Swift Boat Veterans planning the most "lethal" ad for October...

[Junkdrawer]

http://www.swiftvets.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=4539

This despite the fact that all 527 media buys are supposed to stop 60 days before the election.

Oh wait. That's right. THEIR ads are played by the media for FREE.

Silly Me.

[tridim]

1. That's a good point

All they have to do is keep posting ads on the Internet and the media will play them over and over again. Do 527 laws even cover the Internet?

[A_Possum]

2. I doubt they'll get away with that

Call me an optimist.

[hang a left]

3. Yep, almost 24/7.

More BANG for your buck...I guess.

[Junkdrawer]

4. The question that will be debated long after this election is over:

How did a group of RW vets get to control the political dialog for an election?

[Julien Sorel]

6. And the media will kick themselves for it, there will

be public mea culpas, just as there were for Willie Horton and the Iraqi war, and then they'll go out and do the exact same thing.

[Junkdrawer]

7. Thought the same thing this afternoon...

"oh why did we do that"... I can hear it now.

[Bluzmann57]

5. It hasn't worked so far

So in the words of their president, "Bring it on". Kerry is proving that he is smarter and stronger than them. Although it isn't all that hard to be smarter than Thurlow.

[A_Possum]

People of Oregon are already going after a prosecutor there...

One of the Smearvets who says on the ad "Kerry lied," signed an affidavit to that effect, and then admitted it's third hand information.

They are trying to get him removed from his position.

Good. I hope his career, honor and future are decimated. I've never seen a more clear-cut case of somebody who deserves to be shunned by society for the rest of his life.

[Democat]

13. All DUers, please read this thread and help Kerry fight a Swift Liar!

John Kerry needs your help - one of the Swift Liars has been caught lying in his sworn statement and that liar is also a prosecutor in Orgeon. His bosses need to know that he has been caught lying in a sworn statement:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=771552&mesg_id=771552

[Feanorcurufinwe]

8. Thank you for your dose of reality.

[redstateblues]

12. Vet Or Not- Thurlow Is One Dense SOB

[matt bors]

9. Republicans are good at this stuff.

This is so unblievable. They are so god at sucking the energy out of democracy, all we talk about is Swift Boat veterans now. It's like someone in 'OutFoxed' said: (paraphrase) "they don't have to be right all the time, but if the can argue everything they will muddy the arguement to a standstill"

[Gloria]

10. If they accuse Kerry of raping women or children, or torturing

people... then what??????????

[TNMOM]

11. Kerry has lethal ammunition yet

...No way Kerry and his team haven't already planned for an all-out attack that includes pre-empting whatever crap the not-swift liars come up with. Kerry is an impressive campaigner. I'm a firm beleiver that he'll one-up the chimpster.

[DoYouEverWonder]

14. I doubt if the Sinking Boat Liars

will still be putting out commercials in October. They will be too busy lawyering up for all the violations of campaign law that they've committed.

[Gothmog]

15. Ban on applies to independent 527s

Since these liars are really part of the Bush/Cheney campaign, their October ad will be showned and paid for by the Bush/Cheney campaign.

[Junkdrawer]

16. Seriously, Can they do that?

:shrug:

[Democat]

17. The ad ban only applied to soft money, not hard, according to this

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x657438

[Gothmog]

18. Correct

527s and soft money can not be used for the sixty days prior to the election. SBVT can only put an ad out if it is paid for by the Bush/Cheney campaign under the law. This is assuming that they intend to abide by the law.

[BeFree]

19. Accomplice

If a station runs an illegal ad, couldn't they be held liable for being an accomplice to crime?

[Democat]

20. What about hard money "independent" groups - they can run ads, right?

How hard would it be for the right wing to filter the soft money into hard money by running it through more hands?

[thecrow]

21. What are they going to do?

A group suicide on video?
One can only hope.

[maine_raptor]

22. That would be a PSA not a Political Ad n/t

[Junkdrawer]

23. My guess? The "he planned to kill a Senator" smear...

:mad:

[MGKrebs]

24. They are going to talk about Kerry's visit to Paris, where

he allegedly 'negotiated with the enemy' or something like that. This will be a nasty, ugly, hard battle. We must fight it. Write your letters, email your friends, rate the yahoo stories. Let's get out chops down now. We KNOW what's coming.

Research the story. Get the facts.

The ads WILL be news regardless of (or perhaps because of) the legality. get ready.
I'll help.

[GOPGoindown]

27. Here's a preview

I received this in an e-mail from a wing nut friend of mine, who never reveals his sources because he knows I'd ridicule them. Maybe we could debunk this before it gets any steam in October. Sould be a piece of cake for DUers.

I'm not sure if I can post the whole thing due to copyright, so am just posting some snips. It's quite long and detailed.

Did Navy Lt. Kerry violate The UCMJ?

The Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ) is a federal law,...
ART. 104. AIDING THE ENEMY...

John Kerry, in sworn testimony before the Senate in April 1971, said he met with the North Vietnamese and Vietcong delegations in Paris in May 1970...

Kerry continued his military service in the United States Naval Reserves from 1972 through 1978...

So Lt. Kerry was in the Naval Reserves during the time he was meeting with the enemy.

[mourningdove92]

25. From what I can see, the swift boat liars for bush are

starting to lose some steam. Yes, they got a hell of a lot more mileage out of this than they should have, thanks to the "liberal" media :puke:
but they are losing ground. Maybe this is just wishful thinking on my part, this whole thing has upset me terribly. EVEN though we all thought we were prepared for the vicious attacks we knew were coming, this still freaked most of us out with the atrocious evil involved.

Anyway, by October, this should be pretty much behind us. By October, most of America should have made up their minds as to whether they believe the liars or not. If a majority of voters are repulsed by this, anthing they do in October would be a major blow to smirk. If a majority of voters have decided they believe the liars, then it is all over with anyway.

I choose to believe that the obviousness of this smear, the demonstrated connections to the Bush campaign and the whole nasty taste of this will not fly with most voters.

rose colored glasses? Well maybe, but I have to believe.

[MGKrebs]

26. Yeah, well do a google search for

'kerry paris". They are gearing up.

This looks like the essential point:

"Kerry has admitted to one meeting with Madam Binh. Now we have reason to believe there was a second , so let's press them to admit the second ," Corsi told CNSNews.com.

"Kerry needs to explain to the American people why he directly went into negotiations with communists," Corsi added. Corsi has written an essay on Kerry's dealings with the Vietemese communists on the Internet site, WinterSoldier.com. "

http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewSpecialReports.asp?Page=%5CSpecialReports%5Carchive%5C200406%5CSPE20040604a.html

But reading further:

"The {FBI} files record that Kerry made a second trip to Paris that summer (1971) to learn how the North Vietnamese might release prisoners,"

Not a bad motivation, I would think.

And then this:

"...actual negotiations with the enemy, which Kerry knew were illegal."

Pretty lame, unprovable, but will stain if left to soak in.

Here's the relevant law they cite:

"Sec. 953. - Private correspondence with foreign governments
Any citizen of the United States, wherever he may be, who, without authority of the United States, directly or indirectly commences or carries on any correspondence or intercourse with any foreign government or any officer or agent thereof, with intent to influence the measures or conduct of any foreign government or of any officer or agent thereof, in relation to any disputes or controversies with the United States, or to defeat the measures of the United States, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both.

This section shall not abridge the right of a citizen to apply, himself or his agent, to any foreign government or the agents thereof for redress of any injury which he may have sustained from such government or any of its agents or subjects"

I think the actual facts surrounding this will turn out to be harmless to Kerry. But the zealots will make it sound like Kerry was actually shooting at his own Swift boat both to help the NVA and to wound himself. Or something like that. Check this out:

"Vietnamese communists would not have won the war without John Kerry. " Granted, that's maniac Corsi speaking, but we can see how this works. The facts don't matter.

Sharpen your swords!
Man the battle stations!
We must prevail!

edited for dramatic effect.

[Sugarbleus]

28. Great work MG...

Thanks for the heads up.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

34. Remember, Kerry is a lawyer

The key phrase is "with intent to influence the measures or conduct of any foreign government". Intent is practically impossible to prove, and Kerry will be able to believably claim his intentions were honorable.

Sharpen your pens!

[StevieM]

29. It breaks my heart to say it.....

but the swift boat ads seem to be working. I got a call from a friend today, whose husband is in the military. She said that they don't think they will vote for Kerry. They believe the lies that are being spread. I scrambled to send her a link to one of the sites exposing the swift-boat liars.

Apparently, the swift boat people are incredibly active on military bases and in military towns. This stuff is all over the place. And, sadly, it looks like it is going to work. I hope I am wrong, but it seems like these terrible human beings are going to be rewarded for their dishonesty.

I was so digsuted that I felt I needed to say something about it. So after lurking here for a year and a half, I finally registered to post.

Steve

[59millionmorons]

30. Yeah

Judging from the new Zogby state polls today it really is working. NOT

[StevieM]

31. Wow, semi-flamed on my first post.....

Oh well, I hope you're right. It just doesn't seem like Kerry is as strong as he looked a couple of weeks ago. I was watching Scarborough, and it was amazing how on-message the GOP was. They kept talking about how 527s and how Kerry was complaining after not objecting to them at first. As if the whole issue was about 527s and not what was in the ads. They even talked about Bush's past (lack of) service as if criticisms of him were the equivalent of the swift boat lies. And the Dems just didn't seem to keep up.

Maybe it's just my pessimism. I hope that the swift boat crap dies away along with the Bush presidency. I am just starting to get a bad feeling in the pit of my stomach. It's just that the GOP is so evil and a lot of the time evil triumphs unless good is very, very good.

Steve

[speedoo]

32. I tell you, Steve....

By October, the Swift liars will be skulking in hteir own crap. One by one they are being discredited. I have a feeling this election is going to be over within a month.

[democrat_patriot]

33. I know what you mean (sort of)

they were succesful.

$200,000.00 - can you put a price on the media coverage? How can anyone even claim liberal bias? I think they will lose their momentum - already have.

Problem is, fringe voters just hear the bad sometimes.

We need to help - email, fax and call anyone and everyone debunking this crap.