The Sad truth about GOP's appeal to Joe the Plumber and his ilk

[TheCoxwain]

When economically disadvantaged people ( Joe actually made 40,000 and wanted to buy a business that would have let him make more than 250K a year ( or so he thinks)) come out in favor of GOP tax policies what is essentially happening is that Joe is voting as per his dream rather than his economic situation .. This is a sad sad truth for many people..


Republicans have successfully marketed the illusion of unbounded wealth via Low taxes ... Even if every single one attains that dream through hardwork at some point .. the reality is that a progressive tax policy will benefit a majority of people given the current situation, more than a tax policy dictated by the supply-siders.

This is truly sad that a large swath of the cross-section chooses an economic policy that is disadvantageous to them.

[bookman]

1. That nails it..

voting as per his dream rather than his economic situation.

I've met so many people like that. I think the Republican/Conservative surge was with people who saw themselves as "rich".

Many because they maxed out their credit.

[Barack_America]

2. Not only that, but it shows that they are so out of touch with the average American...

That when they find one that suits their needs, they try to frame everything around that person's perspective.

But, as the focus groups last night showed, real "average Americans" don't identify with "Joe the plumber" and don't appreciate being told that they somehow are like him.

[MarjorieG]

3. Heard Krugman years ago call it pre-wealth. Not paying taxes should one day they make it big.

[Dr Fate]

4. These folks dont realize that the Republicans do NOT want them at their country club.

An over-simplification, but that's my take.

Joe thinks the GOP will let him into the country club some day, but as Harry Truman said-"If you want to live like a Republican, vote Democratic!"

[TheCoxwain]

6. That is a brilliant remark .. If you want to live like a Republican - vote Democrat

I wish people say it out aloud more often..


I wish Obama used this in the debate last night in response to Joe.

[Hamlette]

5. 17% of Americans believe they are in the top 1% income wise

the rest, who vote GOP, think the will be if the GOP is in charge.

They never look at the facts.

Same with health care. The US pays more than any other country but is 37th in quality.

Most Americans think we get the best health care. Nope. That's France.

[WallStreetNobody]

7. You know I think its even worse than that...

I think Joe is aware of the fact that he will never make $250,000 or at least not be making it anytime in the next several years. Let's be realistic, not to knock plumbers (which he isn't one of technically), very few plumbers will ever make $250k+ and virtually none will make significantly more than that. I think Joe is smart enough to realize this. I think guys like Joe feel if they agree with the tax policies for the rich, they somehow become "welcome" in that class. It's like they all feel the same way, it mentally takes him away from his real life and the people he really spends his time with, in his head him and the "rich" are all on the same page. He doesn't realize that to a rich person he's completely irrelevant. It's this whole mental satisfaction guys like him get to pretend they are like the rich by agreeing with the rich. What they don't realize is the rich guy is looking out for his own self-interest, while guys like Joe aren't looking out for their own.

[burythehatchet]

8. And this is where prosperity theology ties in.

[TheCoxwain]

9. This is turning out to be a very Intelligent thread ...I am discovering a few things here .

especially the post by 'wallstreetnobody' .. Thanks everyone .. you guys are brilliant... I thought that I was onto something -- but you all are something else


I have always wondered why people vote against their own economic interests .. I tried to rationalize by attributing it to religion and wedge-issues ...but the fundies /principled libertarians still only make up about 25-30% of the population ... and the plutocrats another 5% who will benefit from pro-rich tax policies. That leaves about 15% who vote republican despite everything ..

With all the images in advertisements of the rich life style .. people want to feel/ act like a rich person .... Buy a fancy car and you can live like a rich man ,,,, buy a big house and you can live like a rich man ..... and you guessed it .... Vote Republican --and you can live like a rich man...


Who wants to deal with reality .. of doing accounts and saving a penny at the end of the month for a rainy day .... I am just going to use my credit card / Line of Credit and live like a Rich man ..


WOW ... we have a serious problem .... we are country full of people with serious issues ..

[WallStreetNobody]

10. TheCoxwain, I have spent a lot of time arguing....

about this subject on another non-political board with a guy who fits Joe's description perfectly. And I always say to him, "Why do you favor policies that favor me at your expense?". And he never has an answer to it, I think because he realizes the hypocrisy in it. He also hates Obama but can't say why other than saying things like he's a "socialist". The guy is working class and admits to living paycheck to paycheck, yet he consistently favors policies that will never help him. And I am sure he does not believe he will ever be rich, but he's just under this delusion that he would be better off in his life with virtually zero government. These guys are even against things like OSHA, just anything that is government (except the military of course).

You should read this article that is coming up in this weeks' New York Times Magazine about Barack Obama and the Working Class Voters. Obama has such a keen understanding of where the divide lies and how to mend it, it is essentially a group of people who have never seen promises delivered by their government so they've become so cynical that the only rational decision may be to support Republicans who at least claim they will have "less government". Anyway, read the article, even if you think your respect for Obama is at its max, it will grow more after reading this.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/19/magazine/19obama-t.html?_r=1&ref=magazine&oref=slogin

[TheCoxwain]

12. I subscribe to the paper version of the New York Times ...so I will wait

for the hardcopy ...(which I will enjoy with my coffee) ...But thanks for the heads up .. Will look forward to it

There was also an earlier article called Obamanomics ... which gave me an insight into Obama's thinking .. What it essentially told was that Obama is a hard-nosed pragmatist , where as most liberals are Idealists ... that is one reason why he opposed the mandatory purchase of health care... He understands that policy can only be sold in digestible chunks rather than the Ideal whole ... and I felt the same way even when Krugman was pushing for Hillarycare and expressed serious doubts over Obamacare many months ago.

But Iam sure the upcoming article will inform me more .... Ive added you to my buddy list.

Welcome to DU :hi:

[colonel odis]

11. also part of the reason for their racist attitudes toward obama.

nothing pisses off those wannabes more than seeing someone in an economic and cultural class higher than their own, when they believe that person should be in one lower than theirs.

talk about class envy ... so many of the joe the plumbers and bubba the copier salesmen can't stand the thought that obama has a harvard education, is comfortable financially, and has a traditional family.

it. drives. them. up. the. wall.