Honolulu Advertiser Fuels The Birther Fires

[WeDidIt]

Hawaii officials confirm Obama's original birth certificate still exists

By Dan Nakaso
Advertiser Staff Writers

Hawai'i's Health Department confirmed yesterday that it has President Obama's original Aug. 4, 1961, birth certificate in storage, but the announcement is unlikely to satisfy conspiracy theorists who insist Obama was born in Kenya.

"We don't destroy vital records," Health Department spokeswoman Janice Okubo said. "That's our whole job, to maintain and retain vital records."

The Health Department's director reiterated yesterday that she has seen Obama's birth records.

<snip>

Link To Today's Honolulu Advertiser Article

But wait, that's not what's fueling Birther fires. At the bottom of the page, they posted a copies of what exists for two twin girls born the day after Obama:



So what's the problem, you might ask?

The certificate numbers. Notice that the numbers are sequential:

Susan Elizabeth Nordyke born August 5, 1961 at 2:12 PM is certificate number 151-61-10637 and Gretchen Carter Nordyke born August 5, 1961 at 2:17 PM is certificate number 151-61-10638.

Now here's are some shots of Obama's certificate as issued by the State of Hawaii in 2007:





The vital information is born August 4, 1961 at 7:24 PM with certificate number 151-1961-010641.

Now, "1961" would have replaced "61" when the data went digital to compensate for the changing of the century, that's self evident. An additional 0 would ahve been added to the final digits of the certificate to accommodate a larger requirement for sequential numbers in modern times, also self evident.

But why would Barack Obama's las five digits of his certificate number be 10641 while two girls born the day AFTER Obama get 10637 and 10638?

This has the Birthers in a total snit.

Their problem is they're applying knowledge of current technology to a situation in 1961. Think of the numbers and the fact that the vital records would have been recorded in batches by individual employees by hand.

Now, what are the last names?

The girls are Nordykes and then you have Obama.

Clearly, a clerk batched the recording of the vital records by alphabetical order of the last names. Clearly, three more babies came between Gretchen Nordyke and Barack Obama during the time that these vital records were entered (days or even weeks after the actual birth).

So this "new evidence" that the birthers are touting as further proof Obama wasn't born in Hawaii actually turns out to be even more proof he was.

[Faygo Kid]

1. Interesting, in a twisted way. You will never convince the birthers. Never.

They believe in Rush Limbaugh for their science, and Ann Coulter for their theology.

They are monolothic, and will never change. Ever.

They are morans, too.

[Vinca]

2. Maybe someone alphabetized the pile of certificates some clerk

had to type. "N" comes before "O" so the girls would have had a lower number.

[WeDidIt]

4. Clearly, that's what happened

It was 1961.

These things would ahve been recorded days later, possibly weeks later.

I also mentioned that in my OP.

[ChimpersMcSmirkers]

7. I was born in Honolulu in '68 and dug out my BC. There is an area for

"date accepted by state". This date was a week after I was born. So yeah, there is a delay and who knows hows it's handle in that time. I doubt they are delivered exactly sequentially by date to the clerk or stacked that way on their desk.

[BadgerKid]

3. Next up: the employee who orig. processed Obama's record.

:sarcasm:

[WeDidIt]

5. They'd still never believe it.

They're NUCKING FUTZ!

[goclark]

34. They know it is false now

They are smart enough to know this will keep people talking and
think that " The South Shall Rise Again." and more Republicans will get elected. :puke:

[Mz Pip]

27. Who could be 90

at this point and obviously senile. :sarcasm:

[Becky72]

6. The Hawaiian Health Dept. told CNN's president that the old birth certificates had been destroyed

I'm confused now.

This is the email received by the President of CNN a few days ago, from the Hawaii Health Dept.:

*In 2001 - the state of Hawaii Health Department went paperless.*Paper documents were discarded*The official record of Obama's birth is now an official ELECTRONIC record Janice Okubo, spokeswoman for the Health Department told the Honolulu Star Bulletin, "At that time, all information for births from 1908 (on) was put into electronic files for consistent reporting," she said.

http://www.mediabistro.com/tvnewser/cnn/jon_klein_on_birthers_it_seems_this_story_is_dead_122546.asp#more

[WeDidIt]

8. Hint

They exist on microfiche. The twins' certificates are obviously from microfiche.

They may have digitized the microfiche, too.

[kestrel91316]

10. Yep. NOBODY keeps boxes and boxes and boxes and boxes

(well, you get the point) of old records like that around anymore. Too many courthouse fires over the years taught people to do it a "better" way. As a genealogist, there is nothing cooler than a photocopy of an ancient original document. But these days I am thinking original paper copies probably don't exist at all, lol. Children born today probably ONLY have digital data, and no paper copy at all, ever. Sad.

Obama's record is in a transitional time. The original may or may not still be around on fiche, but the PAPER form is long gone.

[girl gone mad]

9. The article doesn't say the original paper document still exists..

just that the vital records have been maintained. The certificate could have been preserved on microfilm or as a digital scan.

He was born in Hawaii, he's an American citizen, get over it.

[Becky72]

12. I wish the article had mentioned or hinted "microfilm"

I think it was bad journalism from this newspaper not to mention that the paper certificate was stored into microfilm. Journalists are leaving gaps in their stories instead of shutting up these nutjobs that are the Birthers.

[jberryhill]

11. "Discarded" does not mean "destroyed"

Yes, they no longer use paper records. They went completely electronic and do not use the paper records.

[Avalux]

13. Good heavens - this whole thing is ridiculous.

:crazy:

[WeDidIt]

17. Well come on, these aren't rocket scientists we're dealing with

Hell, even Joe the Plumber and Sarah PAlin seem to have more sense than this.

[yowzayowzayowza]

14. Batch could also have been lifo...

resulting in the later births goin in first.

[WeDidIt]

16. I doubt that

I did some clerking in a government office pre-PC days. You always batched alphabetically.

[jberryhill]

21. August 4, 1961 was a Friday. 7:24 PM Think, People, Think /nt

...and August 5 was a Saturday.

Nothing got to the registrar until Monday at the earliest.

[ksoze]

15. Water would fuel a birther fire - they have no ability to rationalize or analyze

[msanthrope]

18. Obama was born on a Friday night. The Nordykes, on Saturday

What do you want to bet all the Birth Cert info from that weekend was put out to the State on Monday?

And the hospital might have alphabetized them.

[WeDidIt]

20. Yup, one clerk determined the order of the numbers

by the batch of certificates they prepared.

The Freepers are Going nuts claiming this is the final proof they need.

Obviously, none of them ever did manual clerk work in the pre-computer days.

[jberryhill]

23. It's funny how nobody checks the day of the week on this stuff...

I had a writing assignment in law school in which one of the fictional people's alibi was that they had gone to a bank on the afternoon of the day in question. I missed the legal issue completely, because I consulted a calendar, determined that day was a Sunday, and concluded the person was lying.

[jberryhill]

19. The Answer Is Simpler Than That - AND STARING YOU IN THE FACE

Look at the time Barack Obama was born.

No state office was open after 5PM on August 4, 1961. No state office was open on August 5, or the 6th.

August 4 1961 was a FRIDAY

August 5 1961 was a SATURDAY

No information from the Obama birth OR the Nordyke birth would have gotten to any state office until Monday, August 7, 1961.

[WeDidIt]

22. And then, alphabetical

The Freepers are now posting the birth announcements from the two papers. They're freaking because the Nordyke twins aren't in them:

Now tell me what you notice about these two scans of the newspapers:





HINT: The complete pages of birth announcements aren't there, these are scans of partial pages (enough to show Obama amongst the others).

[jberryhill]

24. I Can Never Get Over The All You Can Eat Luau For $2.50

I'd even rent the $7.50 suit for that.

[WeDidIt]

25. I'd even spring for the $10 tent rental. n/t

[jberryhill]

28. Throw In A Ukelele, And You Could Have A Great Birthday Party For Under $20

Kaneda's Catering is still around:

http://www.stanleyitoflorist.com/whatsnew.php

Kathleen Yoshinaga, the long-time florist's daughter who now operates the shop, said the move took place at the end of January to an approximately 1,500-square-foot space on the ground floor of the recently redesigned Kaneda's Catering building at 40 S. School Street.


I can't find Haseyama Tailor, but it's former owner Toso Haseyama was an internee during WWII.

[agentS]

30. Well then, the birthers can stick this up their ass!

Since the other 2 weren't listed, the birthers should talk to Mr. and Mrs. Hatchie or Mr. and Mrs. Wong then, seeing as how both their children were born on the same day as the POTUS.

They're grasping at less than straws again, I see...

[msanthrope]

29. We posted the exact same thing at the same time--did you note

that Mrs. Nordyke didn't even sign the BCs until the 7?

So Monday morning, the hospital collects the info from all the Moms who gave birth over the weekend......\

[Perky]

26. Ooooohh noooooo these are actually copies and not the originals

The fien print says that these are true and correct copies. THey will still demand the originals....:sarcasm:

[high density]

31. They're disproving their own theory

"Date filed by registrar: August 8, 1961"

I don't see why a clerk would bother to sort these in any way. The fact that his number is so close to other assumed good certificates shows that these people have no basis in fact at all.

[WeDidIt]

32. I know

That's the beauty of their madness. They present evidence that contradicts their claims.

[mkultra]

33. different medical centers could have different ranges assigned.