Bush administration: Liars or incompetents?

[gcomeau]

No, I'm not going to do anything as pointless as debate which they actually are. They're both, we all know that.

No... the question is which should efforts be focused on convincing the swing voers that they are? Not to say we should just completely drop one, but really it seems to me that one of them needs to command the main focus here. That said, I would argue demonstrating their incompetence should be the priority. I say this for several reasons.

1. It's just plain easier. The burden of proof is lower and the evidence more abundant.

2. I'm getting the strong sense that it's the more effective of the two once demonstrated. Prove Bush lied and a lot of people seem to shrug it off with this attitude of "well, maybe he fibbed... but we still need him to keep us safe from the scary terrorists". Prove he's a bumbling moron who's administration has repeatedly screwed up and actually endangered these people far more than protected them and game's over.

3. Bush's own campaign has provided the perfect tool for getting the message stuck in voters head. The 'W'. Stands for "wrong" don't you know? ;)

And let's face it, this administration has been wrong about pretty damn near everything since it got into office.

Diverted troops from Afghanistan to go after Iraq? Flash that 'W'... they were wrong!

Said Iraq had WMDs and said they knew where they were? Flash that 'W'... wrong!

Said the Iraqi's would welcome coalition troops with open arms! Flash that 'W'... wrong!

Had no plan for securing and stabilizing the country after the invasion. Flash that 'W'... wrong again!

Grand strategy to fight terrorism? Al Qaeda's bigger than ever. Flash that 'W'... wrong yet again!

All we have to do is get that interim government in place and the insurgency will die down? Flash that 'W'.. amazingly wrong!

And on, and on, and on... every single time news comes that flies in the face of what the administration said to expect three fingers should be going in the air and the observations that Dubya was wrong as usual should be made loudly and often.

Comments? Opposing arguments?

-Grant

[NMDemDist2]

1. it's not an either/or question, the answer is BOTH! n/t

[gcomeau]

3. I think I mentioned that.

The question was: which do we mainly focus on exposing them as.

-Grant

[Political_Junkie]

2. Agreed,

I've taken to telling people they have a reverse midas touch, everything they touch turns to shit. The reaction is usually a chuckle, but you can see the wheels turning, adding it all up.

[Toots]

4. You are correct I believe

LIE is just to strong a word for most Americans. Besides everyone knows All Politicians Lie. Incompetence on the other hand is intolerable by most Americans. You are also correct in that it should be an easy case to make. Will the Media allow anyone to address that topic? I doubt it. It could start as early as the China Spy Plane incident. Incompetence. The huge increase in National Debt and the Record Deficit. Incompetence. Going on vacation after being briefed about Al Qaeda readying an attack upon America. Incompetence. Etc. Etc. Etc.

[cthrumatrix]

5. I think that has been Kerry's motto ..."wrong"

However, the damn media is corrupt and biased...period.

[baldguy]

6. Liars, more.

They've been pretty competent in subverting the media, taking over the gov't, organizing the attacks, shredding the Constitution, etc etc.

[Smarmie Doofus]

7. "W is for wrong" is too straighforward;

it's another effort to make a logical argument in an arena where logic is not particularly important. The undecideds and indecisives( I have *decided*) will not be persuaded by logic.

W should stand for "waver" and "waffle". Turns the other side's bashing of Kerry for, allegedly flip-flopping back on itself. Multiple examples of Bush wavering, waffling and confusion can be supplied. ( "War on terror can't be won"; " we will win the war on terror", etc. etc. etc.)


This will help to, at minimum, neutralize the issue of "flip-flopping", which they have artfully exploited.

Kerry will also get credit for showing chutzpah( not to mention imagination). This resonates in the popular subconcious. People like a "fighter".

Paul

[gcomeau]

13. I disagree.

Comes across as too schoolyard. "Bush called me a flip-flopper so I'm going to do it to him! Nyah!"

I mean sure, point it out whenever he tries to bring up the flip-flop issue with Kerry but I think showing him for an incompetent is more effective than showing him as inconsistent.

-Grant

[Smarmie Doofus]

14. Dukakis used this competence thing...

ad nauseum in 1988. "This election is not about ideology, it's about competence."

Result: it went nowhere and the Duke got buried via half-truth, innuendo etc. etc. just like today.

True, W is more blatantly incompetent than his dad, so it might work... but I really hope the Dem brain trust goes in a different direction.

Plus which, I think people know W is a simpleton; they rationalize: "all he has to do is be smart enough to pick people who are smarter than himself to tell him what to do."

'Course that would include virtually the entire population.

Paul

[soupkitchen]

8. I think being Incompentent is a much more deadly sin than being a liar

in contemporary America. Afterall, we've been called a nation of 200 million used-car salesmen. Since everybody lies they figure on some level it's okay to be lied to once in awhile. But nobody wants to think of themselves as being incompentent. And therefore think not too kindly of proven incompetents.

[Morning Dew]

9. They are incompetent, they are liars, and

they are incompetent liars.

But it doesn't matter because Kerry mispronounced Lambeau Field and he's going to burn your bible (prolly he'll come to your home and do it personally). Bush, on the other hand, is always clear and concise.

It doesn't matter because it's Bush who's a war hero, not Kerry. Kerry served 4 short months while Bush has valiantly led our troops for 3 years.

We've gone thru the looking glass.

[roseBudd]

10. Incompetence; wrong on offense vs. defense

Go to http://somnamblst.tripod.com to download high resolution TIF or PDF files to print.

[Nancy Waterman]

12. Bush has been dishonest about everything

There is a pattern to this that Kerry is now pointing out for everyone to see. It is not just Iraq, it is the medicare costs, the truth of gloabal warmning, the cost of the tax cuts, the WMD's, the al Qaida Saddam connection, the truth about his TANG experience, the effect of his policies on the environment. All of these things he has completely misrepresented for his own purposes. If it were just WMD's in Iraq, you could say maybe he was misled, but there is along trail of misrepresentations (read lies) that point to a profound pattern of puposefully misleading the American public. I think this should be the number one campaign issue. Second is his incompetence, for screwing up the "peace" so badly, and then, of course, lying again, pretending it is all going splendidly.

[Raya]

11. Have been pretty competent in this campaign.

[AlCzervik]

15. competent snakeoil salesman

incompetent in all other areas foreign and domestic.