A note to women crying sexism in the MSM, and voting for McCain.

[BornBlue]

This is to the women, whom I heard this morning calling in to the Bill Press show, saying that due to the sexism against Hillary Clinton this primary season they will be casting their votes for John McCain come November.

I have a few questions that I need answered.

1. Why punish Barack Obama for what the media did? I am not saying that Obama is entirely innocent in this, however for the most part he has been very respectful of Ms. Clinton. Hillary on the other hand, has used his race against him repeatedly. "Hard-working White Americans" ect.

2. Why give your vote to a man that wants to set back womens rights by appointing judges to the Supreme Court that will repeal Roe v Wade?

3. Why give you vote, and thus seal of approval, to a man who has no respect for women? Seriously he called his wife a "C U Next Tuesday". Where as I see Barack as a man that has infinite respect for women. They way he looks at and speaks about his wife. The respect and gratitude he has shown for his mother. It all shows that he wants to advance all people, not just men and blacks.

I understand this has been a long almost violent primary season, but we are so close to the end, and the ultimate goal. This is bigger than who's candidate faced the worst oppression and "isms". This is bigger than a few hurt feelings on a discussion board. This is about the peace and safety for the entire world. We cannot put this power into John McCain's hands, we know things will get worse not better.

I do not expect to change any minds about this, but I hope that some of you will consider what your actions may do for the world.

[shraby]

1. If they thought Obama was "sexist" , if

they get McCain in..they'll live the meaning up front and personal.

[BornBlue]

3. I agree completely

that's why I don't understand why they want to punish non-Hillary supporters by electing McCain.

[roguevalley]

28. they are nihilists. none of these people care about the country more

than they care about their moment. they don't care.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

2. One question I've never seen answered:

If sexism was the reason Hillary lost the primary, how could she win the GE despite it?

Obviously, the media did engage in some sexist incidents against Hillary, which was shameful, but to place the blame *only* on sexism while simultaneously claiming only Hillary can beat McCain is ludicrous.

Either sexism disappears after the primary (which it obviously wouldn't), or it would become even more magnified once the GE starts.

[BornBlue]

4. Yep, Yep.

Another great point! It always makes me laugh when I hear that only she can beat McCain when she lost the primary. I am not trying to insult but it is back wards logic.

[SoonerPride]

7. There is no point using logic on the Clinton camp. They failed Logic 101.

You are indeed correct.

If sexism hamstrung her campaign in a primary against a black man with a weird name, then she would get stomped in the GE.

[BornBlue]

9. I know, but stupid me I keep trying.

I am still hoping one day this :think: will happen!

[jgraz]

81. They understand logic perfectly. They're just counting on voters being too stupid to get it.

And, apparently, they are finding quite a few people who fit that bill.

[Cheap_Trick]

30. damn, I never thought of that angle!

but you're 100% right.

[Robyn66]

5. I am so frustrated

You make very good points but there are some hard core Hillary supporters who honestly don't care about women's rights or are smart enough to understand the consequences in indulging their vanity. Maybe they are Republican plants, I don't know. But to be looking at this and only seeing your own personal preference and not what is best for the country is wrong. The number one priority should be to get a Democrat back in the Whitehouse. That should be every woman's number one priority, but the women I have seen who call themselves "Hillary Supporters" who behave like the protesters at the Rules committee meeting, demean women by being willing to throw away the rights women have fought and died to give us over a candidate.

Maybe this is Operation Chaos, or maybe they don't really understand the damage they are doing to our daughters and future generations but once these rights are lost it will be very difficult to get them back. And I hope they understand they will have blood on their hands.

[BornBlue]

6. The way I see it,

the women you describe are the ones who have longed for a candidate they can call their own. The finally have a viable woman who was expected to be the nominee at this time last year, and it has been stolen from them so they are going to punish the world. These may be woman who have voted they way their husbands have, and finally felt they had a voice in the public eye and now they are being hushed into the closet again. I understand, I am a woman, but I also am a person that knows this country needs a liberal in the White House.

[leftofcool]

8. Well said.

There is a little more than that but you nailed it pretty good

[SoonerPride]

10. But she wasn't "stolen from them" She LOST. Her campaign was inept.

That isn't the MSMs fault.

It is her own fault.

It is Mark Penn's fault.

She started out with more money, more name recognition, and more super delegates in her pocket and she lost.

She wasted money, ran a poor ground game, and was totally inept.

Obama won despite being a black man with Muslimy-sounding name because he organized a better team and ran a better campaign.

He won.
She lost.

Nothing was "stolen" from Hillary Clinton.

Women may well feel that way, but they are wrong to feel that way.
They are not the victims of some sexist conspiracy. Nor is Hillary Clinton.

She ran a poorly organized campaign.

[BornBlue]

17. You are absolutely right,

however, those are the sentiments that are keeping the party from coming together.

Obama ran a nearly perfect campaign, and Clinton ran a very poor campaign, but rubbing it in does not help. We cannot tell people to stuff their emotions away, or that they are wrong for feeling them. Obama, in his book writes about how important empathy is. We need to show her supporters that we feel their pain, and share in their disappointment. That is the only way we will come together in the fall to win this.

[SoonerPride]

18. Well what should we say when they say an inadequate black man is a sexist pig who stole this?

It wasn't hers to begin with.
She ran a poor campaign.
She lost.

There is no use in sugarcoating it or handholding.

Didn't Hillary herself say if you can't stand the heat yadda yadda yadda?

It's time to be grownups and deal with reality land.

I voted for her. I wanted her to win.
But she lost.
Time to back the party nominee.

Time to support Obama.

[BornBlue]

20. I have supported Obama from the beginning

But I still understand the disappointment in losing a dream. That is all I am saying. I have empathy for her supporters, as we all should.

I appreciated you willing to accept the results, but not everybody is there yet. Some of the sentiments expressed against Obama are downright despicable, but so have some of the sentiments expressed against Hillary. Two wrongs don't make a right, just as two dueling democrats don't equal victory in the fall.

[LowerManhattanite]

13. “and it has been stolen from them”?

Did the nom BELONG to anyone in particular? It was owned?

Every time I hear this line bandied about it makes me cringe.

I seem to recall a stage FULL OF PEOPLE for the Dem debates. Six, seven, eight candidates at a time.

There was a multitude of competitors—nothing was promised TO ANYONE, thus NOTHING WAS STOLEN.

End of story.

[SoonerPride]

15. Another excellent point. Thank you.

Very true.

It wasn't hers to begin with.

[BornBlue]

22. I do not support the idea that it was stolen,

I am just trying to explain perhaps where some of their feelings come from. We are all human, and we all feel disappointment. I am just trying to open eyes on both sides of the battlefield. As Obama supporters we should not deepen the divide by not having consideration for the other sides feelings. This should go visa versa too. If we show them respect, maybe we can get some back, and change minds for the greater good.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

11. That crazy ass woman outside of the Rules Committee already gave you the answer

This is, quite simply put, about a black man--and "inadequate black man"--who stole the election from a white woman.

Say what you will about Father Pfleger but he was absolutely spot on in what he said. Hillary Clinton has this sense of entitlement. When this "inadequate black man" came and stole her show, *some* white women lost their damn minds.

[Elspeth]

12. "crying" huh....one of them code words.

Shame on you!

[BornBlue]

19. I am a woman

and have you ever heard of "The BOY who cried wolf"?

So no that is not code.

[peaches2003]

14. I heard her

Hillary, this woman, and women like her have set women's rights back by a generation. 'Women's rights' means the right for women to vote and the right for women to run for office. It does NOT mean the right to WIN. Sometimes I'm ashamed to be a woman.

[FlaGranny]

16. The feminist story,

I have decided (yes, just me, all on my own) is bogus. We're not seeing feminism, we are seeing bigotry disguised as feminism. It's more socially acceptable that way.

[BornBlue]

21. It is an ugly mess this is true

But that is no reason to discount generations or woman who fought for equality. It may not exist in this situation but it still does exist. Woman still make less than men for the same work, women are still not widely represented in many professions including politics. That said I do not believe that Hillary is the victim of sexism in her failure to earn the Democratic nomination.

[FlaGranny]

23. All you say is true, of course,

I'm using the word "feminism" only in context to these "crazy" people's claims. I don't believe their real problem is their feminist beliefs, but their bigotry. There may be some of these women who have been so damaged by the men in their lives they have become irrational, but I'll bet for the majority, the hatred comes from other reasons. I personally believe in full equality for everyone and in every way and don't hate anyone. I really feel sorry for those who hate. Hatred only harms the one who does the hating. I feel bad for real feminists and I feel sorry for the vast majority of Hillary's supporters who these "crazies" have harmed with their antics. I have always refused to call myself a feminist as I won't brand myself like that. I'm more of a humanist.

[BornBlue]

24. Very well said

I completely agree. These women who have complained about the "sexism" in this campaign are hurting the true feminist's cause, but I am not sure that it is as you say bigotry. I really feel some of her supporters are holding on because they think this may be their only shot at a female president in their lifetime. I can understand wanting to see something in your lifetime and the fear that it will never happen.

I think what we have here is a conflict of importance.

Blacks are excited for the chance at a black leader in the highest position in the country just as are women. When we have two candidates that have both broken historical norms, it is very difficult to say that one group has been more oppressed than the other. Both groups have been treated unfairly in the past, and it is unfortunate that both are running this year. I have never cared for Hillary Clinton, but I respect her, and would have voted for her as the nominee. To me victory in the fall is more important that which "ism" has caused more injustice.

[FlaGranny]

26. I think a lot of it

IS bigotry because I've never seen so much "male" hatred from feminists. I could be wrong - wouldn't be the first time, but the vast majority feminists that I am familiar with were never quite so rabid in their hatred of men alone. There is something else at work here.

I also believe that blacks take the "prize" when it comes to discrimination. Women, especially white women, in my experience don't come close, at least in the US. I've never seen women (outside the witch trials) harmed in the way blacks have been, and in nearly 70 years, I've heard most of it.
Otherwise, I agree, again, with everything you said.

But anyway, we agree with just minor differences. :-)

[BornBlue]

27. Well my mother always told me I was an optimist.

I do see your point, and by the sounds of it you have a lot more experience. In my 23 years, in a small very white town, I have not had most forms of discrimination in my face. I would hope that women who care about equality would want to see every person have an equal chance, but it does seem that Hillary's supporters have a hatred for Obama that is only rivaled by those in West Virginia or Kentucky. If we can't have a woman, then give it to the white man!

Maybe one day in my lifetime I will be able to witness equality in its purest form. I've got hope!

[FlaGranny]

80. Your last sentence -

me too, me too. :-)

[crickets]

25. I think you're right

We're not seeing feminism, we are seeing bigotry disguised as feminism. It's more socially acceptable that way.

It's not more socially acceptable, but it getting a pass and it shouldn't. It's sad and it's ugly, but I think you've nailed it.

[central scrutinizer]

29. Vote for the guy who loudly called his wife a

stupid cunt in a restaurant? I imagine he will do real well with the Asian-Americans who don't mind that he "hates gooks"

[msallied]

31. Look at it this way. It's easier for them to cry they were victims of sexism than for them to admit

that they are actually racists.

[LisaM]

32. I am NOT going to vote for McCain, but this campaign

and the treatment afforded Hillary by the media, in particular, Air American and Stephanie Miller, who should know better, has left me so enraged I almost don't know where to turn. I've gotten so I can't stand the sight or sound of Barack Obama.

[BornBlue]

33. But why blame him?

He did not do these things. He is a candidate that people have supported in less than civil ways, just as some Hillary supporters have crossed some lines along the way.

[LisaM]

34. Because I think the attitude starts at the top, that's why. n/t

[SoonerPride]

38. Prove it.

You're attributing things to Obama which he has not done nor said. He has been nothing but respectful of Hillary Clinton.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

40. Second that.

Obama is ALWAYS praising her when she doesn't deserve it, yet it requires a Herculean effort for her to repay the compliment.

I remember one of the last debates when Hillary was asked point-blank if Obama can win the GE. She rambled on for a minute until the moderator interrupted her and repeated the question, so she finally yelled out, "Yes! Yes, he can win!"

[LisaM]

42. First of all, she does deserve it

and second of all, I just find him to be dismissive and arrogant (and spare me the "uppity" stuff. It has absolutely nothing to do with race). I found his comments about "Tom Hayden Democrats" to be annoying, I think he or his campaign are completely responsible for the false characterizations of the Clintons as racist, and I think he's run a manipulative campaign. I have coworkers who are all gaga over him who probably can't even name our two state senators - so I find his support to a large degree is based on personality.

However, this won't PROVE anything to anyone. I can only speak for myself and how this campaign has made me feel. I have learned a lot I don't want to know about one person though - David Axelrod.

[SoonerPride]

44. Why in hell does she "deserve it"?

A spot at the top of our ticket is earned.

She ran an inherently inept campaign.

She started a mile race 1/4 mile ahead of everyone in the field. She had the name, the war chest, and the super delegate endorsement lead and she still lost.

That is inept.

Obama could have gotten dirty and talked endlessly about her Bosnia lies and her debt problems, but he didn't. He stayed above the fray and offered her roses while she always hit him below the belt.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

45. She deserves *some* praise, but not nearly as much as he's given her.

How is he dismissive and arrogant? No, I won't paint you with the racism brush, nor would I do that to anyone who simply doesn't support him, unless I had clear proof of their racism.

But I always see this "arrogant" meme, yet the most concrete proof people present is a few pics where he (literally) appears to be looking down at people -- disregarding the fact that a picture is taken in a fraction of a second and can produce many possible permutations.

[LisaM]

48. OK, well if you keep denigrating her

good luck with getting her supporters on the bandwagon.

[SoonerPride]

49. Threats and tantrums.

How about facts and links to reality instead of pouting and threats?

If Obama is the evil sexist pig, prove it.

Plus, where in SAs post did he "denigrate her"??

You're making stuff up on the fly.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

51. Denigrating? I'm asking you for proof of Obama's sexism and/or arrogance.

Just because the MSM engaged in some sexism doesn't mean it's Obama's fault.

However, I can provide you with several instances of Hillary personally attacking Obama while using RW/Rovian tactics, including praising McCain over Obama.

When has Obama done anything remotely similar to that?

[LisaM]

52. It is my firm belief that the Obama campaign deliberately framed Hillary

(and Bill) as racist. I don't admire that tactic.

Read my words. I am NOT going to vote for McCain. I wouldn't vote for him under any circumstances, much less any Republican. I understand that we HAVE to vote Democratic. However, to state that I am dissatisfied with my choice would be an understatement.

If you look at pictures of BO and Hillary in debates, you will see him with his head raised, not looking her in the eye. If we are really to be so unified, shouldn't he have looked her in the eye, with at least a modicum of friendliness? He did not do that. It spoke absolute volumes to me.

And I haven't threatened a thing. I did not threaten to vote Republican (or even to note for Obama), which is true of at least 99% of all Hillary supporters I know personally. I heard some woman on the radio say it to Thom Hartmann today, but he kept talking over her and wouldn't hear her out (I think she wanted a little respect for her posit about how HRC has been treated by the media). Talking over someone who is probably well informed on the issues is not a likeable tactic and I was quite surprised to see Hartmann do it.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

53. Not looking at her?

Is that all you have? :eyes:

[LisaM]

55. Sigh. No.

I gave you an example that I noticed myself. Of course you can find a few photos where he is looking at her.

But I still think that he framed her as racist, and I find that unacceptable. There is absolutely no reason at this point that racism and/or sexism should even exist, much less divide our party the way it has. I have a former friend who now thinks that *I'm* a racist, and it's really getting to me.

[SoonerPride]

56. You were proven flat out wrong.

Admit it.

You are upset at Obama based upon misconceptions and misbeliefs not based upon reality.

[LisaM]

57. LOL

A few screen shots don't affect my larger perception, but thanks for the pretty pictures.

[SoonerPride]

59. You said he didn't look her in the eye.

Didn't you just write that like 2 minutes ago?

"If you look at pictures of BO and Hillary in debates, you will see him with his head raised, not looking her in the eye. If we are really to be so unified, shouldn't he have looked her in the eye, with at least a modicum of friendliness? He did not do that. It spoke absolute volumes to me."

And didn't you just see pictures where he DID look her in the eye?

I don't get it.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

61. Remember when Obama pulled out Hillary's chair for her?

He bends over backwards to be nice.

[SoonerPride]

62. That's my perception too. He seems overly deferential to her.

That kindness as even turned against him in this campaign saying he wasn't mean enough to win.

I swear I don't know what is in these people's heads, but it isn't reality.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

63. I can't wait until he unloads on McCain.

I think he was prevented from attacking Hillary too hard for two reasons:

1) She's a fellow Dem.

2) If he overdid it, the MSM would frame it as the angry black guy beating up on the older white woman. Then Hillary would complain while hitting him back at the same time.

:crazy:

[SoonerPride]

64. I've already seen him knock McCain around like a doddering old fool.

He hits him hard daily and I love it.

[Weevlitz]

65. He even draws boos!

In his speeches...when he compliments Hillary...he gets booed! Doesn't stop him being cordial does it?

[SoonerPride]

67. Welcome to DU!

:hi:

[Weevlitz]

69. Awww....THANKS!

It only took a little over 50 posts for someone to notice! Yet...I still feel warm and fuzzy. :D Thanks again!

[BornBlue]

70. Welcome Weevlitz!

:hug:

Hope that does more than warm and fuzzy!

[HooptieWagon]

83. "I swear I don't know what is in these people's heads, but it isn't reality."

True. I think they primarily hate Obama b/c he is beating Hillary, then they invent reasons to justify their hatred - ie: he forced Bill, Hillary and Ferraro to make racist statements; he's sexist (or arrogant); somebody was mean to me on the internet; etc. All are completely untrue, of course, but used to cover up a baser resentment and hatred (or in some cases, racism).

[LisaM]

72. For cripe's sake

OK, maybe he looked her in the eye a couple of times. But in general, he tilted his chin up and looked away from her. Do you get it? He comes off as arrogant.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

58. The pictures contradict what you said.

If you look at pictures of BO and Hillary in debates, you will see him with his head raised, not looking her in the eye. If we are really to be so unified, shouldn't he have looked her in the eye, with at least a modicum of friendliness? He did not do that. It spoke absolute volumes to me.

Go find YouTube videos of their debates, and you'll see him looking at her quite often. This is a BS issue.

And like I said, I don't think not liking Obama is necessarily racist -- I can't stand Hillary, and I'm no sexist.

But Bill Clinton and his SC comments, plus Hillary surrogates like Bob Johnson and Geraldine Ferraro did in fact play the race card against Obama, all as part of Hillary's self-proclaimed "kitchen-sink strategy."

[eridani]

90. He made her say "hardworking people, white people"? n/t

[dsomuah]

60. This is my problem with so-called Hillary "feminists"

And I use that word with sarcasm because I personally think that some of Hillary's supporters are sullying the name of past female leaders like Thatcher, Golda Meir, Sukarnoputri, Khaleda Zia, who were elected to office on their own merit, and didn't need surrogates to go around screaming "If you don't vote for my candidate, you are sexist."

It's okay to say that she "deserves it" but the unspoken implication: that he doesn't is insulting to say the least. If you want to engage in a back and forth about what qualifies him to be a candidate, fine, bring it on. I'll have that debate with you any day. But to imply that she deserves it more than he does because she is more of your stereotypical candidate for office is ridiculous.

The very thing you dislike about him, that there are people who are gaga over him who couldn't name your two state senators, is the very thing I like about him. He has engaged people who have been turned off by politics, and got them interested in politics again. Personally I don't see how that is sexist. There are some very good reasons why people have been turned off of politics in the past few years. 4 years ago I went door to door for John Kerry and harrassed friends and co-workers to vote. I got a lot of responses to the effect of "I hate Bush, but nothing about Kerry makes me motivated to vote for him, so I'm not voting." My own brother refused to vote even though I asked him repeatedly. A lot of these people are now paying attention to the political process, and that is something.

[eridani]

89. "Tom Hayden Democrats" = "MoveOn Democrats"

They are both centrists and don't much like us lefties. Hillary and Bill have actually been much more vocal about it, though. Obama outorganized both Clinton and the left. Deal with it.

[msallied]

39. Which explains the attitude of the Hillary supporters.

An attitude I find highly disturbing.

[Weevlitz]

46. Quick question Lisa...

When did Barack Obama become the ceo of the media? Their treatment of Hillary has indeed been poor...but to say that it is Obama's fault is ridiculous. He's not in charge of Air America, MSNBC, CNN, or Stephanie Miller's radio program. Yet you say the attitude starts at the top....so...I think the n/t can be thrown right back at you. It's not Barack's fault the media fell in love with him. He doesn't pay their salaries. And he doesn't write their copy.

[BornBlue]

54. What?

How has Obama given the impression that Hillary cannot be president because she is a woman? I have not seen it, outside of the "Annie Oakley" thing. Or are you upset over him calling a reporter sweetie?

Hillary on the other hand has repeatedly insulted Obama in the public eye. She has cast doubts about his religion, age, race, and experience. She was the one who "threw the sink" at him, and was quoted on the "can't stand the heat". She alone has played herself as the victim of sexism all the while using supporters to pity her.

[VotesForWomen]

35. most dem women will not vote for mccain, but seriously, the pattern of misbehavior by O supporters

does reflect on the candidate. are those the kind of people he is going to hire? will he promote policies that appeal to people who regularly use the B-word? i hope not.

[SoonerPride]

37. What are you on about?

Which supporters are those?

Official ones or internet posters?

Show me official Obama-approved supporters that have been disrespectful of women in general or Hillary in particular. There was one who called her a monster and she was let go.

Otherwise, how does the behavior of anyone else reflect on Obama? Is he now responsible for the behavior of everyone on the planet?

[Starbucks Anarchist]

41. Is Hillary responsible for her racist YouTube supporters?

You know, the lady screaming about "the inadequate BLACK man!" ?

[JTFrog]

50. BITCH! BRAV-F*CKING-O! The B-word!!! IOKIYAHB.

"it's ok if you're a hillbot"

[muryan]

85. It would be a better idea

To parse the words of some internet trolls, and pay attention to those who make level headed arguments. I'll be working for the campaign starting in two weeks up until November, and honestly some of the Obama supporters here and elsewhere do him a great disservice.

However, this is not a problem that the Obama supporters hold a monopoly over, and I think on both sides its a product of perceived and actual hostility from the other side. It's been a long hard primary on everyone, and some people just don't hold up under the stress of watching the ups and downs of their candidate.

I feel it expedient to also point out that in my dealings with the campaign to this point, most of those I've worked with were women who are very committed to womens rights. And any perception that his campaign would hire misogynists is grossly inaccurate

[susankh4]

36. Us wimmin ain't lookin for advice

on who to vote for. We can choose for ourselves. Thanks for your concern.

Just thought I'd clear that up.:smoke:

[BornBlue]

66. I am a woman

and concerned that the election will be lost because some women will vote for McCain over Obama.

If you notice, I did not say you should vote for Obama, I asked questions that I feel are legitimate in choosing a president.

[Stevepol]

43. I'd like to be given some specific examples of sexism used against HRC.

I've read this over and over and now Howard Dean has said that there are some egregious cases in the MSM of sexism, but I'm not really aware of those instances. Can somebody give me examples of this "sexism"? I honestly would like to know. I feel sure there were cases of that, but I can't point to any one thing that would qualify as sexism. Anybody help?

I personally thought that at the beginning of the campaign, the MSM favored HRC and BO over John Edwards because each of them was a dramatic and powerful story: the first woman and the first black man with a realistic shot at the White House. Edwards suffered from a kind of reverse discrimination it seemed to me.

But as far as the MSM expressing sentiments or making snide remarks, maybe I wasn't paying enough attention, but I would like to see examples. Did Chris Matthews say something?

And after a person, woman or man, decides he or she likes one candidate over the other and expresses his/her reasons for that choice, I don't conisder that sexism or any other "ism" except just personal preference-ism.

[WinkyDink]

47. I trust you don't think any of those women callers were either Democrats or DU members?

[BornBlue]

68. No on the DU members

and highly unlikely that they are true democrats. I just find it so odd that women in general can vote against their best interest out of spite. I have seen some of the same arguments here and thought that perhaps I could start a discussion that doesn't turn into a fight, silly me!

[susankh4]

82. We won't vote against our own interest.

But... our "interests" may not be quite as short sighted as yours are.

[BornBlue]

91. Did you even read what I wrote in the OP?

Or just got upset by the first sentance?

[wvbygod]

71. Then you may want to cc: it to the venue you seek

I don't see too many of the target audience here.

It does beg the question as to why punish Hillary for Obama people playing dirty and
using the race card against two very fine Democrats - Bill and Hillary.

[BornBlue]

73. I think my title is fine.

A note to woman crying sexism, and voting for McCain.

Pretty clear cut that is my target audience. So because those specific callers aren't DU members I can't post my thoughts?

[wvbygod]

74. Fine by me. Never said otherwise

It was a mere query as to copying it to a LTE as in addition to here. Sorry you got confused
as to my intentions and I hope to come across in a more erudite manner in the future.

[BornBlue]

76. Gotcha, sorry to come back so strongly.

I try not to get defensive, but sometimes it slips out, I hope you can accept my apologies.

:pals:

[wvbygod]

78. accepted if needed and no problem

The day gets better the closer to quitting time. ;o)

[BornBlue]

79. I hear ya. 5 o'clock can't come fast enough.

1 hour and 2 minutes left.

[Hamlette]

75. don't forget, he left his first wife while she was recovering from a disfiguring accident to be

with his lover (with he was already having an affair) Cindy.

I know it sounds prudish, but sheesh. As a woman I'd never vote for him. (In fact, I have more respect for Hillary for "standing by her man" odd as that sounds for a feminist like me. Not to excuse Bill, sometimes there is more to a marriage than fidelity.

[BornBlue]

77. Another horrible thing to add to his list.

This is TOO EASY!

[grace0418]

84. #2 just makes me LIVID. To think that I've been told I wasn't a feminist because

I didn't support Hillary Clinton by some of the very same women who now say they'll vote for McCain- it boggles my mind.

[TreasonousBastard]

86. One thing that bothers me is that if...

there is so much sexism hurting Hillary (and presumably racism hurting Obama)...

how the hell did these two manage to kick a bunch of middle-aged white male ass so soundly?

The answer, of course, is obvious-- sexism and racism exist, as we all know, but it is all too often the last desperate gasp of the loser to blame it on them.

The simple fact is that there can be only one winner, and there are no excuses for losing.


Oh, on edit...

Count me in as one of those who see the Hillary 2012 crowd as not standing on principle, but ready to sacrifice the country for their own narrow and pathetic interests. In that, they commit nothing less than treason.

(Not Hillary herself, btw, as it seems so far that she does not approve of this extreme idiocy, but her more deranged followers are the problem)

[papapi]

87. I'm tired of debating this. Will no longer participate in discussions of racism or sexism.

It is obvious to me who was the failure in the primary, for whatever reason. Better luck next time. I think Obama has honesty, integrity, intelligence, patriotism and a wealth of other talents that will propel him into the Presidency where he will prove to everyone willing to admit it that he is worthy of our loyalty and trust. Period.

[Tonimontana]

88. I doubt they are reading the Democratic Underground

Not friendly territory for them.