93,000 extra votes in Cuyahoga County

[xpat]

Holy Moses!!

http://www.rise4news.net/extravotes.html

[Vincardog]

1. Kick

[BlueDog2u]

2. Ohio Vote Count experts on DU....

Are these numbers correct? Is there any wiggle room? Please, those of you have who extensive experience --- and I know you are here, for you've been feeding us stats like crazy -- what is *your* reaction to this? Is this the straw that will break the Camel Blackwell's scheming?

[Imperialism Inc.]

12. No this is not true.

Someone posted it below, but essentially the absentee votes for multi-precinct races are all dumped in to one precinct by the software used. The detailed, by precinct, data does exist.

[xpat]

17. That argument doesn't wash

If absentee ballots are counted separately, there should be LESS votes showing in a precinct, not MORE!

Here's an egregious example:

REGISTERED VOTERS, ORANGE CSD: 11640
BALLOTS CAST, ORANGE CSD: 22931

DIFFERENCE: 11291 MORE votes cast than registered voters.

What does this have to do with absentee ballots?

If there were 100% turn out with 10% voting absentee, the ballots cast would be 10476, while the difference (1164) would have been lumped in the absentee total.

[Imperialism Inc.]

21. It isn't an 'argument' it is a fact.

There are lots of precincts not in the list that is linked. The absentee votes from those precincts have been added to the vote totals of the ones that are.
Why is there suddenly a bunch of people posting this long resolved issue tonight? Is this an effort to discredit those claiming vote fraud by including this bad info? to make them look like fools?

[xpat]

23. Absentee ballots are listed separately on the site.

There are 80624 of them.

[xpat]

25. I followed the logic of this explanation.

With your explanation in mind, I threw out all the sub-districts (WD1, DST1, CSD, LSD, etc.)

After the clean-up, these are the election districts that remain:
BAY VILLAGE
BEACHWOOD
BEDFORD
BEDFORD HEIGHTS
BENTLEYVILLE VIL
BEREA
BRATENAHL VIL
BRECKSVILLE
BROADVIEW HEIGHTS
BROOK PARK
BROOKLYN
BROOKLYN HEIGHTS VIL
CHAGRIN FALLS TWP
CHAGRIN FALLS VIL
CLEVELAND
CLEVELAND HEIGHTS
CUYAHOGA HEIGHTS VIL
EAST CLEVELAND
EUCLID
FAIRVIEW PARK
GARFIELD HEIGHTS
GATES MILLS VIL
GLENWILLOW VIL
HIGHLAND HEIGHTS
HIGHLAND HILLS VIL
HUNTING VALLEY VIL
INDEPENDENCE
LAKEWOOD
LINNDALE
LYNDHURST
MAPLE HEIGHTS
MAYFIELD HEIGHTS
MAYFIELD VIL
MIDDLEBURG HEIGHTS
MORELAND HILLS VIL
NEWBURGH HEIGHTS VIL
NORTH OLMSTED
NORTH RANDALL VIL
NORTH ROYALTON
OAKWOOD VIL
OLMSTED FALLS
OLMSTED TWP
ORANGE VIL
PARMA
PARMA HEIGHTS
PEPPER PIKE
RICHMOND HEIGHTS
ROCKY RIVER
SEVEN HILLS
SHAKER HEIGHTS
SOLON
SOUTH EUCLID
STRONGSVILLE
UNIVERSITY HEIGHTS
VALLEY VIEW VIL
WALTON HILLS VIL
WARRENSVILLE HEIGHTS
WESTLAKE
WOODMERE VIL


Then, I eliminated all that had more ballots that registered voters. By you explanation, these are precincts and their results should be accumulated at a higher level. Then, I added the total of ballots cast at the remaining higher level election districts. This figure should be the total number of ballots cast (665334). Guess what. The total number of votes for the higher level districts is only 604430. Where are the 61,000 other votes?

[rwork]

3. And Paul Begala

is telling Democrats to get over it.

[BlueDog2u]

4. Kick!

[danostuporstar]

5. this is...

old and debunked unfortunately

[Doremus]

6. Not True

From the Cuyahoga Elections Board website:

Explanation of Ballots Cast Totals on this page and the Summary Report
In even-numbered years, the Cuyahoga County Board of Elections tallies absentee ballots by Congressional, House, and Senate district combinations. Because of this, the ballots cast totals for municipalities on this web page and on the summary report needs to be derived by using the following technique: For municipalities with wards, find the ballots cast total for each ward and total them. For municipalities without wards, please refer to the contest of interest on the canvass report. Absentee ballots cast totals appear separately at the end of each contest on the canvass report. If you have any questions, please contact the Board of Election’s Ballot Department Manager at [phone].


There are not more votes than voters.

[BlueDog2u]

9. Thank You

For the clarification.

I was suspicious that it would be that easy to prove anything this big.

[troubleinwinter]

7. "explanation"?

I read that the elections officer's explanation of these discrepancies is that the "ballots cast" indicates an overlap of senate and congressional districts. It is something to take into account and question. ??????

[unpossibles]

8. I think these numbers have been "debunked" by OH

...but I don't really buy their explanation, which is the provisional and absentee ballots were accidentally lumped in with other counties, etc.

Still sounds fishy to me. And ironically, by some figures I've seen, 93,000 is almost the exact number Kerry would need.

Again, the jury is out on this one still, so no hopes up or down. I'm sure if we know about it, so do others who are investigating. On the other hand though, we should keep things like this in mind.

ABC is one of the debunkers for this however, so keep that in mind.

[Solitaire]

11. thank you, I must have been typing while you were posting :)

[Solitaire]

10. ??

is this true or not, please?

[cyn2]

13. Outdated info

Article is from 11-12-04.
I believe this is the one that KO talked about. This county has different counting methods on odd numbered years and even numbered years. And they add in absentee some weird way.

I'm not positive, but I think this is the one.

[EndElectoral]

20. Anyone know the rationale of counting differently in odd and even years?

[Hobbes199]

22. Probably just miswording

They probably meant that it would only manifest in even numbered years. Probably.

[Imperialism Inc.]

14. Not true.

[msgadget]

15. Please go look at this page:

http://boe.cuyahogacounty.us//BOE/results/currentresults1.htm#0531 and in the dropdown that says, 'Select a Contest', choose President and Vice President. This is what it said when I looked (and printed it out!) :



PRESIDENT AND VICE-PRESIDENT
Vote for 1 (With 1458 of 1458 precincts counted)
MICHAEL BADNARIK/RICHARD V. CAMPAGNA 1828 0.28%

GEORGE W. BUSH/DICK CHENEY 215624 33.05%

JOHN F. KERRY/JOHN EDWARDS 433262 66.41%

CANDIDATE DISQUALIFIED 0 0.00%

MICHAEL A. PEROUTKA/CHUCK BALDWIN 1667 0.26%

Edit: I just read some of the previous posts and the site, which explained the weird odd/even way of counting. Still, if the other person won, wouldn't his totals still be higher than his oppent's? I have no hopes, just curious.

[KoKo]

18. No...it's outdated info...they corrected it. (eom)

[msgadget]

19. Thanks so much,

for answering. If they corrected it, is it public yet? Before now I thought tabulating votes to be a very straightforward task - guess not!

[BamaBecky]

16. The Re-Count should settle our uneasiness over their explanation

I looking for them to find a big stack of "you know what" over in a dark corner somewhere.:P

[jimmyp]

24. I don't think I can take much more of this

Hope - despair - hope - despair ...