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Liberal_Stalwart71 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 08:51 AM Original message |
I blame the Obama campaign for not shooting down the Popular Vote fallacy! |
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Political Heretic (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 08:53 AM Response to Original message |
1. I don't understand this either. The popular vote clinton claim is complete and utter bullshit. |
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ingac70 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 08:53 AM Response to Original message |
2. Whether Hill has or doesn't have the "popular vote"... |
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KittyWampus (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 08:55 AM Response to Reply #2 |
5. it allows the claim -by some- Obama's win will be illegitimate. Mediawhores will not |
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Liberal_Stalwart71 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:11 AM Response to Reply #2 |
28. That's not the point, though. We do need a good number of her |
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ingac70 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:15 AM Response to Reply #28 |
29. Her "supporters"... |
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RUMMYisFROSTED (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:18 AM Response to Reply #29 |
34. Not all. |
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Liberal_Stalwart71 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:22 AM Response to Reply #29 |
39. Yes, that's true. I do believe that a lot of them will vote McCain anyway |
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leftofcool (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 08:53 AM Response to Original message |
3. But you don't need Hillary supporters to win |
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helderheid (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 08:56 AM Response to Reply #3 |
8. Where in the OP do they mention anything of the sort? |
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Lerkfish (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 08:57 AM Response to Reply #3 |
10. you hear what you want to hear. |
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leftofcool (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:00 AM Response to Reply #10 |
19. I have seen it in so many posts in this forum |
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Lerkfish (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:32 AM Response to Reply #19 |
47. I think you are extrapolating frustration at a smaller group to the larger group |
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John Q. Citizen (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:03 AM Response to Reply #3 |
21. We need Democrats to win, we just don't need you specifically, LOC. It's not all about you. |
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Liberal_Stalwart71 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:09 AM Response to Reply #3 |
25. I think I've been arguing the opposite. We DO need Hillary supporters |
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ErinBerin84 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 08:54 AM Response to Original message |
4. I was disappointed that Tom Dachle didn't debunk it on Meet the Press |
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C_U_L8R (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 08:56 AM Response to Original message |
6. The Clintons are only succeeding in embarrassing themselves |
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KittyWampus (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 08:57 AM Response to Reply #6 |
9. a lot of politics has nothing to do with reason. And after tomorrow there'll still be those |
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Ganja Ninja (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 08:56 AM Response to Original message |
7. Why not put the blame where it really lies? |
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KittyWampus (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 08:57 AM Response to Reply #7 |
11. Because it's the Obama campaign's JOB to counter damaging talking points. |
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Liberal_Stalwart71 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:25 AM Response to Reply #11 |
40. THANK YOU! It is the Obama camp's responsibility to address the issue... |
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Liberal_Stalwart71 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:17 AM Response to Reply #7 |
33. Scalia told us to "get over it"; therefore it doesn't matter what we do |
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shraby (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 08:58 AM Response to Original message |
12. If he said one word about her claim, she would |
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KittyWampus (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 08:59 AM Response to Reply #12 |
17. He and his surrogates could simply say the words "caucus states". |
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helderheid (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:48 AM Response to Reply #12 |
53. I actually heard him address it in a speech - I'll see if I can't find the quote. |
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Peacetrain (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 08:58 AM Response to Original message |
13. I think this is part of the letting go process |
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ElsewheresDaughter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 08:58 AM Response to Original message |
14. because Obama CAN"T "shoot it down"....it is TRUTH |
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Thrill (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:00 AM Response to Reply #14 |
18. YAWN. You have to not count caucus state voters for it to be true |
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Yotun (346 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:02 AM Response to Reply #18 |
20. NO DAMN IT. IT doesn't matter who you include or don't include! Even if it were true it doesn't |
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Yotun (346 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:03 AM Response to Reply #14 |
22. Care to defend the popular vote as a legitimiate metric then?Or are you talking without understandin |
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helderheid (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:04 AM Response to Reply #14 |
23. Every second blue moon if you count all MI and not any caucus states. |
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Yotun (346 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:16 AM Response to Reply #23 |
31. Nooooo. Don't legitimize the argument. Even if she was winning the pop. vote fairly, it would still |
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Liberal_Stalwart71 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:37 AM Response to Reply #31 |
49. You're right. I know you're right and everyone here, except The Enablers |
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MattBaggins (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:29 AM Response to Reply #14 |
43. It's true only if you disenfrachise 45% of MI |
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Liberal_Stalwart71 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:31 AM Response to Reply #14 |
46. I'm being serious with you here because I think something is very wrong with you... |
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rucky (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 08:58 AM Response to Original message |
15. That's the DNC's job. |
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BklnDem75 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 10:05 AM Response to Reply #15 |
56. This needs to be repeated |
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Liberal_Stalwart71 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 10:16 AM Response to Reply #56 |
62. You're wrong. The DNC doesn't have the authority to speak for the campaign. |
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rucky (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 11:15 AM Response to Reply #62 |
68. You've got it backwards. The campaigns don't have the authority to speak for the party. |
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Liberal_Stalwart71 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 12:01 PM Response to Reply #68 |
69. I didn't say that. I said that the DNC can't speak for the campaigns and vice versa |
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Yotun (346 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 08:59 AM Response to Original message |
16. Exactly!!! And the media are legitimizing the argument! |
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TexasObserver (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:05 AM Response to Original message |
24. I agree. They have let her get away with twisting the numbers and lying about them. |
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ORDem (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:45 AM Response to Reply #24 |
51. It's fundamentally worse than twisting the numbers. There is no popular vote in a primary, period. |
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Liberal_Stalwart71 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 10:21 AM Response to Reply #51 |
65. Early voting, name recognition and the CA Establishment helped Hillary in CA! |
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Liberal_Stalwart71 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 10:18 AM Response to Reply #24 |
63. "I suspect they didn't want to give that meme any validity... |
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TexasObserver (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 10:21 AM Response to Reply #63 |
64. I agree. You slap down ANY falsehood the other side promotes. |
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stray cat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:10 AM Response to Original message |
26. Ignoring the sideline issue and concentrating on the GE |
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beezlebum (927 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:11 AM Response to Original message |
27. it's frustrating, but what's most frustrating |
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Aloha Spirit (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:15 AM Response to Original message |
30. You're "very angry"? Are you also angry that Obama isn't campaigning in Montana or South Dakota? |
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Inuca (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:22 AM Response to Reply #30 |
38. Well... actually he IS campaigning in MT & SD |
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Liberal_Stalwart71 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:41 AM Response to Reply #30 |
50. What does your stupidity have to do with my argument? |
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frickaline (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:17 AM Response to Original message |
32. It would send a bad message to voters if Obama spoke out on this |
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Yotun (346 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:26 AM Response to Reply #32 |
42. He would sent a bad message by saying the truth? How far have we fallen? |
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frickaline (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 10:09 AM Response to Reply #42 |
58. It would have been spun back on him is what I'm saying |
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Inuca (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:19 AM Response to Original message |
35. Here are a few reasons, in no particular order |
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dsomuah (262 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:21 AM Response to Original message |
36. Why should they?? It's not like the lie helps her. |
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FlaGranny (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:21 AM Response to Original message |
37. Well, you don't think for a single moment, |
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NoFederales (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:25 AM Response to Original message |
41. It's not a "bone" I'd give her, but then I don't waste resources on runts on the farm either. nt |
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lojasmo (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:30 AM Response to Original message |
44. He shouldn't dignify it. |
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Tippy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:30 AM Response to Original message |
45. Some of Hillary supporters will not come on board. |
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4themind (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:36 AM Response to Original message |
48. I think you make a good argument,, but please consider this |
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Liberal_Stalwart71 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:47 AM Response to Original message |
52. She's trying to convince the superdelegates with this argument, but she's |
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iiibbb (658 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:51 AM Response to Original message |
54. He hasn't because he gain's only negatives |
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Liberal_Stalwart71 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 10:10 AM Response to Reply #54 |
60. He himself doesn't have to do it; he could rely on his surrogates to do it. |
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polichick (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 09:53 AM Response to Original message |
55. They're probably doing what they think is necessary to win gracefully... |
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gal (534 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 10:06 AM Response to Original message |
57. I agree it needs to be handled. |
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krawhitham (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 10:09 AM Response to Original message |
59. Only thing holding him back is fear |
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Liberal_Stalwart71 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 10:12 AM Response to Reply #59 |
61. Then he needs to hang up any hopes of winning the GE |
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jespwrs (112 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 10:42 AM Response to Original message |
66. I totally understand |
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hokies4ever (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Mon Jun-02-08 10:43 AM Response to Original message |
67. The supers will decide, and Obama is talking to the supers |
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