Hillary Clinton will never set foot in the White House again

[derby378]

She voted No on the motion to disqualify the Ohio electors. This is truly sad.

I know a lot of people love her, and sometimes she has astounded me with her courage and her intestinal fortitude. But we needed her now more than ever, and she didn't come through.

Howard Dean in 2008!

[andyhappy]

1. intestinal fortitude?

was she in a pie eating contest or something? :)

[Shakespeare]

3. You've never heard that expression before? n/t

[Gothic Sponge]

2. I'm done with 90% of the Dems

I'm a dem at heart, but my party has left.

[derby378]

4. The Dems need to take a cue from the 1994 Repubs

Out with the old, in with the new. Get Howard Dean in the chairman's seat at the DLC or the DNC, and then prep him for a 2008 run.

Of course, if Wesley Clark wants to run again, too, I'd be willing to support him. He may have more pull among red-state voters.

[bunny planet]

42. Not done with Dems, just with most of the ones we've got in there now.

Nothing to do but work at the local level to build a progressive party of Democrats. I'll be going to Meet-ups every chance I get now. This Democratic party has got to understand that what they did today just was not good enough. Senator Boxer is a hero. The House members that voted yea are heroes. John Conyers is a hero. Time for more heroes, we are way overdue for some.

[Borgnine]

5. She almost lost me with the IWR vote.

As did Kerry, but I swallowed my own personal feelings and looked away for the greater good of getting Bush out of the White House. Well, after Kerry proved himself to be ineffectual and worthless, I say no more. I'm tired of the same crap from our Democrats, year after year after year. The party needs a shakeup. We need people with the determination of the Republicans, not the morals of the Republicans.

[derby378]

6. Well said, Borgnine!

I'm kicking this thread just for you...

[derby378]

7. Kick! (n/t)

[NewYorkerfromMass]

8. Hillary no, Dean yes.

got it. eom.

[Snivi Yllom]

36. YES!

[seabeyond]

9. i take back my take back

when i heard all pat her on the back for standing up and speaking out, i took back my ugly to her of the last couple days. she didnt stand up, so i take back my take back

[derby378]

11. What a pity

All her activism and social crusades ever since the 1970s - thrown away on that single vote. I'm deeply saddened.

[seabeyond]

15. but it isnt her single vote

i have watched her and build play us in the support of bushies. i dont like it. i dont like when we have a person running agianst bush adn they come out and a little sentence amounts to huge support in say..........bush lieing in going to iraq, ect.......

many times i have listened to her speak, and wished she was more on the side she is asking for the vote of

i thought it awfully arrogant a couple days ago seriously she says she hadnt heard about election fraud. what i say. a lie in my face. how dare she do it straight faced

bill ..........bush won fair and square, both to do right before the 6th

[imenja]

10. Where has Dean been on the election problems?

I've heard NOTHING from him and I've asked several times on DU.

[derby378]

13. The DLC doesn't want you to pay attention to him

He's too much of a threat to the old-boy network.

[imenja]

14. so give me an example of what he has said

a link, something. You are blaming the DLC for keeping Dean quiet? Give me a break. He is responsible for himself. I'd love to be shown wrong on this. I supported Dean. But I'm disappointed to have heard nothing.

[GreenArrow]

20. he's keeping his options open?

Waiting to see which side is winning.

[Name removed]

12. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[juajen]

16. Barbara Boxer in 2008

N/T

[Name removed]

21. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[spooked911]

28. yeah baby!

[NVMojo]

17. hey, she gave one hell of a speech ...

[papau]

24. My rule is if you did not speak out - forget about 08 - Hill is still OK

with me!

:-)

[NickiWitch]

48. They only needed 1...

and I think that they made their point quite well!

I think Hillary did an outstanding job....so did everyone else who stood up for democracy today!

She has my vote if she runs in 08!

Peace!!

[Fred_Fury]

18. shes a rethugliKKKan in Democrat clothing

If she runs im either moving to Canada or voting green.

[democracyindanger]

19. excellent analysis

you should start a blog.

[spooked911]

27. she's not THAT bad, but she's a slightly right-tilting democrat like Bill

[marcologico]

22. courage has never been a Clinton strong suit

They're "triangulators," remember?

[imenja]

23. Still waiting for evidence of Dean speaking out on the election

Why Dean over Hillary on this issue? Has he really earned it?
I say this as a supporter of Dean in the primary. Let's not create mythical heroes.

[zann725]

25. That's okay. Boxer will!

n/t

[rodeodance]

26. I do not blame her. You head how the Repugs demonized others

today. I say she did the right thing for now.

[robbedvoter]

29. yeah! She is more important than democracy, non??

:eyes:

[iconoclastNYC]

30. I hope someone strong challenges her in the primary

We can change the Democratic party by voting in the primaries for true democrats and fighting the lunacy of the DLC

[ClassWarrior]

31. George W. Bush** will never set foot in the White House again.

REMEMBER WHO'S THE ENEMY, PEOPLE.

NGU.

[molly]

32. Does HD actually have a POLITICAL job right now?

maybe if he decides to RUN for something, he will do the smart thing and unseal his records.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

33. before that vote she was my Senator ...never again& that goes for Chuckie

too

[FreepFryer]

34. Please explain how insisting on ubiquity in the Senate helps us.

We needed one vote.

Does Hillary not putting her already controversial self in front of the GOP hatewagon really make you sad?

Missed opportunity to abuse her?

[sunnystarr]

35. Notice that ALL Repukes voted NAY and stuck together....

Why did 86 Dems vote nay leaving only 33 voting yay?? Where is the solidarity in the Dem party?? Why was Boxer left to stand alone with the only yay vote in the Senate? If Dems want a lesson the Repukes just gave it them. STICK TOGETHER!!

[foo_bar]

37. wouldn't Dean have voted the same way?

Rhetorical question of course, but there's little evidence his actions would differ from Bernie Sanders or Pat Leahy on the subject.

[imenja]

40. not just rhetorical

I've not heard word one from Dean on this, and I've continually asked his die hard supporters (I was one in the primary) for something in which he has spoken about the election. No one provides anything. He hasn't even given us rhetoric. Why exalt him over Hillary on this particular issue?

[Freddie Stubbs]

38. Senators usually get invited to state dinners at

the White House.

[marcologico]

39. Practically speaking, they only needed one vote, so it's not a big deal

that Hillary didn't also vote for it. Symbolically of course it was very important, just like Kerry's IWR vote.

But I wouldn't hold it against her -- she's got to get reelected just like everybody else. Boxer has six years to worry about reelection.

p.s. that was also Kerry's reason -- to win the Iowa primary. Edwards voted for it too and he came in 2nd.

[jayctravis]

41. She gave a great speech, however.

She's not burning bridges, but Boxer proved she has bigger cojones.

[derby378]

43. It may have been a good speech...

...but actions speak louder than words. Especially today.

[imenja]

44. What were Deans actions? Or even his words?

Help me out here. I see a double standard at work.

[MakeItSo]

45. Hillary was pro-Iraq, pro Kerik and now pro-fraud

She doesn't have the political acumen that her husband did in his ability to balance on top of the fence without falling over. The right hates her and now the left will.

[imenja]

46. Hey, I appreciated and supported Dean on the war

and objected to Hillary on that issue. But here were are talking about election problems. Dean has been silent. I don't see a reason to include an exaltation of him in the context of this issue.
The man is not even up for election. He has all the freedom in the world to speak on this issue. I like Dean on many many issues, but I am disappointed in him here.

[derby378]

47. I'm not saying that Dean spoke up...

I would have liked to hear something, too. But from what I've experienced from him so far, I still trust him as a candidate more than the current crop on the Hill.

[FreepFryer]

49. Another Hillary Bash. Shame on you! Vote how you want, but give it a rest

[Laura PourMeADrink]

50. Here's what Dean said in an interview about fraud..

Here's the link, but I copied all that was relevent..

http://peopleforchange.net/commentaries/hdinterview

Q: OK, I’ll get right to it, then. Many in the party were extremely disheartened to see voting irregularities worsen instead of improve in this past cycle, and in light of the stories we’ve seen coming out of Ohio and Florida, what do you think Democrats can do to restore faith in the system? Do you feel that you can take the lead in this issue? It was certainly the number one topic at the last group of meetings that DFA had.
HD: I think we need to focus on election officials. County Clerks, Secretaries of State in particular, because the Republicans have been so partisan in exercising their responsibility to help people vote, they‘ve in fact tried to suppress turnout instead of encourage it. Secondly, we, I think we need to try to get laws passed, by referendum if necessary, that says that no voting machines in a particular state or jurisdiction may be used unless they can be recounted by hand. Oregon has such a statute because Bill Bradbury (Oregon’s Secretary of State) got one passed in 2001. We should try to state by state overhaul the election process both by referendum and by electing where possible Democratic Secretaries of State and County Clerks.
Q: In other words, just seizing the thing locally is the way to go….
HD. Well, obviously, we’re not going to get rid of the Bush Administration for the next four years and this Congress wants to suppress votes instead of increase them. So I think the local venue is the best thing we can do.
Q: Do you think it’s too much to hope for that we’ll get any kind of media coverage regarding the Bush Administration’s active plan of disenfranchisement through basically ill equipping the polls, all those shenanigans that were pulled, do you think…
A Well, in order to do that you have to have some proof that that actually happened and while I think suspicion are well justified, we don’t actually have proof that there was a plan to do that, and until we have some proof, it’s not likely that we’re going to get much media coverage. There is a lot of circumstantial evidence and I think we are getting some media coverage on the circumstantial evidence, for example the over vote, Cuyahoga County, The addition of 3500 votes that didn’t exist before the balloting even started, on some of those electronic touch screen voting machines, those things we have to be concerned about, and I think we can get press on them.