Obama didn't handle the "surge" matter very well

[Rex_Goodheart]

Obama failed to frame the issue correctly. He should have pointed out that McCain doesn't understand the situation at all. That the surge is not a matter of "victory" or "defeat" for the United States because we are not there defending ourselves from Al Qaeda... we are there POLICING a civil war of our own making. And, finally, that the surge in troops has helped in that policing, but that the decision by the combatants, themselves, to cool the hostilities is the larger factor.

[Kahuna]

1. Who cares? That debate is over and Obama won. nt

[Thrill]

2. I actually think he owned the issue here. When he turned it on McCain

by saying he likes to think this war started in 07. Then listed the things McCain was wrong about. I have to disagree. I think that was actually his best part of the debate.

[Hepburn]

4. My exact thought on this...

...is that Obama OWNED McCain on that issue.

:hi:

[Hepburn]

3. I disagree.

I thought Obama did an excellent job with taking the subject all the way back to the inception of the war and unloading on McCain on just exactly how wrong he (McCain) has been ~~ X 3 ~~ about the Iraqi War.

To me, one of the best things Obama did in the debate.

:hi:

[tallahasseedem]

5. Gotta love

Sunday morning quarterbacking. :eyes:

Not everything can be framed properly on the fly...he won, why does this matter now?

[iamthebandfanman]

6. i think it needs to be pointed out that

regardless of whether more troops and alliances with secs have caused better stability...

whats gonna happen when we leave?

im pretty sure regardless of how long we take or how short we take to withdraw, the result with be the same...
and thats an iraq with many sects trying to get power...

this is a disaster in the waiting, and nothing we can do will stop it...
we created it, and now we will have to deal with an unstable civil war engulfed(if we are lucky, cause a theocracy could take over) country

it was a HUGE mistake to have gone.

so regardless of whether the surge is 'working' or not, the result will be the same... a less stable middle east than when we arrived.

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

7. I agree with you. He should have told the dirty truth about the surge. Paying for ethnic cleansing

and that the surge was to calm things down enough for the Iraqi government to govern and so far that result has been dismal.

[Honeycombe8]

8. I think Obama won that point. But I agree that he could've made a couple more points...

about the surge. Not YOUR points (I don't agree exactly with your viewpoint on it). But he could've pointed out that there is no evidence that the surge is the reason for the decrease in violence, but rather it was this other thing (McCain flubbed up about the datas of occurrences previously in that regard, so that would've been a reminder about that).

But if it IS true that Obama previously said the surge was successful, Obama was limited in saying, now, that it wasn't the cause of the decrease in violence.

[cureautismnow]

9. He should also point out that part of the "surge" involved bribery.

Paying the Sunnis not to fight has contributed to a reduction in violence.

[PearliePoo2]

12. Yes...this is a little known fact

that Joe/Jane Sixpack are not aware of.
IMO, Obama might point out we are paying $300 each and every month to each Sunni not to fight us.
It's like a protection/extortion racket.
What happens when the money stops? Duh!
McBomb is so obsessed with the "Surge", it has taken on a sexual connotation with him.
McBomb: "We are WINNING, we are WINNING." No, McClueless, we're not winning shit.

[alcibiades_mystery]

13. It's a loser argument

As we saw on Real Time last night, the conservative will just turn around and ask whether you'd like to spend money or American lives. And what are you going to say then?

[cureautismnow]

16. Easy. We save money AND American lives by leaving.

Let Iraqis figure out for themselves how to run their own country. They have a surplus. They can afford to bribe their own people not to fight. Why should we borrow money from the Chinese to pay the Sunnis not to fight, when we could simply pack up our war toys and come home?

[RichGirl]

10. He said exactly that, only better than you...no offense.

McCain rants on as if the surge is the sum total of the war. The fact that Obama pointed out, very passionately that the war did not start in 2007, but in 2003 was BRILLIANT. He also pointed out that the purpose of the surge was a tactic to make up for the huge mistakes that had been made, approved by McCain, previously.

As far as saying that McCain "didn't understand"...that's condescending and people don't like it. You've obviously heard all the criticism McCain has gotten for being condescending, why would you suggest that Obama do the same. He is a good person who knows how to show respect even to people who don't deserve it.

[Motown_Johnny]

11. I think he knew how he wanted to answer it and did what he needed to do.

I have such faith in this campaign that I honestly believe that even the answers I think are wrong are actually more effective.


I would like to hear him say... "Fighting the wrong war the right way is still wrong, and it has forced us to fight the right war, Afghanistan, the wrong way" (or something like it). But if that loses us votes among indies then fuck it.

[graywarrior]

14. Proof?

[yardwork]

15. I heard Obama say that McCain keeps acting like the war started in 2007.

Obama also said that he would never have agreed to starting the war in Iraq in the first place - that we left Afghanistan before finishing the job.

I thought that Obama handled it well. McSmirk had nothing left to say except that Obama was wrong. It sounded lame.

[PolNewf]

17. His "You were wrong" line was awesome, and the way he delivered it was very effective

It will probably be the most remembered part of the debate, it got a lot of play on television.

[BlooInBloo]

18. You fail pathetically.

[retread]

19. If he would have thrown a pass instead of running the ball... Oh wait, wrong forum. n/t