FLA voters feel GOP may have disinfranchised them again

[pathansen]

I keep hearing here in Florida, that it was GOP controlled FLA government's decision
to hold primary ahead of schedule

Some voters feel that this must have been done as a plan by GOP to intentionally use as an excuse to disinfranchise voters for second time.
Has anyone else heard this claim?

[stillcool]

1. It was mentioned at the rules committee..

meeting...often. I think it's a handy excuse for the Florida Democrats who are responsible.

[liam_laddie]

2. Wrong...

The FL legislature, controlled by R's, is who moved the date. D's had no control, AFAIK.

[FredScuttle]

4. Ah, not quite

The legislature, with the governor's support, did vote this spring to move the primaries – Democratic and Republican – to Jan. 29. But after Democratic amendments to set a Feb. 5 primary failed, nearly every Democratic lawmaker joined the Republican majority in favor of the Jan. 29 date.

http://www.csmonitor.com/2007/1016/p01s01-uspo.html

[pathansen]

8. FLA Democrats wanted date changed to Feb. 5 so it would be legal

It was the FLA GOP who pushed for the January date.

Read whole link: http://www.csmonitor.com/2007/1016/p01s01-uspo.html

[Cosmocat]

11. As noted, it wasn't like the Ds fought it ...

The Ds certainly did not drive it, some did the right things, but as a caucus, it wasn't like they hold the moral high ground given they didn't fight it at the time ...

[stillcool]

5. I don't think so..

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1468

Florida Democratic Legislators sponsored the bill to move the primary to January 29th
Florida House Democratic Legislators voted in committee three times for the bill to move the primary to January 29
Florida House Democratic Leader Dan Gelber stated, after offering an amendment to move the primary to February 5th, that the only reason he offer it was “to show that there was an attempt to state within the Democratic Party rules.” The amendment failed on a voice vote with no debate being offered.
See video...video of Fl. Democratic Senator Steve Geller, minority leader mocking the DNC
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r25wUeMAwdE

Wednesday, March 21, 2007
Florida House votes for earlier presidential primary
By STEPHEN MAJORS
Associated Press Writer

TALLAHASSEE, Fla. - Florida voters would choose their presidential nominees as early as January under a plan the state House of Representatives resoundingly passed Wednesday.
---------------------------------------
House Republicans and Democrats passed the earlier primary bill (HB 537) by a 115-1 vote - a challenge to the national parties that are wielding threats in an attempt to prevent a nationwide race for earlier and earlier primaries.
--------------------------------------------------------

The Florida Senate is waiting to see what happens in other states before moving forward with a date, said Sen. Jeremy Ring, D-Margate, who is leading the effort in that chamber.

"It gives us a chance to really watch the landscape," Ring said. "When we're done Florida will be relevant."

___http://www.jacksonville.com/apnews/stories/032107/D8O0PVN02.shtml

The Florida Dem Primary: Delegates V. Influence

22 Aug 2007 08:30 am

On Saturday, the Democratic National Committee's Rules and Bylaws committee (RBC) will meet to formally consider the delegate selection plans submitted by state parties.

All signs suggest that the DNC will formally sanction Florida Democratic Party for .submitting a plan that violates DNC rules. The Florida Democratic Party plans to hold its delegate-selection contest on Jan. 29, seven days before the party's official window opens.

So what will happen? First, the RBC will immediately take away all of Florida's so-called "Superdelegates" -- spots reserved for the members of the Democratic National Committee and members of Congress. Then, the RBC will reduce the remaining delegate total by at least half. (The RBC could reduce the delegate total by 100%, which would also have the weird effect of removing the penalties on candidates who decide to compete there.)

Florida has thirty days from formal receipt of the RBC’s action .to resubmit its plan to cure its defects. Over the past several weeks, DNC officials have discussed several alternatives with Florida, ranging from a party-run caucus to a vote-by-mail primary. The state has rejected them all. Going early is its priority.

Florida Democrats act as if they're not worried about the DNC penalty. They believe that the eventual nominee will restore its delegation to full strength as the convention begins. They therefore conclude that presidential candidates will contest the state as if the DNC had done nothing.

But here's why the DNC's penalty actually has some teeth. If Florida had no delegates to compete for, presidential campaigns have two choices about competing in a penalized Florida. They can spend money to explain why they aren’t spending money to just win a beauty contest. . Or they can spend money to try and actually win what is just a beauty contest.. The former option is much cheaper than the latter option.

And delegates, to the campaigns, matter more in January than they do in July. The Democratic campaigns don't assume that the convention will be brokered; they assume that the nominee will be known by the middle of February. The only metric available to really assess the strength(s) of the candidates at that point is their total number of delegates.
-------------------------------------------------

So, if the state party is only concerned about being seated at the convention, then the RBC's penalty doesn't matter.

But if the state wants to play a role in determining the nominee, then the RBC’s penalty matters a lot. The two interests are in conflict.

http://marcambinder.theatlantic.com/archives/2007/08/the_florida_dem_primary_delega.php

This just in: Geller to miss Dean fundraiser
By S.V. Date | Thursday, September 27, 2007, 04:41 PM


Senate Democratic Leader Steve Geller, who on Wednesday labeled Iowa, New Hampshire, Nevada and South Carolina “terrorist, rogue states” for coercing Democratic presidential candidates not to campaign in Florida in advance of its Jan. 29 primary, on Thursday announced he will not be attending a Tallahassee fundraiser held by the head terrorist himself, Democratic chairman Howard Dean.

“He’s welcome in certain, small enclaves of the state,” Geller told the Q. “If you don’t have something nice to say about someone, you shouldn’t say anything at all. Therefore I will not go.”
http://www.palmbeachpost.com/blogs/content/shared-blogs/palmbeach/floridapolitics/entries/2007/09/27/this_just_in_geller_to_miss_de.html

[madfloridian]

3. Here you go.

Updated list of my journal postings about the Florida primary fiasco.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1906

Florida Democrats invade Georgia
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1905

Dean told not to plan a vacation in Florida.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1902

Court decision on March 17 could determine who Democratic nominee is.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1897

Florida Democrats thought they would only lose "half" the delegates.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1903

Dean says FL and MI would not negotiate with the DNC...took it public
instead.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1888

Florida, Michigan and the Jackasses That Over-reached
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1890

Tampa op ed: "Arrogance Cost Florida Chance To Influence Election"
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1875

Terry McAuliffe wants to change horses in the middle of the stream.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1882

From instigator to victim. It was a Dem who introduced the early primary
bill in Florida.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1829

How it began last August....how Florida Democrats began their propaganda war
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1819

Jeremy Ring (D-FL) said "relevance is more important than "partying" in
Denver.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1836

The worst part is that this very day FL Dems still shift blame....
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1870

Is Hillary's campaign being run as a "shadow DNC" for her benefit?
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1883

More Florida shenanigans and more insults to Dean from that state.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1858

Think I exaggerate about Florida's attitude? Here's a county chairperson's
rant against Dean.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1827

Enough of this. Florida Democrats now threaten Dean and the DNC with a
"voting rights probe".
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1453

The "appropriate legal official" to "investigate" Dean and the
DNC...is...Gonzales.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1452

Nelson: "I will lead the delegates to Denver whether or not the DNC plans to
let them in."
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1455

Two summaries of the DNC committee ruling about Florida.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1456

Florida sowed the seeds of a propaganda war against the DNC.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1458

Proof. Vindication. Both Florida parties did it for "relevance." From March.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1459

The latest Florida propaganda tactic here about attacking the DNC...local
email.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1460

Florida's Geller joked about his amendment: "sarcasm and audible laughter in
chamber"
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1461

One Florida county is saying there will be further bloodshed. Much argument
here today.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1462

Florida Democratic Party website building anger toward the DNC
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1465

Democratic activist sues over loss of Florida delegates
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1466

"Dean was conciliatory and offered DNC help for the state"..hour long phone
call
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1467

Gelber admits they did not fight the GOP about the primary.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1468

"Primary bully Florida ought to be ashamed"...four articles catch on to
Florida's primary ploy.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1469

Bill Nelson today will file a bill for regional primaries...but first he had
to get your attention
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1478

Bill Nelson today: "DNC penalties unacceptable, unacceptable, unacceptable"
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1479

Carl Levin and Terry McAuliffe made a deal about primaries in 2004.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1483

Email from Florida DEC chairs saying not to give to the DNC or candidates.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1481

Pelosi says it is not Florida's fault at all. So if the speaker says it I
must be wrong.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1567

"Florida Democrats are all for it"...March 2006. All for the early primary
that far ahead.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1564

Details on how Florida worked with the GOP to set the early primary date.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1617

Nobody sued Terry McAuliffe when he said Michigan's delegates would not get
near Boston.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1638

Nelson and Levin of Michigan file the bill today. It's getting deeper
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1741

My postings about the heartbreak of the Florida primary fiasco.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1607

Florida Dems at convention have button that says "Screw Dean"...very classy.
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1608

Senate leader ponders suing 'rogue states' over primary
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/madfloridian/1527

[pathansen]

10. Those are your own links. Here is what the law suit actually says

It was the FLA GOP who pushed for the January date.
Link: http://www.csmonitor.com/2007/1016/p01s01-uspo.html

“The lawsuit says the REPUBLICAN-LED LEGISLATURE AND GOP GOV. CHARLIE CRIST MOVED THE PRIMARY FROM ITS TRADITIONAL MARCH DATE TO JANUARY AFTER DNC ANNOUNCED THE PENALTIES FOR SETTING FOR SETTING PRIMARIES BEFORE FEB. 5.”

It goes on to say that the FLA democrats wanted an amendment to change date to Feb. 5 so it would be legal but this failed to pass.

[DevonRex]

6. Then they must work to wrest control from the damned GOP there. nt

[gcomeau]

7. If people aren't hearing it...

...that's the kind of thing we should be correcting and making sure they DO hear.

Edit: Yes, I know the state Dems were complicit, and yes it pisses me off that they screwed us over and keep trying to get away with it without consequences... but I'm in GE mindset now so far more inclined to focus on the Republican side of those to blame. And bottom line is they DO carry blame. And lots of it.

[dems_rightnow]

9. It's a handy excuse, but

the pure D fact is that BOTH sides strongly supported it. It was only after they realized that they'd really screwed the pooch that the Florida Democrats tried to blame it on the other side. Political cover, I guess.

Both sides let the voters down. They arrogantly thought they were too big and important a state in the election to be punished.

[pathansen]

12. Where are your links to support your "facts"?? Here are my links:

Links: http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2008/04/01/8025/
http://www.csmonitor.com/2007/1016/p01s01-uspo.html