People who call the Kerry campaign to tell them how to run a campaign

[Radical Activist]

Any Presidential campaign gets a lot of people who call in with comments. Some of them are people who are sure they know just exactly what Kerry needs to do, even though they have never worked on an election campaign and probably aren't even volunteering outside their living room to help Kerry. Has anyone ever volunteered to answer phones at a campaign office and spent ten minutes listening to someone piss and moan about what they think the campaign is doing wrong, but then have that person change the subject when you suggest what they can do to help? What do you think of these people?

[Guaranteed]

1. Those people should be passing out Kerry health care plan flyers!

Or talking to their friends about how Kerry really just authorized Bush to go to war, but didn't endorse it!

Or, if they're REALLY dedicated, they could write a letter to the Bush campaign asking them to denounce the Smear Vet ads, like Mary Beth Cahill asked us all to!

[Radical Activist]

3. Good suggestions n/t

[soothsayer]

2. Really a combo of "waste time" and "volunteer"

but I voted for volunteer....even tho I was thinking "wasting time"

THey need to shut up EVEN if they volunteer! Well...perhaps I'm overreacting to a "Kerry should drop out of the debates" strategy thread. Hoo boy.

[goodhue]

54. agreed

I voted waste time but was thinking volunteer.
At the very least they should keep their harassment to themselves.
Encouraging others to harass campaign is really a nuisance.

[JI7]

4. hahha, yup

it seems many don't understand that those who answer phone calls are just mostly volunteer people who don't know the candidates personally well. some might have probably shook their hand or taken a picture with them. but they have no direct access to the candidates.

some think that those people answering the phones can easily tell kerry about the incredible advice they got and if only kerry follows it we would easily win.

but then again that is much easier than going out and spending a few hours to do something which may at the end of the day seem too little but is really something which helps in winning elections if enough people do something similar.

[soothsayer]

6. this is the first election I've ever done anything---looking up phone #'s

on the internet for 100 people for Arlington, VA. It felt...great! If everyone did a wee bit to lend support imagine what could be accomplished!

[Dr Fate]

5. I hear ya. I deal with the talkers everyday.

Those types lend plenty of suggestions and even hostility, but no support.

[John_H]

7. Wasting thier time: Since it took the threat of getting fired to get

certain members of Team Kerry to even start to abandon their ineffectual approach, why do people think their calls will matter?

[Orangepeel]

8. I thought that Kerry's campaign was dead until two days before Iowa

and I'm not a political novice. His campaign was pathetic, invisible, dead in the water.

Well, we know how that turned out.

I don't always agree with what Kerry's campaign seems to be doing and, like the callers in your question, I get really frustrated when they seem to not be doing enough or to be doing the wrong things. I take comfort in the fact that I didn't know all that was going on then and I might not know all that is going on now.

People who call the Kerry campaign should be listed to politely and their comments logged and read. Campaigns sometimes get myopic, but some yahoo on the phone is very unlikely to know more than the staff.

[displacedtexan]

28. Pathetic? Invisible?

How do you think Kerry supporters outnumbered rivals with trained caucus voters at 98% of caucus meeting places?

Campaign organization and coordination.

Invisible to you, maybe.

Fire fighters, police officers, union workers, and local Dems were highly visible in Iowa.

[Orangepeel]

50. did you read my post?

that was the whole point.

[mondo joe]

9. Nice CNN style polliing.

You forgot other options, like the Campaign should be aware of the opinion trends from the grassroots.

[JI7]

10. he is talking about grassroots type people

he isn't talking about the top senior advisors. those people don't take the calls from the phone numbers that we can call into. the numbers that are open to the public for anyone to call reach volunteers, non professional people.

[mondo joe]

12. I'm talking about the people calling. Apparently their $ and votes are

I'm talking about the people calling. Apparently their $ and votes are good enough, but not their opinions.

Fortunately Ted Kennedy doesn't agree.

[JI7]

14. huh ?

there are 10s of millions of voters in this country. you think the campaign should take the time to listen to every single person who wants to rant about something ?

and anyways, that does not address what the poster's original point was in that the people they are calling are not professional campaign workers but just regular people who have volunteered to do that type of work without pay. and when they give suggestions to those who call to rant on what they could do to help the people change the subject or don't want to hear it.

[mondo joe]

17. Do you think anyone should?

"there are 10s of millions of voters in this country. you think the campaign should take the time to listen to every single person who wants to rant about something ?"

I don't know - do you think CNN should? Or FOX? Should the White House? Should Clear Channel?

[JI7]

19. no

[mondo joe]

21. No? Remember that the next time there's a call to phone CNN

Or the white house.

[JI7]

23. i already know

[mbali]

11. Which they won't get from unscientific random calls from complainers

Don't worry - they're getting plenty of information about what the grassroots opinions are. That's why they do internal polling.

[mondo joe]

13. By this rationale you shouldn't call the white houser or cnn either

They're getting plenty of information from polling after all.

[ClassWarrior]

15. CNN and WH have mechanisms in place to record opinions and share them...

...with decision-makers. Have you ever even been IN a campaign office?? They don't have COFFEE CUPS, much less any system of recording big-picture "suggestions."

[mondo joe]

16. So my opinion is good enough to criticize war and foreign policy

But not a political campaign?

Okay.

[JI7]

18. did you even read what the original poster wrote ?

[ClassWarrior]

20. Did I say that? You may have the best political strategy in the world.

But unless you have the ear of a campaign decision-maker, it won't do much good to anyone.

Here's a hint though: become the best, most go-to volunteer in your local campaign office, and you'll start getting access to those ears...

[mondo joe]

22. There are many sorts of value

There's also the value of people feeling that they're being listened to, whether it reaches the ears of decision makers or not.

I just don't see any reason to put people down who feel they want to communicate something back to the campaign.

[ClassWarrior]

24. I can see the need to rant.

But why not channel that frustration into something more productive?

[mondo joe]

26. There are 24 hours a day.

People can volunteer, they can be on message boards, they can phone in their opinions.

I don't think "if you have an opinion don't call us" is a good message. Especially not from a group of people asking for your support. Fortunately the Kerry cvampaign hasn't said that and I don't think they ever would.

We always call for people to phone or email CNN, the white house and anyone else we're displeased with. And rightly so. I'm not willing to treat our candidate by a different standard.

If people feel they're listened to it helps maintain their committment and feeling of inclusion. I think that's worth a few minutes of a volunteers time.

[ClassWarrior]

27. You didn't answer my question.

[mondo joe]

33. I thought I did, but I'll clarify,

Those frustrations CAN be channeled into something more productive. Making a phone call doesn't exclude that.

My point was that there's time to do a lot of things - make a phone call, post on a message board, volunteer and so on. One doesn't exclude another.

[ClassWarrior]

34. My point is that there's NOT a lot of time for most folks.

And less than 2 months left in the election. Rather than waste your time, as well as another volunteer's, get involved and change it from within. Much more effective.

[mondo joe]

35. You mean there's not time in the day for a 2 minute call AND volunteering

I have two kids, I have a job. It;s amazing how many phone calls I can work into a day.

Honestly, if you can take the time to post here you can make the time to call AND volunteer.

I never see anyone complain that they don't have the time to call to complain about Bush or CNN.

[ClassWarrior]

37. If you're at HQ, why do you have to call?

Can't you share it with your fellow volunteers in person?

[ClassWarrior]

42. Besides, it's a two-minute call for you...

...but it's probably 500 two-minute calls a day for a campaign staffer. That's more than 16 hours. Do the math.

[Radical Activist]

60. multiply that by millions of people who call

I can see some of the people who make those calls are DUers. You could have every single person on the Kerry staff nation-wide spend all day long every day listening to people who call in to piss and moan about what Kerry should be doing or what they think the campaign should do, and it would still never be enough. Opinions are like assholes, everybody has one.

Ask yourself two questions. Would you rather someone in a Kerry campaign office be working productively to elect John Kerry President, or should they spend their time making someone feel better by listening to them complain?

Second, if you want John Kerry elected President will that be better accomplished by you calling up Kerry HQ and giving them expert advice or calling them up and asking what you can do to help?

[JI7]

25. some of them deserve to be put down

as those in the example given by the original poster.

[ScreamingMeemie]

49. No one in this party deserves to be put down. With the possible

exception of Zell. The original poster is doing the campaign no favors by acting in this fashion. I don't want a part of any political party that treats callers in this manner. So therefore, I am highly suspicious of the validity of this post.

[Colin Ex]

56. Maybe if you bought us coffee cups

and some food to eat we'd listen to you more.

Or if you had a masters' degree in polisci to show us.

Just saying.

[mondo joe]

58. Remember that the next time you disagree with a US policy

If you don't have a degree in foreign relations your opinion isn't worth hearing.

[mbali]

29. The White House doesn't set its policies based upon the telephone calls

it gets. Their activities are driven by scientific polls.

CNN, on the other hand, lives or dies by its viewership and, therefore, random viewer opinion does have an impact. However, they don't base their assessment of viewer opinion solely on the calls they get - they also use highly scientific means to determine their viewers' opinions.

[mondo joe]

32. So do you think we shouldn't complain to the White House?

Who else should we stop complaining to?

CNN?

FOX?

Zell Miller?

Clear Channel?

[ScreamingMeemie]

30. No fitting answer for me in your poll. This used to be a government

by the people and for the people. I am getting more and more angry and upset that we are basically being told that we don't know what's good for us...from BOTH sides. I call B.S. I want my country back.
Thanks.

[mondo joe]

31. Thank you.

[HootieMcBoob]

36. yeah why listen to what the people have to say?

that would be the equivalent of making policy based on a focus group. Hmmmm....where have I heard that before?

[rocktivity]

38. Their comments should be valued because of the "Jackass Principle"

When one person calls you a jackass, ignore it. When TEN people call you a jackass, buy yourself a saddle.

The real problem is that so many people are contacting the Kerry campaign with the same complaint. Like it or not, that means that THE CAMPAIGN IS NOT WORKING. If that hurts the feelings--or alters the employment status--of the campaign's "professionals," that's their problem. The voters' needs come first, and you don't de-stablize your base under ANY circusmstances.

Kerry wasn't giving the people what they wanted--someone who would symbolically get right in Bush's face and tell him that his joyride was over. He miscalculated the effect that personally ignoring the Smear-Boaters would have in this age of the Internet and 24-hour news channels. But thank goodness he started listening to the resulting complaints.

I'm sure that a good ninety-nine percent of what the volunteers have to listen to is worthless. But they're the ones who votes Kerry needs, and that one hundredth caller just might have a nugget of gold that will put him over the top. Ten of us told Kerry he was being a jackass. He was smart enough to listen and do something about it. Next stop, the White House!

:headbang:
rocknation

[JI7]

39. that's not true

the Kerry campaign discussed these swift boat liars months ago. they knew it would come up. they know many things which they will be attacked on. they did debate whether and how to respond. there are many attacks they know will occur. but with a limited budget they have to make decisions on which ones to spend money responding to in ads and which ones to just respond in lower cost ways such as posting things online which they did do. but many on du who complain don't pay attention to this.

if the campaign spend money responding to every attack with ads they would have been out of money long time ago.

and the swift boat attacks have not been very effective.

[rocktivity]

41. An ad? All that was needed was a public statement directly from Kerry!

Once the Smear-boaters made their debut, Kerry himself should have issued a conscise, spin-retardant, Bush-undermining statement like, "This is obviously a politically-orchestrated attempt to divert attention away from my opponent's military record." THEN he could have sat back and let the response team do the rest. People got upset because it appeared as though Kerry wasn't interested in defending himself.

:headbang:
rocknation

[JI7]

44. hahahha, Kerry has released many public statements

the media never reports on them.

[Colin Ex]

40. Speaking as an intern who fielded a lot of these phone calls

I have a few points I'd like to bring up.

1) I do NOT have a direct connection to John Kerry. I cannot call him or his campaign up on the Bat-Phone. So when you say "I think it would be great IF..." you're wasting my time and yours, but mostly mine.

2) If you start our discussion with "I think John Kerry should..." then that five second pause you hear is me finding paperwork to do while you waste my time for ten minutes. Seriously.

3) I don't really care about what you're saying because I am an intern, working for free 20 or 30 hours a week, and it's not like they're paying me.

4) You want to know why you're on the phone with an intern? Because the field directors have people like me around so you don't waste ten minutes of their time.

5) When you call, the person fielding your call (me) has usually been staring at a computer screen doing data entry, putting together palmcards, or making phone calls for a few hours straight. (Side note: unless you can tell me what data entry, palmcards, and phone calls entail, STFU) That, along with you're wasting my time, is why I'm mostly ignoring you.

I spent pretty much the whole summer dealing with people who would call in and tell me about how John Kerry should discuss the critical plywood shortage or complain to me about how John Kerry has no message or tell me how much they hated the person who answered the phone (without actually leaving a name: evidently there's a phone troll under the desk who takes care of it). Working 20-30 hours a week pretty much all summer without pay has pretty much completely killed my acceptance for bullshit when I'm behind a desk.

Just my two cents: please don't waste my time and yours (mostly mine).

[NeoConsSuck]

43. If you are representative of the people that surround Kerry

it's no wonder he's tanking in the polls.

Speaking of wasting items, I think your post was a total waste of bandwidth.

[JI7]

45. "tanking in the polls" ?

and where is the evidence of that ?

[Colin Ex]

51. Cry me a river.

I'm about as representative of the people surrounding Kerry as Batman is to multimillionaires. I am an INTERN WHO ANSWERS THE PHONE AND COORDINATES WALKS (30 hours a week).

[ScreamingMeemie]

46. I'm sorry...then tell me again why we should give a damn about our

country again? I mean, if my voice isn't being heard, then why bother? Why campaign for a campaign that thinks my valid concerns are a waste of their time? Wouldn't campaigning for them be a waste of time?

Again, I find another rude and condescending post. It is my sincere hope that you made it all up. Or "we the people" just went out the window.

Thanks,
Laura

[mondo joe]

47. I'm with you. I don't like the "Give your vote and your $ but STFU"

I get phoned and emailed for donations to Kerry/the DNC several times a week.

It's astonishing to think some people feel Kerry supporters should give their time, give their vote, give their $, but STFU if they have a concern or complaint.

I really didn't like being called a traitor for opposing the Iraq War or opposing US policies. I don't like it any better coming from democrats.

[Colin Ex]

52. Rude and condescending, I concede.

But between dealing with all the old people who come in to bitch about nothing for fifteen minutes at a time and fielding phone calls from people who call just for the sake of arguing with an intern (who's been punching and collating palmcards for three hours straight and can't really think straight), I don't have a lot of patience left for bullshit. It's not like I bother you at YOUR job, and even if I did, at least they pay you.

Dealing with ass-clowns is part of the job, I admit, but I don't like it much, and thank God I don't have to.

One of the reasons I think it's stupid when people call my office is because I work in a shitty little office in the middle of nowhere. You've got a better chance of reaching John Kerry by calling 10 Downing Street than by calling my office. I mean, seriously: I'm working my ass off for local candidates and you telling me about how you don't like what John Kerry is doing wastes my time and yours.

[ScreamingMeemie]

63. Newsflash...I've yet to get paid for being somebody's Mom. And they

talk to me all the time and give me advice and ask questions that many people would find to be irritating and a waste of my time.

My suggestion: find another internship. This one doesn't seem to be cut out for you. Or, if it is, this party is no longer cut out for me...and I'm out in the cold.

Thanks. Thanks a heck of a lot for showing me a side of this campaign that is revolting.

[goodhue]

55. Thanks for your valuable perspective.

I voted waste time.
Keep up the good work.

[Radical Activist]

59. Thank you

I think you made my point very clear and without the level of sarcasm I enjoy using. Anyone who has had the experiences we've had knows what this post is about.
Oh yeah, and thanks for helping by being an intern.

[ScreamingMeemie]

61. I've had those same experiences and I have no idea what he is talking

about. When I was fielding and making phone calls we were all in it together, and what people had to say was important. Shame it isn't that way anymore.

[Radical Activist]

62. Did you ever spend 20 minutes

listening to someone complain about the campaign who then also refused any offer or suggestion about how to actually help the campaign in a way that was useful?
If not, then yes things have changed. Smaller campaigns don't get so many of those calls but high profile ones, like a Presidential race, always do. Someone who has lots of ideas but won't work isn't "in it together" with anyone.

[ScreamingMeemie]

64. Yes I have. Lots of times. And, instead of taking the martyr route, I

kept in mind that these people had every interest in helping as I did. I didn't label them "assclown". I realized they wanted the same goal that I did, regardless of what kind of time they put into it. It is people like the above poster who will cost votes. Sorry, plain and simple. I was at the Convention this weekend in Detroit. It was great to meet people with the same basic ideology as me even though two of them were rabid DLCers. It's good to be in the same boat, no matter how much you paid for your ticket. It's part of the job.

The assumptions of some on this board that the rest of us sit on our hands is amazing.

I'm supposed to be canvassing for Kerry next week. This kind of stuff really makes me want to tie my tennis shoes and run out there.

In closing, every damned suggestion should be important, no matter what your personal opinion is.

[cheshire]

48. The waste one should be higher

[Colin Ex]

53. Yeah. nt

[goodhue]

57. yes, only 4 kind of surprises me

are there not more?
maybe waste time is not in vocab of folks who post on DU
i guess shut up is more compelling

[DinahMoeHum]

65. While I chose option 2, I understand their frustration. . .

They want their raw meat and they want it NOW !!

:kick: