Dear Lord, this is starting to get ridiculous.

[Danger Mouse]

Criticism over Warren? Fine. That's something HE ACTUALLY DID.
Criticism over his cabinet appointments? Fine. That's something HE ACTUALLY DID.
Criticism over stuff that hasn't happened yet, or saying 'he's going to suck because...' Stupid considering HE'S NOT PRESIDENT YET.
For the love of God, give the man a chance to screw up as president before you say he sucks. Otherwise, you just look fatalistic and sad. Let's try and go into this a little hopeful and optimistic? Please? Just a suggestion. Nobody's going to make you stop having your little...whatever it is you call it.

[noamnety]

1. What about criticism

over policies he says he will enact, even if he hasn't done it yet?

Must we really wait til he follows through on his promises, if the promises themselves suck?

[Danger Mouse]

2. Hmm, well that's something tangible.

Hey, whatever you wanna do. :shrug:

[SwampG8r]

5. if you dont approve of a policy

that is unenacted
now would be the time to have your valid concerns noted
that can be done productively and non critically
do the work needed to change minds before the policy starts

[noamnety]

10. That's what I'm thinking.

I don't know about the idea of doing it "non critically" - that might be semantics. I come from an art background, and art critiques are a regular part of that, where you put your work up on display for people to debate the good points and the bad points. Being critical in my world is not a bad thing - it's the way that flaws are noted so that they can be corrected, and issues in general surrounding the work are discussed.

Same with critical thinking. It's a good thing.

I don't understand the desire to protect his policies or actions from criticism.

[SwampG8r]

11. perhaps non critically is not the right term

i juust feel a positive approach gets you further

[noamnety]

13. What's a positive way to note

that someone is publicly saying they are going to "start" withdrawing troops ASAP, while quietly planning to leave 50,000 troops in a country we have no right to occupy?

[Orsino]

15. Yes. Wait-and-see hasn't paid off for us, historically. n/t

[tbyg52]

30. Yep. *Before* it is solidified is the time to criticize/protest

Once the policy is enacted, it's too late.

[peace13]

9. Have you written your suggestions to the Obama team?

Have you called your Representatives with your concerns? If the answer is yes and you must criticize then I guess that's OK. But, if you haven't done any work on your part to make your concerns know then I say stuff a sock in it.

[noamnety]

12. Yes I do that.

And I will add that the concept of telling people they need to "stuff a sock in it" unless they have "earned" the right to free speech according to your personal criteria, is rather ... well, let's just say it's never good to sound like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XrNl6-j9x5w

[peace13]

14. Yes, strong words...

My point being that we are inundated with folks who do nothing but rip the system while others work toward solutions for all. DU is not a place for activists it has become a place for whiners. I apologize for the rude choice of words.

[SwampG8r]

3. well yeah...but...but..

i mean c'mon...

[Danger Mouse]

4. CHEMTRAILS!! 9/11 TRUTH!!! ELDERS OF ZION!! LBJ KILLED JFK!!!

WHY YOU GOT YOUR HEAD IN THE SAND??

[SwampG8r]

7. you are a tool of the powers that be

everyone who knows the truth knows jfk killed himself and lbj shot rfk!
why do you work so hard to keep america confused?

[DevonRex]

26. Hey, I'm with you on the chemtrails and truthers, but what are the

Elders of Zion??? Heck, I need to join up right the fuck NOW!!!

I simply cannot believe you have formed a group without MEEEEEEE. Waaahhhh!

[Danger Mouse]

34. DUH, the secret cabal of Jews that control the world. Haven't you read the Protocols???

Actually, Will Eisner's final graphic novel was called 'The Plot' and it delves into the history behind one of the most vicious and hurtful hoaxes to ever exist. It's well worth picking up if you can ever find it.

[DevonRex]

35. Dayum. Looks like I'm gonna need more tinfoil. And duct tape.

:tinfoilhat:

Is it safe to use a credit card to buy the book, or will they know I'm onto them? Better use cash. Yup. And gloves.

[opihimoimoi]

21. We all are aware there are those who wish him ill...they want failure...addicted to it for some odd

reason...not sensible, not logical, and not Truthful....

We refer to them as trolls, freeps, etc etc.....

Its all part of the game I guess...some are even paid I suspect...but...they are here to sully the waters...

[noamnety]

33. I don't know anyone who hopes he will fail.

I see two camps.

1) People who think wait, see, support, cheerlead is the best plan of action for helping politicians "succeed."

2) People who think pressure from the people is necessary to make politicians enact less centrist/corporate policies.

Personally, I view the first set as historically naive, and I view the second set as harsh realists.

Left to their own devices, politicians tend to favor big business, the military industrial complex and the status quo regardless of which party they belong to, because those are the policies that their largest donors and lobbyists support. The grass roots needs to learn to be as effective at lobbying loudly - which is not the same at all as wanting failure.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

6. Anyone who thought Obama would be perfect for the job

and do exactly as they would like a President to do is a dreamer. And anyone who has already decided on how he will be as President is, at best, delusional. Even Obama doesn't know exactly how he'll act in any given situation until he sits in the Oval Office. And right now he can't do anything more than he is doing--he isn't Commander in Chief.

[Danger Mouse]

8. I think it's the truly 'loony left' who are being overly critical at this point anyway..

and I doubt that Obama will do much to pacify them, in the end.

[alwysdrunk]

40. That's exactly who they

And they will be ignored as they should be. Nothing constructive will ever come of trying to reason with these people. They are not worth trying to pacify.

[davidpdx]

41. Unfortunately, the far left thinks they "own" Obama and

if he doesn't do exactly what they think he should, they will scream, cry and whine. If that doesn't work, they can always rehash the worshiper line from the primary (I've seen countless people do that in the last month). What these people don't realize is that it was a mix of both Democrats and Republicans that voted for him. That's why he won, that's why we picked up seats in both houses of Congress.

[pipi_k]

16. I have to admit to

having done this eight years ago with Bush.

But in that case, I was also looking at his past records of failure in business and the military and as Governor of Texas. I fully expected him to fail. Miserably.

Immediately after 9/11 when it looked like he might step up and be a halfway decent leader, I thought I might have judged him harshly...but in the end, he crumbled into the sorriest pile of garbage I had ever seen.


Anyway, I had to stop myself from doing the opposite with Obama...expecting him to be able to fix a country that was nearly brought to the edge of total disaster. He's not God...he's not Superman. He can only do what a human being can do. And one thing for sure...he can't make everyone happy. He's going to disappoint some of us, and that's the way it is. And maybe the people he disappointed over ABC issue will be happy when he comes through for them on XYZ issue.

I think that in the end, he'll do the best he can for as many people as he can.

[peaches2003]

17. Heard a RW loon say on Washington Journal

yesterday that the Republicans need to look into impeachment proceedings against Obama NOW! I thought that the host, even though C-Span prides itself on just broadcasting callers views with no comment, should have reminded her that he can't be impeached because he isn't even President yet! :spank:

[Danger Mouse]

19. And when DUer's are sounding like RW loons...that's when we should worry...

:P

[Blarch]

18. agree. rec.

[Arkansas Granny]

20. There are some who set such unrealistically high expectations for Obama

that they have set themselves up for disappointment.

[DevonRex]

24. Thank goodness we have a logical core here, one that neither

set expectations too high nor hopes he will fail.

I'd say 95% of us are in the logical core category. But boy howdy, that other 5% is sure vocal. :)

[The Doctor.]

22. "Starting"?

Ummmm....

[bridgit]

32. Pft, no doubt!!

:thumbsup:

[Danascot]

23. We could have gotten McCain

or Chimpnuts could have declared himself president for life.

(don't tell me they didn't consider it.)

Let's keep things in perspective.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

36. don't forget and Palin!!!!!

[rug]

25. He should never have ordered the tuna melt.

[angee_is_mad]

27. There's alot of Puma-ism going on

As far as Rick Warren is concerned, I understand why gays are upset and I will never tell them that are not allowed to be upset.

I just know that on January 21st, Rick Warren will have no more impact on my life than he did on January 19th.

[noamnety]

31. I would just ask you to recognize

that your last sentence is something you can say - and for you it is true - because you are in a position of relative privilege compared to the people whose lives have already been affected by him in devastating ways, and will continue to be affected by him.

[Starry Messenger]

28. I posted something nice.

Good internet scouts kick threads! :patriot:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x8045388

[Peacetrain]

29. It has been anything but dull lately.

that is for sure!!

[AntiFascist]

37. Criticism can be very constructive

it's when they ignore their critics that we have to worry about something like the current head of state. I'm all for a more perfect Obama going into the presidency.

[mvd]

38. How can I get that mad after the hell this country has been through?

I'm giving Obama all the chance in the world. I may not like all his moves and appointments, and think the Repuke party is too far gone for compromise, but I'm thrilled he will be President.

[OneBlueSky]

39. no matter what Obama does, he'll be light years ahead of Bush . . .

sit back, give him a chance, and let's see what happens . . . there will be plenty of time to criticize, and plenty of issues to argue about, once he's in office . . . all I know that at his absolute worst he'll be several powers of ten above George W. Bush . . .