The Chessman strikes again.

[Raven]

This isn't the greatest HCR bill in the history of the world but there is a long way to go and this is a beginning. I suspect that Obama has known how this was going to go and has a good grasp of the future. The ice has been broken...HCR is now in the country's lexicon...people are beginning to realize what they don't have and how they are paying through the nose for what they don't have. BUT BEST OF ALL...I think the HC Insurance Industry shot it's foot (and its wad) today...their gun is empty. That's my take on all of this so far.

[CaliforniaPeggy]

1. I hope you're right, my dear Raven...

How much I hope!


BTW......how was your weekend?

:party:

[Raven]

8. Oh, Peg...it was a perfectly beautiful wedding! Beautiful Fall day

in New Hampshire, nothing went wrong, beautiful service that was simple and heartfelt and then the reception was a blast. It could not have been better! We'll post pictures when we get organized. Thanks for asking.

[annabanana]

23. (yay & congrats to the Happy Couple). . . . .n/t

[thereismore]

2. Yes, people know that HCR is happening. Now it's just a question how good it's going to be. nt

[vaberella]

7. And this is where the American people come in and push back to force the PO to be amazing.

To make sure to push back on making sure the Health Insurance companies are under serious regulations and fuckin' New Rules so we can get rid of fraud and lower the costs for people---this goes double for the clowns who make up Big Pharma. We now need to make sure our Congressman are working on this and pushing a substantive bill through.

[dionysus]

3. hear hear!

[WeDidIt]

4. But Raven, this IS the greatest HCR bill in the history of the USA

because for the first time in the history of the USA, an HCR bill goes to a conference committee to hash out the differences in the five versions.

[depakid]

10. If it comes out anything like the bill folks are crowing about....

this will be a Pyhrric victory indeed.

[Oregone]

11. The less "radical" the bill, the more likely it will reach this stage

Thats an odd measure of "greatest"

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

12. Uh huh.

That's why I support ultra radical bills that have no chance of reaching this stage.

Nothing says greatest like non-existant.

[Oregone]

13. Thats a funny, extreme position to take

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

14. Extremist? Nah.

I think even small children can recognize that good is better than nothing.

[rudy23]

15. But is this bill "good"? That's the question.

Grownups (and some children :) ) will wrestle over the definition of "good", and hopefully it will resemble our definition, too.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

21. Even little children also know...

the parable about the fox and the sour grapes.

[Oregone]

17. "Good" is relative I guess

[vaberella]

5. You're talking about just this?! I'm ready to call him the, Messiah.

Only because I read recently that Graham is working with Kerry on a Climate change bill. WTF?! Was my reaction. So on that bill it will definitely make it through the Senate with maybe 3-4 Repubs on board for that one. That's one DUzy, for sure. HRC is still struggling, make no doubt about that..but this was a decent move and he said we'll expect a vote on a merged bill in future and he said 5 bills...so I'm sure he expected this to make it through.

[Clio the Leo]

22. Here, you can share my..........

..... objects of veneration ...









And who can forget, the GREATEST piece of journalism that Faux News has ever done!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0drwfnGlF_E


Verily, WHO IS this child? That he opens our hearts and minds to the audacity of HOPE!.... and for as long as the child held his hands aloft, the enemy suffered great blows

[lamp_shade]

6. K&R

[Oregone]

9. 17.82 dimensional chest

I can't wait for the end result of universal healthcare after the Gephart Schism of 2046 and the Bohner Revolution of 2073. We have a genius chestmaster at the helm.

[TheCoxwain]

16. I could never understand the concept of fractional dimensions

we briefly discussed Cantor sets in my class..

To me an object can only exist in n dimensions { n belongs to N and n >= 0 } ..as it is I have a hard time visualizing beyond 3 dimensions - but at least the math is straight forward.

What the fuck is a fractional dimension?

Maybe Obama knows all about it.

[Oregone]

18. Ask him, he is the master

I would assume its a dimension with a finite plane.

[vaberella]

19. He's apparently from Krypton, after all.

:rofl: I love these sort of cracks on super powers.

[SIMPLYB1980]

20. Let's all play!

http://www.ajugarya.com/juego-308-obama-chess.html

[impik]

24. There WILL be a public option, and all

those idiots who *still* haven't learn not to underestimate Barack Obama, will be left scratching their heads. Once again.

Sen. Jay Rockefeller (D-WV) told MSNBC this afternoon that President Obama "wants to come in hard" on health care reform now that the Senate Finance Committee has voted on their version of the bill.

Rockefeller said he spoke with the President today. MSNBC anchor Ed Schultz challenged him, asking why Obama spoke so highly of the Finance Committee's bill, when it doesn't include a public option.

"He's the President, you gotta cut him some slack. He's an inside player," Rockefeller said. "Don't worry about that. He wants the public option. He wants MedPAC. ... Now that the Finance Committee is finally out of the way we can move on."

http://tpmlivewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/2009/10/rockefeller-obama-come-in-hard.php

[Raven]

25. Yup, exactly my point. These things take time and patience and

the arm twisting has only just begun.

[eridani]

27. The only arms being twisted are those of the public

We get to hand over most of our discretionary income to useless shitstain intermediaries for NOTHING.

[eridani]

26. Wrong. It is a complete and total ripoff

Firstly, for four solid years, health care continues to go completely into the toilet. That's two election cycles during which people are going to notice that and blame Dems.

Secondly, it is outright highway robbery that is going do absolutely decimate middle class discretionary income, for NO BENEFITS WHATSOEVER. You pay 10-12% of your income for total garbage that only covers 70% of expenses. Insurance companies, though blocked from cancelling your policy, are still free to deny claims and to pay their employees bonuses for doing it. The no pre-existing conditions part says NOTHING about what they get to charge you--no cost controls whatsoever. The public option will not be available to most of the public.

Single payer gets you coverage for everything, including long term care, for $125/month/adult and a 10% payroll tax on businesses. Countries that get similar results with mandated private insurance do so by actually REGULATING them.

[Born_A_Truman]

28. Medicare wasn't built in a day...

BRIEF HISTORY OF THE MEDICARE PROGRAM

1945 Harry Truman sends a message to Congress asking for
legislation establishing a national health insurance plan.

Two decades of debate ensue, with opponents warning of the
dangers of "socialized medicine."

By the end of Truman's administration, he had backed off
from a plan for universal coverage, but administrators in
the Social Security system and others had begun to focus
on the idea of a program aimed at insuring Social Security
beneficiaries.

July 30, 1965 Medicare and its companion program Medicaid, (which
insures indigent recipients), are signed into law by
President Lyndon Johnson as part of his "Great Society."

Ex-president Truman is the first to enroll in Medicare.

Medicare Part B premium is $3 per month.

1972 Disabled persons under age 65 and those with end-stage
renal disease become eligible for coverage.

Services expand to include some chiropractic services,
speech therapy and physical therapy.

Payments to HMOs are authorized.

Supplemental Security Income (SSI) program is established
for the elderly and disabled poor. SSI recipients are
automatically eligible for Medicaid.

1982 Hospice benefits are added on a temporary basis.

1983 Change from "reasonable cost" to prospective payment
system based on diagnosis-related groups for hospital
inpatient services begins.

Most federal civilian employees become covered.

1984 Remaining federal employees, including President, members
of Congress and federal judiciary become covered.

1986 Hospice benefits become permanent.

1988 Major overhaul of Medicare benefits is enacted aimed at
providing coverage for catastrophic illness and
prescription drugs.

Coverage is added for routine mammography.

1989 Catastrophic coverage and prescription drug coverage are
repealed.

Coverage is added for pap smears.

1992 Physician services payments are based on fee schedule.

1997 Medicare+Choice is enacted under the Balanced Budget Act.
Some provisions prove to be so financially restrictive
when regulations are unveiled that Congress is forced to
revisit the issue in 1999.

1999 Congress "refines" Medicare+Choice and relaxes some
Medicare funding restrictions under the Balanced Budget
Refinement Act of 1999.

2000 Medicare+Choice Final Rule takes effect.

Prospective payment systems for outpatient services and
home health agencies take effect.

Medicare Part B premium is $45.40 per month.

http://seniorjournal.com/NEWS/2000%20Files/Aug%2000/FTR-08-04-00MedCarHistry.htm