I Need Help Pushing Back On The "Obama The Baby Killer" Meme.

[malik flavors]

A Facebook friend of mine posted this note today, after writing a bible verse yesterday as her status update. The bible verse went something like "The wicked man rises to power, and a nation will grieve." That offended some of her friends and she felt the need to apologize.

This is what she wrote today, and i'll bolden the part that's relevent to this thread:

I am truly sorry that I have hurt and offended any of you, because that was not my intention in anyway. I respect you too much, as a friend, and it hit home when I got your message. Thank you for telling me and bringing it to my attention that I came off hateful and judgmental. This was not my intention!! Please know that I don't consider myself a hateful person (hopefully you still don't either!) but right now I am scared. When I put that verse up on my status, I had just gotten off the phone with a very very close friend of mine who is in Special Operations (think the Unit on TV) for the Air Force. He called me that morning in tears because he knows on a military perspective what this election meant. He went on to talk about how in Afghanistan and Iraq, a certain groups (I'll let you draw your own conclusion to who they were) of people were cheering and praising "Allah" for the results of this election. He also explained that our intelligence network of informants as we know it going to go "away" and information that they were receiving about terrorist cells is going to be severely impacted negatively; I know that many many people dislike Bush and everything that he stands for, but one thing that no one can disagree is that we were not attacked after 9/11; I am scared that this will change with this presidency

I recognize the verses you gave me and I appreciate them. One thing I love about Christianity is the compassion/love/forgiveness that it has offered and brought into my life. I was a completely different person 6 years ago before Christ came into my life, and I think I am better for it. However, I also think that as a Christian, we can not be "doormats" when there is injustice and atrocities occurring. The verse in Matthew comes to mind:

15 “Beware of false prophets who come disguised as harmless sheep but are really vicious wolves. 16 You can identify them by their fruit, that is, by the way they act. Can you pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? 17 A good tree produces good fruit, and a bad tree produces bad fruit. 18 A good tree can’t produce bad fruit, and a bad tree can’t produce good fruit. 19 So every tree that does not produce good fruit is chopped down and thrown into the fire. 20 Yes, just as you can identify a tree by its fruit, so you can identify people by their actions.

Obama has identified himself as a Christian many many times, but his actions or his "fruit" bother me.
Just one example:

There is Legislation that is presented on the federal level and in various states called the Born Alive Infant

Protection Act (BAIPA). It stated all live-born babies were guaranteed the same constitutional right to equal protection, whether or not they were wanted. This issue arises sometimes during a "complication" during partial birth abortion. There are times, when during a partial birth abortion, the child is "accidentally" completely delivered and the question arises what to do with it then .

BAIPA sailed through the U.S. Senate by unanimous vote. Even Sens. Clinton, Kennedy and Kerry agreed a mother's right to "choose" stopped at her baby's delivery.

The bill also passed overwhelmingly in the House. NARAL went neutral on it. Abortion enthusiasts publicly agreed that fighting BAIPA would appear extreme. President Bush signed BAIPA into law in 2002.

But in Illinois, the state version of BAIPA repeatedly failed, thanks in large part to then-state Sen. Barack Obama. Obama articulately worried that legislation protecting live aborted babies might infringe on women's rights or abortionists' rights. Obama voted against the measure, twice and it ultimately failed.

Whether or not you are pro-life, pro-choice, killing a child after it is born is infanticide. Remember Scott Peterson?

Once again I really want to stress my apologies for offending you and causing you to think that I am hateful towards Obama; because I'm not at all. I disagree with the man on most principles and most of what he stands for, but I don't hate him for it. There is another verse somewhere in proverbs, that talks about how a nation's people need to pray for our leader, everyday, no matter what. It may surprise you, that the moment I found out that Obama was going to be our next president, I started to pray for him. I pray that he will be open to God's will for our country and keep us all safe.


If I remember correctly, Obama voted against the BAIPA bill becasue Illinois already had a law in the books that said you can't terminate the life of a baby after it's been delivered. So, his vote wasn't even effecting the lives of babies that had been delivered. This vote wasn't going to alter that in anyway. He voted against it for other reasons, correct?

Anybody want to make this more clear for me, so I can talk some sense into her?

Thanks.

[Sabriel]

1. I find it more effective to laugh in disbelief and walk away

Sometimes I shake my head sadly as I walk, too.

[Left Is Write]

11. Unfortunately, that isn't effective in the long run.

Erroneous information that leads to slander should be corrected.

[Sabriel]

14. You can't reason with people like that, seriously.

You're wasting your time.

You could always try "Now hear this, O foolish and senseless people, Who have eyes but do not see; Who have ears but do not hear. (Jeremiah 5:21)

[Left Is Write]

18. I know you can't reason with them or change their minds -

but you can let them know you won't tolerate blatant falsehoods and slander.

They are welcome to their opinions, but let those opinions be based on actual facts, not smears and half-truths.

[damonm]

2. Your memory is 100% correct - there was already law on the IL

books to accomplish that end. Language in the bill Obama voted against was a precursor to outlawing abortion, so he voted against it.

Find the full scoop on FactCheck:
http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/obama_and_infanticide.html

[Beaverhausen]

3. I didn't read your whole post but what I do know is

Obama voted against the bill because it would limit the access to safe and legal abortions. There was already a law on the books to protect the "born alive" fetuses.

Period.

[Ian David]

4. See also

http://TinyUrl.com/ProLifeObama

and

http://TinyUrl.com/ProLifeObama2

[randr]

5. My answer to the idiots who still carry this on

If you did not hear Obama's answer to this accusation go to his web site and look it up.

[malik flavors]

6. Awesome, thanks folks!

[colonel odis]

7. how many abortions were performed between 2000 - 2006, when the GOP held

the executive branch, the legislative branch, and the supreme court?

what steps did they take to alter roe v. wade when they had a clear shot at it?

[zbdent]

19. are you counting those "born alive" in Iraq?

that would add to the total ...

How about that other "born alive" kid who was killed because George W. Bush signed a bill which said that an accountant could decide whether or not a child could live ...

[Khaotic]

8. Simple

Tell them that the Pro-Life Agenda fails the unborn child because it fails to embrace the expectant mother.

In contrast, Pro-Choice embraces the expectant mother because it doesn't attempt to take away her choice w/ threats of jail time.

The expectant mother will always make the choice and doesn't need the federal government to condone, or not condone, abortion in order to come to a decision.

The Pro-Life Agenda can't bring themselves to embrace the expectant mother who is pondering abortion, because by percentage many are unwed and thus it would force them to embrace (and in their minds to condone) sex before marriage.

They will never comprimise and embrace young women who are unwed and pregnant, thus they want to use big brother to FORCE them to have PAY for their sins.

That's not what life is about and is not a positive way to influence an expectant mother in regard to her decision whether to go through with her pregnacy.

Big brother is not the answer.

Obama is not a child killer. He is simply not going to use the federal government to make a woman's choice for her. Doing so could actually do the opposite, as it is her decision that she will make regardless of the law.

In the end, overturning Roe v. Wade only sweeps the statics under the rug because they would no longer be traceable, and would serve only to make the Christian Reich feel better about themselves in their crusade to save the collective soul of America.

That collective soul doesn't exist and their crusade would realistically only serve to turn a cold shoulder on expectant mothers, thus failing the unborn child.

I am well aware that many on this board feel there's no such thing as an unborn child and that it should be referred to as a medical condition, and that pregnant women are not expectant mothers, they are simply pregnant (so be it). Using those references are not the way to go into such discussions, but it's your choice.

Peace

[LynnTheDem]

9. Answer: an estimated 720,000.

Question: How many babies has George W. bUsh caused the death of in Iraq?

[Solomon]

10. How come they don't object to all the abortions that God performs?

Oh yeah, I forgot. It's okay for God to do the killing. God aborts more babies than anyone.

[Left Is Write]

12. "Abortion enthusiasts"? Good god. Anyone who uses language like that

is beyond redemption.

She should, however, be disabused of the notion that Barack Obama supports killing babies. It's a ridiculous and baseless accusation.

[Unsane]

13. You can't argue with someone who has a mental illness.

[unpossibles]

15. I just deleted a friend over the same meme

We did not know each other that well, and I noticed all her bellyaching and decided I did not need such friends.

[Ozma]

16. Spending time answering stupid people of Facebook who have no

clue about the law, about bills in the legislature, about public health, about society's need to protect women from back room butchers, spending time talking to these people and calling them your "friends" is a waste of that short lifetime you have here on planet Earth.

Ignore these people and move on with your life!

[Sweet Freedom]

17. Illinois and Federal "Born Alive" Legislation Were Not the Same

Illinois And Federal Born Alive Infant Protection Acts Did Not Include Exactly The Same Language. The Illinois legislation read, "A live child born as a result of an abortion shall be fully recognized as a human person and accorded immediate protection under the law." The Born Alive Infant Protections Act read, "Nothing in this section shall be construed to affirm, deny, expand, or contract any legal status or legal right applicable to any member of the species homo sapiens at any point prior to being 'born alive' as defined in this section."


http://factcheck.barackobama.com/factcheck/2008/06/30/washington_times_wrong_on_obam.php