Report: Clinton Camp Fabricated Initial Obama "Offer"

[deadlyaj]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/11/25/report-clinton-camp-fabri_n_146489.html

Report: Clinton Camp Fabricated Initial Obama "Offer"

In the New York Review of Books, Elizabeth Drew sheds some more light on the behind-the-scenes wrangling between Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama over the Secretary of State post:

Obama's meetings with Hillary Clinton and John McCain about playing important roles in his presidency indicated his imagination and his shrewdness, although sources close to Obama say he did not offer her the job of secretary of state when they met. He had said during the campaign that he wanted various views in his government, and in turning to his own former competitors, Obama was at the same time magnanimous and seeking to keep them close. Both were in a position to cause him difficulty in the Senate--Clinton, in particular, had kept her constituency intact (through HillPAC) and was planning her own Senate agenda, including her own health care program, no matter what Obama proposed. But Clinton lacks the seniority, and therefore a committee position from which to get her proposals taken up by the Senate. (She tried to get a special subcommittee appointed, but Edward M. Kennedy, who has his own health care plan and is chairman of the committee with jurisdiction over the issue, blocked her, offering her later a role concerning health insurance.) McCain had indicated that he wanted to help Obama in the Senate, and by taking him up on it, Obama has both flattered and coopted him.


Mrs. Clinton's and her closest advisers' turning a suggestion by the President-elect that she might, among other things, head the State Department into an "offer" and reports that she was agonizing over whether to accept it, did not please officials in Chicago, some of whom hoped that issues over disclosure of Bill Clinton's post-presidential record might block the appointment. But the former president's camp blocked that by promising to cooperate with requests for information and to accept limits on his activities, including clearance of speaking engagements abroad. Statements by the Hilary camp on November 21 saying that "she's ready" for the position but then backtracking, saying that some matters were "under discussion," typified the whole mess, the only snag thus far in an otherwise unusually smooth transition involving impressive choices--an object lesson to Obama (which he had reason to know already) that getting involved with the Clintons is rarely uncomplicated.

Read more about Clinton's potential Secretary of State position here.

[Onlooker]

1. This is absurd

Obama could rescind the offer at any time if he wanted, and Hillary Clinton could save face simply by saying she decided not to accept the offer. Obama has obviously made her the offer, and a majority of people think it was a good idea. Obama is not afraid of the Clintons, and respects their abilities.

[JVS]

3. Can he rescind an offer that he hasn't made?

Where is the evidence?

[Onlooker]

5. If he hadn't made the offer

The leaks would be something along the lines that Obama has Hillary on his shortlist of candidates for SoS.

[JVS]

7. I'm still waiting for evidence on that offer.

[Onlooker]

9. That he hasn't denied it

There's no logical reason why his camp wouldn't deny it, why Richardson's role would be announced, why Kerry's leadership role in the Senate would be announced, etc. The only reason the offer isn't official is because both sides want to be sure it's a done deal.

Also, I'm not sure we've seen any offers from the Obama campaign. Typically, these things are announced after the decision is made. I think it's a bit naive to expect Obama to say, "I'm offering Clinton the SoS, and sure hope she accepts."

[JVS]

10. That's a very poor source of evidence. An administration can't spend its time denying all kinds ...

rumors.

[Onlooker]

12. Yeah right

It's a lot of work issuing a statement denying that an offer has been made. Meanwhile, it's a shame that he hasn't made an offer to anyone to be SoS yet, huh? It's perhaps the most important cabinet position, and what an idiot Obama is for not addressing it.

[kenziemom06]

18. idiot is a bit harsh...

[PBS Poll-435]

13. Problem is, the transition team has done the opposite of "denying" it

By leaking info about how well the vetting is going and using phrases like "on-track."

[JVS]

15. leaks aren't credible, and the opposite of denying is confirming, not remaining silent.

[PBS Poll-435]

16. Again, they are anything but silent about this.

[yardwork]

21. How is this article any different from a leak?

[JVS]

25. How is the whole topic any different from a leak?

If people are expected to accept leaks that say that Hillary has been offered SoC, then there is no reason they shouldn't be listening to this article either.

[yardwork]

29. Exactly! This is all a lot of sound and fury, signifying nothing.

We have no idea what kinds of deals are really being worked out.

[CoffeeCat]

30. But it makes sense doesn't it?

One thing is for sure. The Obama camp doesn't leak. However, the SOS/Hillary chapter was a week's
worth of leaks and non-stop drama.

Can we all agree that the leaks were coming from the Hillary camp?

The Hillary camp's marketing effort to secure her the SOS job--has come to an end.

Now, Obama is going to get down to business...and prepare the nation for who his SOS pick is.

I think what's happening now---is that the Clinton drama has ceased. Now, Obama has set that
aside and he'll roll out who his pick is.

We'll see stories like this out there in the media: He never made her the offer, Bill's business
dealings are a problem, there's a Constitutional problem with naming her (come on, you don't think
the Obama camp put that out there...of course they did.) Then, other names will emerge.

Obama met with Richardson before he met with Clinton. I'm wondering if Obama originally wanted
Richardson as SOS.

The Obama camp hasn't officially announced Richardson as SOC, have they?

[yardwork]

The Obama camp leaks when it suits their purposes.

No way is Obama going to publicly humiliate or privately offend key Democrats like the Clintons. He's a very savvy politician, and he got where he is by building coalitions with people who didn't like him.

National politics has nothing whatsoever to do with who likes who. There is serious horse-trading going on right now. What do the Clintons want and how much are they willing to give? What does Obama want and how much is he willing to give?

[karynnj]

46. Obama can not control rumors that do humiliate people

I think that it is a fait accompli that HRC will be SoS. I do not think we will ever know if any of these rumors really happened, because it hurts BOTH camps to confirm this.

Now, ASSUME that the Clintons leaked nothing and the rumors were there that she got the position. Would she be humiliated, if it were not true - especially if negative reasons were speculated about?

Now, before you say "yes" - consider that is what DID happen with Kerry and Richardson. Neither of these men had anything to do with their names being mentioned - other than that their credentials were excellent. As soon as Obama won, they were tops in the media's speculations. Kerry immediately had his spokesperson deny comments that he was seeking the job - when the media ignored that, he said the same thing personally. The rumors didn't just promote HRC, but trashed both Kerry and Richardson. Kerry in particular has been hit more than anyone - and he clearly does not deserve these attacks - as they are based mostly on the fact that he has supported Obama more often and better than nearly anyone else for nearly a year.

So, why would Obama give a job to HRC just to avoid hurting her feeling - yet do nothing to counter the attacks on Kerry and Richardson - both of whom he owes more gratitude to. the reason is that he made a political choice that he wanted her for this job. It had nothing to do with her possibly being hurt.

[CoffeeCat]

20. You don't get it do you?

The Clintons are leaking information about these proceedings.

They are the ones suggesting that an offer has been made.

Barack Obama has NEVER indicated that he made an offer to Hillary Clinton. Ever.

Richardson met with Obama too. The day before he met with Hillary. Did we hear
ONE THING about that meeting? Most people barely knew it happened! The Obama
camp does not leak.

All of the leaks are being generated by the Clintons--because they are trying
to strongarm Obama into offering her the job.

Why can some people NOT see this?

[yardwork]

22. That's entirely possible but your assumption too is based on leaks.

LOL!

This is politics in action and it's hilarious to watch people's reactions. Look, everyone is maneuvering for position. Of course the Clintons are leaking and trying to strong arm to get their way. Of course Obama's team is responding with leaks and maneuvers of their own. Both sides are highly skilled political machines.

Watch and wait. No point in getting all upset one way or the other. Politics is all about horse trading.

[CoffeeCat]

26. I understand what you are saying...

...but many people refuse to acknowledge the reality that you so clearly describe.

Clinton wants the SOS job. She's got her camp fighting for her to get it.

However, it appears that Obama is fighting against it. The report from HuffPo says that the Obama
camp leaked the nugget about Bill Clinton's donor lists/financial dealings--in an effort to get out
of appointing her SOS (and that's exactly how he got out of naming her VP!).

He doesn't want her!!!!! He's fighting against it.

The report goes on to say that the Clinton camp's next move was to minimize that argument by explaining
that Bill Clinton would cooperate and release all information.

Obama does not want her as SOS. Or at least---she's not his first pick.

The Obama camp is fighting this, while the Hillary camp is fighting for it.

Yes, this is politics. It's no big deal.

The big deal for me is that people around here actually deny that this is what is happening.

[yardwork]

28. I don't think we have any way of knowing whether or not Obama wants Clinton as SoS.

Obama wants to get things done. He wants to leave a legacy. He doesn't want to be undermined by competitors in the Democratic Party, so he has to give them something in return for their support. It's all a negotiation. How much is the SoS position worth to Hillary and Bill? What will they give in return? Is there something else they want more? How much is Obama willing to give?

This is all being worked out in the inner circles, and everything else is a loud of noise and distraction. The Clintons are not pure evil and Obama is not a saint. There's no good guys and bad guys in this scenario.

[tbyg52]

35. That has been my view ever since this started.

The whole affair has been totally uncharacteristic of the Obama camp, so either they changed their MO completely for this one appointment, or something else was going on. That's how it looked to my simple mind, anyhow.

Edited for traditional stupid typo.

[roguevalley]

48. I don't believe -correct me if I'm wrong- that anyone else has been

leaked ahead of time. This would make sense given that. Too bad. What a cheesy way to be.

[MyNameGoesHere]

54. I guess because your argument is kind of lame.

No proof, no details just a lot of... hmm what's the word? And ALL administrations leak. Please that is naive to believe they don't.

[Whisp]

55. the only things I find obvious about all this is:

Obama will not be pressured to make a decision he thinks is unwise, even by the almighty Clintons.

Hillary & Bill and their friends like Lanny Davis are doing all they can to manipulate and weasel her way into the position.

[H2O Man]

2. No, thank you.

It is nonsense.

[TexasObserver]

4. I don't believe a word of it

[cboy4]

6. Yea, uh huh.

[Marrah_G]

8. Un-fucking-believable

People here spend months lambasting anyone who didn't think Obama was going save the world and NOW you think he is so easily manipulated that a leak could force his hand? Do you HONESTLY think he is that fucking WEAK?

Or do you just despise the Clintons so much that you salivate over any unsubstantiated shit that paints her in the negative.

WTF people. Stop this shit.

It is divisive RW rumor mongering bullshit.

[Clio the Leo]

11. Thank you. He didn't let her jerk him around during the primaries..

.... and President Elect Obama isn't going to let anyone (with the possibility of Michelle) jerk him around now.

NO WAY would he even suggest the position to her, of all people, if he wasn't serious and she wasn't at the top of the list. He's not that stupid.

[Rockholm]

23. It is genetic. These jerks just can't help themselves.

[mkultra]

27. and by these jerks

do you mean people who support the current president elect.

[Rockholm]

38. No, the people who are bashing anything Clinton.

[mkultra]

39. this injustice seems awful small

compared to the criticism of Obama's pre-job performance as the president.

[Rockholm]

44. I believe he is doing a fantastic job.

AND, if this continues, I think we are in for a terrific 8 years.

[WeDidIt]

14. Maybe Team Obama was well aware of the Emolument issue

Could be.

[Alter Ego]

17. *WHAM**WHAM**WHAM**WHAM*

That sound is me slamming my head on my desk in exasperation over the soap opera the media insists on making out of this bullshit.

[CoffeeCat]

19. I've been saying this all along....

I'm not even worried about Clinton becoming SOS, because it's not going to happen.

I've written endlessly about this. It was obvious to me, from the get go--that all of
these "leaks" about the SOS job were coming from the Clinton camp.

They were manipulations. The Clintons were trying to force Obama to name Clinton as SOS, and
they were running the pressure in the media.

Does anyone actually believe that Obama will pick someone like this? Someone who acts like
this and plays such bullshit? It's not going to happen.

All you need to do is look at the events that preceded the Clinton and Obama meeting. Hillary
was furious when a reporter asked her if she thought she would have access to Rahm Emanuel.
Clinton snapped back, "He's gonna be accessible to ME!"

Clinton saw the writing on the wall. She'd be on the outside looking in. She and Emanuel have
had a bad relationship since the 1990's.

She freaked. This HuffPo article demonstrates that she doesn't have the seniority in the Senate
to do what she wants. After spending two years believing that you're going to be POTUS, then to
return to the Senate with mediocre power--and to watch Obama galvanize a team of which you are not
a part--had to be exasperating.

She wants in. She's demanding a seat at the table.

The Obama camp ran their campaign without any leaks for two years. The VP choice wasn't leaked.
When Obama met with Richardson, we barely heard a peep. However, when he met with Clinton it was constant
drama--for days! Everything we heard was generated by the Clintons. All of it.

And now, we hear that the Obama campaign was unhappy with all of that.

Clinton will not be SOS. I still maintain that Richardson has it.

[sunnystarr]

32. Great assessment.

I have no doubt that the report is true for all the reasons mentioned. I'm ambivilent about the Clintons since to me they are quintessential politicians and if she had been the Dem nominee I would have voted for her. The SOS issue was obviously political maneuvering by Clinton and masterful at that. I wouldn't bet on the outcome - but if there is anyway Clinton can manage it she will find that way and be our next SOS. I'm sure she will do a great job tho so I'm not concerned.

[JI7]

37. Richardson has already been announced for Commerce

i tend to agree with some of the things you say except that Hillary will be SOS.

[Lucky 13]

47. I agree with your analysis and hope you are correct.

My only point of disagreement is about Richardson. From the looks of things he's going to be Secy of Commerce. I was kinda hoping for John Kerry for SoS.

[tigereye]

24. why does she always have to be viewed as" the bad guy/gal" ?

I hate this kind of spin.

[Beacool]

41. Because the kooks on the left are as fascinated by her as the kooks on the right.

To them she represents the worst in women: the harridan, emasculating female, a combination of Mesalina, Lady Macbeth, Lucretia Borgia and Eva Peron, all rolled into one person.

They have created this persona and they'll be damned if they can be persuaded otherwise. It's not Hillary or Bill who create the drama, but the media and all those who love to regurgitate any innuendo, even if it's unsubstantiated.

:eyes:

[tigereye]

52. exactly! It's so exasperating.

although I wouldn't necessarily call our far, far left buddies "kooks" ;)



"lefter than thou" , perhaps...

[Beacool]

53. Oh yeah, there are definitely plenty of kooks on the left.

Just as there are plenty on the right. Read this board, KOS & Huff and you'll find that there are many who are as kooky as any Freeper. Their political vent is different, but they share their extremism.

:scared:

[TwilightGardener]

31. More interesting to me is that she was planning to ignore Obama's

health care plan and try to get her own passed--what a team player.

[Skip Intro]

33. Clearly an unbiased and well sourced piece...of crap.

[S_E_Fudd]

34. You could have titled this post "Barack Obama - Weak Willed and Stupid"

Because that is the upshot of this "article"

[unblock]

36. IF she muscled her way in, she's incredibly stupid.

she'd be incredibly stupid to go about it in a way that made obama feel (or worse, look) coerced or manipulated into choosing her.

first, he's probably more likely to refuse her if he finds her "job application" approach too heavy-handed.

worse, he's in a position to seriously screw her over. for example, he could give her secretary of state and then marginalize her, running all foreign policy decisions through the vice-president, national security advisor, defense, etc. in an extreme case, he could fire her -- after she's given up her senate seat.

she'd land on her feet, e.g., as governor of new york, but in any event he could make her a non-issue.


i seriously doubt she's that stupid.

[OPERATIONMINDCRIME]

40. LOL What A Nonsensical Article. How Dumb Would Someone Have To Be To Believe It For A Second?

[Beacool]

42. Not dumb, disingenuous.

They believe it because it trashes someone who they despise. If Hillary had won and instead of her name it said Obama, the very same people would be screaming bloody murder about these dubious articles. But, anyone can say anything about the Clintons no matter how preposterous and some will be running to post it. I wonder if they even believe half of what they write or they just do it to be spiteful?

:-(

[Prophet 451]

50. Seconded

This whole idea is absurd on it's face. If an Obama who faced down the Clinton machine in the primaries had any objections to Hillary as SoS (other than the reservations all politicians have over appointments), does anyone really believe he'd hesitate to slam the brakes on?

[Chichiri]

43. Recommenders, thank you for your concern.

[Phx_Dem]

45. Sounds like the Clintons we all know and love, or not. n /t

[Metric System]

49. Meanwhile (an obvious Clintonie) at the NY Times reports:

"Mr. Obama’s aides say Mr. Biden has backed the decision to appoint Mrs. Clinton secretary of state. “If he had made an argument against it, it would have carried a lot of weight,” a senior aide to the transition said. “He was totally in support of it.”"

Biden must be working with the evil Clintons to undermine Obama!

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/26/us/politics/26biden.html?hp

[Lilith Velkor]

51. This must be the "bargaining" phase.

With any luck, the "depression" phase will consist of heaping mugs of STFU.