To All You Self Defeating Purists On Gay Issues

[ruggerson]

My partner and I have been together 8 years (slightly longer than Britney Spears last legal commitment) but we currently do not have the same basic civil protections that married couples enjoy, either in our home state or on the federal level.

We both are, however, keenly aware that it's not John Kerry's fault we do not have these protections under the law. And neither of us expects John Kerry to fall on his sword over this or any other single hot button issue.

Let's remember what the cold hard facts are concerning the gay rights movement.

It's the Republicans who introduced the Defense Of Marriage Act in congress in 1996, not John Kerry.

It's the Republicans who would not permit Ronald Reagan to even address the issue of AIDS for nearly four years, not John Kerry.

It's the Republicans who went ballistic when Clinton tried to lift the ban on gays in the military and then codified an anti gay ban into the military code. Not John Kerry.

It's the Republicans who routinely and regularly lie and foment ill will towards gays and lesbians, not John Kerry.

It's the "base" of the Republican party, through its thoroughly dishonest and ugly surrogates Tom Delay, Rick Santorum, Gary Bauer, Alan Keyes, Pat Robertson, Jerry Falwell, Mitt Romney et al, who ceaselessly seek to defame and demonize an entire population of American citizens. Not John Kerry.

It's the Republicans who have, with great deliberation of forethought, polling and zeal, turned gay marriage into a wedge issue.

NOT JOHN KERRY.

Any civil rights movement takes years, generations to evolve and succeed. No one politician can achieve those ends, indeed, a movement is composed of millions, tens of millions of people yearning for their moment of full equality and participation and citizenship. That day will inevitably arrive in America for gays and lesbians, despite the medieval best efforts of the Republicans to keep that day at bay. John Kerry understands this full well and has been, and will continue to be, both an ally in that movement and a forceful leader in the fight for full equality and liberty.

You should remember that in in 1996, when he had no political advantage to gain by doing so, Kerry was one of only 14 members of the Senate who voted against the warped and ill named "Defense of Marriage Act"

He said, at the time, that DOMA was "fundamentally unconstitutional," "fundamentally ugly" and that he would not tolerate nor participate in what he termed legislative "gay bashing".

In other words, when the chips were down, he stood up for what was right. And did so with great conviction and eloquence.

In the end, it really comes down to this: who do you want in the oval office submitting names to the Senate for ratification for the next few vacancies on the Supreme Court?

I will vote for John Kerry proudly and with great enthusiasm. I hope and trust you will join me.


Ruggers

[JohnKleeb]

1. well said, Kerry has lots of great stances other than this as well btw

BTW I have something to add to your Kerry and Gays dossier, Kerry was one of the first Washington politicans to take a stand for gay rights, I dont have the info but I can get it. Kerry was also the only incumbent to vote against DOMA I heard as well.

[DaveinMD]

2. Don't forget about Marilyn Musgrave

Let's defeat her this november.

www.stan2004.com

[JohnKleeb]

3. thanks for mentioning this

who else is cosponsoring this anyhow?

[DaveinMD]

5. I don't know

who all the co-sponsors were. I do know that Musgrave wrote the amendment and that Stan Matsunaka is a great candidate.

[JohnKleeb]

6. Well I got little money being a student in HS

but I wish the best of luck to the Matsunaka campaign.

[DaveinMD]

7. that's okay

tell everyone you know. This is important. Again, www.stan2004.com

[JohnKleeb]

14. thanks

will do.

[tedoll78]

4. A-frickin-men!

I harbor no fantasies of gay policy idealism as some around here seem to do. It's a hot issue with potential to sear our candidate badly; I can't blame him for trying to have it both ways.

I also smartly recognize that Kerry would be selecting US Supreme Court justices, should he be fortunate enough to win. And given that a Constitutional amendment is unlikely, I predict that there'll be a challenge to a state's DOMA - and that it will eventually end-up before the US Supreme Court. That's where being politically pragmatic/realistic will pay-off: those Supreme Court justices will most likely come-through for us. I think it's the smartest way to play the political hand we (gays) have been dealt.

With apolgies to Roald Dahl, I refuse to be a political Veruca Salt. I do indeed 'want the world' as far as equality goes, but I'm not going to act foolishly in my quest to obtain that goal. Smarts and patience will surely win the day; brash, thoughtless actions will get us sent to the political juicing room.

[freetobegay]

8. Me & my partner just celebrated our 11th last month

& neither one of us have a problem voting for Kerry.

[Red_Viking]

9. Terrific post--welcome!

Very eloquent yourself. You voiced the very core of the issue--a segment of the American people are denied their rights. I am vehemently opposed to any legislation writing discrimination into our Constitution. How dare they even consider it?

Although not gay myself, I have plenty of friends who are, and they are dearly loved along with all my buddies. I'd never tolerate anyone speaking poorly of any of my friends, no matter their flavor. In fact, my gay friends tend to be better, harder working citizens than my straight friends. Go figure!

My family recently dropped a bundle with the Human Rights Campaign and we proudly display our bumper stickers, tee shirts, and necklaces. I know they've been less than kind to Margaret Cho and other controversial celebrities, but it was the best way for me to show my support.

GLBT folks are in the same boat philosophically as women. I like to use this quote about feminism, although it could apply to any equal rights movement: "Feminism is the radical notion that WOMEN are PEOPLE."

BTW, don't you think Rick Santorum is a total closet case? Come on out, sister. You know you want to. :P

Keep fighting the good fight--rock on!

:dem:

RV

[JI7]

10. John Kerry will be progressive on gay rights

as president he will have the power to set the agenda. to speak of acceptance. to change the mood of the country through the power of the presidency. this will help in moving the direction of the country towards acceptance of more gay rights including marriage.

kerry has many gay friends and has attended many same sex marriages. i truly believe based on his YEARS long record and other things he said that he does support same sex marriage but he also understands how the country is right now. as president he will be able to help in moving towards support for same sex marriage.

he has already said he supports giving all rights of married couples to gay couples in civil unions. once he can get this done , the movement can change in supporting marriage. remember, rights are usually gained by steps. not all at once. and it's not just about laws, but changing hearts and minds. do it so no future candidate for president will dare run on an anti gay platform such as supporting an amendment to discriminate against gays.

[w13rd0]

11. I live in Missouri...

...and less than a week after bigotry was officially added to our Constitution, my brother had his wedding just last night. My father and his wife, along with my mother, and her partner of 25 years, "gave away" my brother. Proud parents sitting in the front row, along with the brides parents, a multiracial family. I don't think my brothers heterosexual marriage will be any the worse for having such a diverse background of support. And out of that entire front row, only my fathers wife still voices support for Bush, all the rest will vote for Kerry. My father is "sitting this one out". Even my brother, who I argued with last year over the Iraq war, who was a staunch Bush supporter, has seen the error of his misplaced loyalty, and is now 100% behind Kerry/Edwards. My mother and her partner have waited 25 years, from back in the 70s when they fought for their jobs against blatant discrimination. We all know what's at stake this election. We can't afford another 4 years of backward movement.

[DaveinMD]

12. was your father

a Republican? or are we losing his vote.

[w13rd0]

13. He's been a Republican since he re-married...

...myself and my brother have convinced him that a "true conservative" can not, in good faith, vote for Bush, so he's sitting it out. He can't bring himself to vote Kerry. I figure it's a fair compromise ;)

[DaveinMD]

15. ok

that's on the plus side. Great job. Luckily, there are no Republicans in my family. My wife was on the local central committee. Both our parents are very liberal.

[w13rd0]

16. My mothers partner...

...surprisingly, is actually quite conservative. After 9/11, I was visiting with them, and she asked, "So what do you think of Bush now?" I replied, "He was an idiot on the 10th of September, and just because the US got smacked when he had his pants down doesn't make him less of an idiot." She's since come to the conclusion that she's no longer comfortable with him, since he's pushed most moderate Republicans out of the GOP or into submission. She was actually tougher than my dad.

The area they now live in has always trended Republican, but that's changed in the last couple months. I'm sending my Uncle a bunch of Kerry/Edwards gear because it's apparently "going like hotcakes" (he lives in rural Missouri). It was actually a blast being at the get together, all kinds of broken and shattered stereotypes. And the only ones that were still pro-Bush were oddly silent and subdued by the end of the evening.

I still don't know how MO voted for Prop2 by such overwhelming numbers. My mother did an informal survey, asking who voted, then of course we asked who voted in favor of Prop2, and no one fessed up to it, and most vociferously denounced it. Maybe the pro-Prop2 Missourians just like keeping their bigotry in the closet, alongside the spot they have reserved for where they think homosexuals should be...

[JI7]

18. some republicans and conservatives just wont vote for Kerry no matter what

so i always say that if they wont vote for kerry, to at least try to convince them to not vote for bush . this would especially help in swing states where bush can lose votes that would usually go republican and in turn help kerry.

[Cronus Protagonist]

17. But what about the Gay Agenda?

http://cronus.com/agenda

[dpbrown]

19. Thanks for posting this - it'll be better under Kerry than Bush

The key is having someone in the White House who might respond when you put his feet to the fire.

You can't get someone who's always going to use the rhetoric you want. But if you have someone with whom you might be able to build a coalition or work with or leverage (even better if we get a Democratic Congress), then we're talking progress.

There will only be an accelerated slide backward, with Clarence Thomas as Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, if Bush ever gets legitimately elected.

Dan Brown
Saint Paul, Minnesota

[JohnKleeb]

20. I think we can get a democratic congress really

I may be wrong here but senators tend to do better at getting their bills passed than governors and what nots do, LBJ was great at it Ive heard.

[Kanary]

21. Now *there's* a warm and fuzzy subject line that just

begs for a rational discussion.

:crazy:

[Rowdyboy]

22. 15 years with my partner....I'll proudly vote for Kerry because he offers

the only chance to save the federal court system. A re-elected Bush would stack both the Supreme Court and the Appeals courts so terribly that progressive legislation would be set back 100 years.

A re-elected Bush is your worst nightmare. Suck it up and take a hit for democracy...

[merh]

23. Welcome to DU and thank you for a wonderful post.

Thank you for giving this issue a perspective that is honest and practical. :toast:

[Behind the Aegis]

24. YEA!! Some great thoughts!!

I have responded to some other "gay" threads where our brothers and sisters (and allies) are feeling betrayed by recent events. As I have said there, will we do better under Kerry or Bush? The clear answer is Kerry! To me, it is as simple as...under Kerry, we COULD do better; under Shrub, we WILL do WORSE! When you know one path will lead you off the cliff and another is "uncertain," do you chose the one that will certainly lead to your undoing?

Kerry has a great record on GLBT issues and an awesome wife, to boot! Bush...well, I don't think I really have to finish this statement!!

As a community (GLBT), we need to come together like the Democrats. We have a common enemy...united we stand, divided we HANG!

Brightest Blessings!

[newyawker99]

26. Hi Behind the Ageis!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[Waverley_Hills_Hiker]

25. I;ll vote for him, but not because of gay issues.

He said, at the time, that DOMA was "fundamentally unconstitutional," "fundamentally ugly" and that he would not tolerate nor participate in what he termed legislative "gay bashing".

Id like to know if you have a source for that. Those are strong words.

[Uzybone]

27. Here is a source

http://www.bostonphoenix.com/medialog/2004/02/homework-help-for-john-kerry.asp

(snip) The senator himself was more emphatic on September 5, 1996, when he told the Boston Herald, "This bill is election-year pandering of the worst order, and I will not be a party to legislative gay-bashing."

[JohnKleeb]

28. thanks it appears he did say that

[ruggerson]

29. Here ya go:

http://www.bostonphoenix.com/medialog/2004/02/homework-help-for-john-kerry.asp

[Cha]

30. Welcome to du!

I liked your thread starter.

I had my own issues with Kerry but as Dean says..my differences with Kerry/Edwards are small compared to my differences with bush.

[ProfLefty]

31. Nicely stated.

Some very salient points made Ruggers and I must say that I ultimately do agree with you. I would add however that this is very much a civil rights issue perhaps one of the more important, controversial and potentially divisive of our present time. And therefore because it is such a "hot" political issue it constitutes in my opinion an excellent yardstick by which to measure the political courage shown by our current crop of politicians. Hopefully those in whom we place our faith and trust will all measure up and act to ensure equality of rights under the law for all Americans.