic fetus killers with the might of the Law.
And don't miss the finale on http://www.presidentinauguration.com/index.shtml">Jan 20th.
Will Karl succeed? Will the Man become the true ruler of the New World Order or will all the nasty evil-doers be the sticks in the spokes of his victory chariot?
All this and much more in TV-history's most anticipated show "Elections '04"!
The best thing about it is that you can watch it on all the channels or not.
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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-04 03:00 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. Apparently 117MM or so managed to pull themselves away from the tube
on 11/2/04 to vote. What we don't really know is who they voted for.

Personally, I'd like to see the next reality TV series on Court TV...."Crimes Against America: Republicans on Trial"

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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-04 03:34 PM
Response to Original message
11. kick
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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-04 04:47 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. kick2
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Laura PourMeADrink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-04 08:03 PM
Response to Original message
14. I like it -- But why not start very small for instant proof
Pick a precinct -- one that is likely to be in the fraud pool and canvas THOSE voters.

This makes all the sense in the world -- if we find 500 people that voted for Kerry and will maybe sign a statement and the official result is 400 for Kerry -- There you have it -- instant proof.
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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-04 08:40 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. Most definitely......
Start with a few suspected precincts. Then scale it up. The more we find, the more compelling our case is.
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g9udit Donating Member (24 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-04 09:01 PM
Response to Original message
16. LET'S RESTART PHONE BANKS TO VERIFY THE VOTE

Great idea !

I think we can restart the phone banks and do targeted
calls in suspect precincts to verify this.

I sent Move on the below email message awhile back suggesting
this, but I got no reply.

However, I still think this idea will work.

But we have to start it NOW, since Dec. 7th is creeping !

Any thoughts on this ?

Dave, The Mad Dem

p.s. Below is the email I sent to Move On
All,

There is a pragmatic method we can use to Verify both E Voting
and Optical Scan Vote Counts in Ohio and Florida, which can give
the Kerry Legal team the means to challenge the reported counts
for Ohio and/or Florida, and to win the Ohio recount, by proving
that many local precinct counts are incorrect.

We already have in place the resources, organization,
volunteers, data, and phone banks to do this,
since we will simply be doing the same phone bank calling that
ACT, Move On, People for the American Way, Common Cause,
and so many other groups were doing to get the Vote out for Kerry.

We need to have Move On's Leave No Voter Behind organization, ACT, and the other groups that did Voter Outreach, to recontact their phone bank
volunteers for the explicit purpose of making Post Election calls, but targeting only specific precincts or counties in Florida and Ohio that reported questionable voting totals,
meaning precincts or counties with a high percentage of Registered Democrats, but with a high percentage of reported Votes cast for Mr. Bush.

Once we have the phone banks back up, we would call every registered voter in the targeted Precinct/County and ask them the following 3 questions:

1) Were you happy with the Results of the Presidential Election ?
2) Are you pleased that George Bush got re-elected?
3) And, If you don't mind, can you tell me if you voted for Mr. Bush or for Mr. Kerry ?

While many people will not answer question 3, their responses to questions 1 and 2 will obviously give us that answer, and tell us who that person voted for.

We then record that Vote on the Phone banks computer system, just the way we did before the election, and continue calling that precinct until we've
called every registered voter there.

This may sound like a large logistical task, but it's actually small compared to what Move On and ACT did before the election, when 500 Move On Field
Organizers oversaw phone calls to hundreds of thousands, if not millions of voters.

I realize we will need a stated purpose for this survey, but I would simply call it a 'Post Election Survey to evaluate Voter outreach efficiency'.

If we target 10 counties, 5 in Ohio, 5 in Florida, with an average number of 10,000 registered Voters in each county, that's 'only' 100,000 voters called,
a far fewer number than Move On , ACT, and others did before the election.

So this is a VERY practical achievable project.

As a guideline, I would suggest that we contact precincts/counites that have over 65 % registered Democrats, but whose Vote totals were
reported as more than 60 % for Mr. Bush, and where there are less than 10,000 registered voters.

In Florida's Baker County, for example, there were 12,887 registered voters, 69.3% of them Democrats and only 24.3% of them Republicans, yet
the reported vote count in Baker County was only 2,180 for Kerry and 7,738 for Bush, the opposite of what would be expected.

Move On, ACT, and the other phone banks could probably call all 12,887 registered Voters in Baker County in a few days.

And wouldn't it be interesting, if the survey shows that 7,000 of those 12,000 voted for Kerry, instead of the 2,180 Kerry votes that were reported ?

While it would take a few days to get the phone banks back up and functional, if we started making calls by Monday, Nov. 22nd, we could probably
complete calls for 10 targeted areas ( total of 100,000 voters ) by the end of November.

And once we have that data complied, we turn it over to the Legal team, which can use it to demand a recount and and Investigation of both Ohio and Florida.

If you think this idea has merit, PLEASE pass it on to other Move On, ACT, and Kerry campaign staff members who can help restart up the Phone Banks
for 2 to 3 weeks, to make the post election phone calls, and to get us the data we need to prove that both Ohio and Florida were stolen from Kerry.

I don't know the Voting breakdown for all of Ohio's counties, but I have seen the breakdown for Florida's counties, and Jefferson, Liberty, and Calhoun are just 3 Florida counties which meet the above criteria, and which I strongly suspect, direct post election calls to voters would show that the reported counts were grossly in error,
since they all used Optical Scanners to record votes :

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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-04 09:30 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. I agree....but who to contact?
This should be an obvious course of action driven from the top down. Maybe get this onto AAR?

Validating the results for or against is equally important. We have to trust the election results.

As the Great Communicator once said: "Trust, but verify."
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marions ghost Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-30-04 12:32 PM
Response to Reply #16
22. Ditto, great idea
DO these groups already in place really have the resources and concern to mobilize to this degree I wonder? It could be done regardless if deadlines pass. The issues of voting validity are bigger than this one election. Could be a combined effort of several groups over a period of time.

OK I've got the concept, but not the how. Never mind. Get the idea out to the groups. Even if they don't take action immediately, they can ponder it for future implementation.

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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-30-04 12:49 PM
Response to Reply #22
23. Thanks......
I'm thinking DFA might be the right group to take this on.....I'm not real connected with any organization, so I'm hoping someone sees this and starts the fire. It would be a constructive and positive signal that we have the firepower to pull this off.

We have to validate the results of this election or we'll drive ourselves collectively insane wondering "what if".....
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Twist_U_Up Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Nov-29-04 11:48 PM
Response to Original message
18. KICK
KICK
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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-30-04 03:01 AM
Response to Reply #18
19. thanks!
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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-30-04 11:36 AM
Response to Original message
20. kick
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molly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-30-04 12:13 PM
Response to Original message
21. Great idea!
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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-30-04 12:50 PM
Response to Reply #21
24. Thanks Molly!
:hi:
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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-01-04 09:42 PM
Response to Original message
25. one more time....
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kerry2win Donating Member (321 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-01-04 10:16 PM
Response to Original message
26. small example of the so-called mandate
http://bushwon.peel.net/ online poll can't get total votes though but Kerry at 50.9 and * at 49.1 just about what we figured. I sure this poll is wrong also though.
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Left Brain Donating Member (895 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-02-04 03:24 AM
Response to Original message
27. kick
:kick:
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Old and In the Way Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-02-04 05:05 PM
Response to Reply #27
28. Thank you....
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