Stay Positive:

[mdguss]

I rightly hear many complaints about the below-the-belt ads released by a bunch of bitter people. But they're coming off as liars (none of them were on the boat with Kerry), and the Bush campaign is looking bad for not condemning the ad.

Answering reckless charges with more reckless charges doesn't really do anything politically. It ads to the cynicism about politics (which is what threatens our system). People will think there all a bunch of cooky liars.

We live in a time where we need a unified country. Say you're for John Kerry because you're for health care for all; asking the wealthy to pay their fair share; a long-term solution for the Iraqi problem; for fighting a better and more effective war on terror; for protecting the environment, etc.

It does nobody any good to go around accusing Bush of being AWOL. It's not going to be proven in the space of the campaign, and such reckless charges only lend credence to the negative ads of the Bush camp.

Say what you're for, not what you're against. If you say what you're for, people will listen. If you say what you're against people zone out--every time.

[msmcghee]

1. Wise advice.

We are the good guys here. We need to remember that.

[Robbien]

2. We've spent the last two or so years accusing Bush

You are right, there is nothing more we can say negative about him and have it get through. The only road to take now is the positive one.

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

3. They wanted a pit fight...

Then they should get a pit fight. Trouble is, the only effective closing technique in this pit fight will be the truth.

[msmcghee]

4. Remember what Harry Truman said when . .

. . a supporter told him to give 'em (the Republicans) hell.

"I just tell the truth about them - and they think it's hell".

[ClassWarrior]

5. Amen. Kerry & Edwards need to stay positive - we need to go for the throat

We need to be the attack dogs. Even the DNC is starting to see the value in this approach, with Howard Dean and with this bunch:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x2153660

[Tom Kitten]

6. Be positive

yet call them on their lies and attacks, after all they are not positive at all! Just fear and division is what they're after.

[ibegurpard]

22. Fine. I'm willing to do my part.

Just don't undercut my efforts (if you are a politician).

[Guaranteed]

7. I'm for not killing innocent people

and leaving ourselves open to terrorist attacks by invading countries that haven't done anything to us!

I'm also for maintaining our good name and standing in the world, again, by not invading countries that haven't done anything to us!

How does that sound? :)

[NEDem]

8. I absolutely agree

That doesn't mean we shouldn't challenge the false accusations, but we shouldn't be in the business of leveling them.

Don't forget, F911 will be out on DVD in a few weeks. There are still a lot of people who haven't seen it. No 30 second ad can do what the movie will accomplish. Let Moore get down in the mud, keep Kerry and Edwards clean.

[KharmaTrain]

9. Their Shoot Their Wad...It Won't Be Much Longer

Remember, BushCo. has to spend 70 million dollars before their convention before Federal matching funds kick in. Kerry can only spend Federal funds now...and my bets are the RNC money is spreading around wide and thick.

These bastards got into power through lies, deception and intimidation and think that they can do it again. We didn't think rational humans could lower themselves to such lows, and they kept going lower. But many of us woke up and resolved to fight back.

Some of these intrepid few started DU (I got here shortly thereafter...and read for quite awhile before I dared to post) and a universe of blogs and websites. It gave a lot of us strength and a way to network. It's making a difference as it's helped energize millions and present a positive alternative to the evil regime in power.

I suspect soon the GOOP will start to exhaust itself. It's been on either attack or defensive mode all year and have gone into hyperdrive on several occasions. It's gotta take a toll, even on a troll!

This Swiftboat garbage is a desperation move to try to slime Kerry's record to try to salvage the military vote that has been slipping away...and a cynical attempt to shut down other 527s, like MoveOn...who are doing great work to bring down this regime.

In '92, I expected Poppy Bush to fight to the bitter end. After the Convention debacle and the debates, the GOOP just burned out. They had no kick left for the final month. Toward the end the knives within the GOOP began to come out...leading to Gingrich's coup...and you know the rest.

Right now, we've got a great tide of momentum building on our side and things look even better in the next month or so. Yes, stay very, very positive and optimistic. Stay the high road with the sane and laugh off the freepers.

It's a great feeling to see all this starting to come together. I've been waiting for this for at least 20 years, if not longer!

[flaminbats]

10. Why?

I prefer to explain why the tax and spend, Lincoln Bedroom, 9/11, special interests Republicans with no exit strategy have left our nation in shambles. Then I ask "is it Christian for Republicans to advocate healthcare and employment discrimination against those who have medical problems in the free market?" I ask "was it wise to begin a war in Iraq without an exit strategy, which flip-flop Powell warned against?" I ask "why fight in Iraq but give up on bin Laden?" Then I ask why the same Republicans who promised to balance the budget and save Medicare, decided spend away the surplus and destroy Medicare.

From there I move to my positive points and John Kerry's agenda. If the voters are undecided, they usually continue the dialogue..if not, I know they are hardcore Repukes after making my first points.

[depakid]

11. Someone needs to inform the people about the Republicans

and their policies. Otherwise, no one will know just how egregious that they are and how they will effect ordinary people. The media sure isn't going to do it- so that leaves it up to the campaigns, the 527's or maybe some of the interest groups, which are unfortunately underfunded.

It makes no sense whatsoever to give the Republicans a pass. If no one holds them accountible, they're free to lie and lie and lie- both about who and what they are, but also about who kerry is and what he stands for.

[flaminbats]

12. Most Bush voters, especially down south, think Democrats control Congress

this leaves a few Republicans and most Democrats who know or even care about the truth. The main swing voters left in the south are those who still think Democrats control Congress. These people..who often don't have a High School diploma, don't read the paper, know who is President and Governor, might know who is Vice President and Lt. Governor, but usually never know their Congressman or Senators!

Knowing the partisan affiliation of the President or Governor means these people are highly educated for voters, and are probably partisan as well. But voters often don't know or care if Bush or Clinton is a Democrat or Republican, and such voters may just vote for or against the incumbents. What such voters know about the political parties often comes from their friends, family, workplace, church, or from talkradio.

In summary, when I encounter someone who says they vote, 1\2 times they do not. If they know that Congress is Republican, usually they don't need to be convinced to support Kerry! And if someone still thinks Congress is controlled by Democrats, re-educating them is usually an uphill battle! Even if they believe me, and learn something...they end the conversation by saying, "But I'm still voting for Bush."

I agree negativity only goes so far, but it can be very useful when someone begins parroting that unending, freepish cow shit!

[Cronus Protagonist]

13. FUCK BUSH!

No one saw that because they all zone out? You have to be kidding me.

Attacks on a nasty, criminal, lying thieving pretender are not negative - they're positive. They're calls for change, revolution in a way - an expression of sure and certain patriotism.

In any case, they get the most media. Some people might "zone out" but if you don't get your message on the tube at all, it doesn't matter how principled it is, people won't even get the chance to zone out on it.

Controversy is a media magnet.

[ljm2002]

14. "Reckless charges"

Accusing Bush of being AWOL is not a reckless charge. Especially when compared to what the Republicans indulge in.

I do hear what you're saying. Certainly our guy has to campaign on positive issues. But I don't agree at all that the rest of us should pull in the claws. Not at all. My credo when dealing with bullies and thugs is this: "Don't start sh*t, and don't take sh*t." Which translates in the current situation to the following: don't ever take the first potshot. But never, ever let their potshots go unanswered. Hit 'em back and hit 'em hard.

Just my $.02.

[mdguss]

15. It is reckless

Yes it is reckless, that kind of shit turns people off of the process and reduces turnout numbers. High turnout is essential for Democrats--always has been, and always will be.

Negative ads only "work" because they reduce turnout and allow the least supported candidate to close the gap. You shouldn't, ever, fight fire with fire. You fight fire with some nice cold water (facts).

Saying Bush is AWOL is a reckless charge that would only legitimize the swift-boat ads. His records are there, he was honorably discharged from the National Guard, why go down that road.

Raking Bush over the coals might give some sensation of personal satisfaction, but it does nothing to actually improve the chances of getting Kerry elected. A negative ad fest will turn off moderates in Ohio and West Virginia that might be thinking about Kerry, but aren't especially thrilled with the level of political discourse.

When somebody is challenging an incumbent, they have to say what they'd do differently. Inherit in that is saying what you're for. Stick to that, and Kerry might win. Get into a pissing contest with Bush, and enough people will be turned off that Bush will get re-elected.

[ibegurpard]

24. Here are the facts:

the people behind the swift boat ads, O'Neill in particular, have Republican operative ties dating back to the Nixon administration. This is not being pointed out and it should be. It's not necessary to question Bush's "military record" to discredit these people and they NEED to be discredited.

[flaminbats]

25. But that is what we are doing!

Negative ads only "work" because they reduce turnout and allow the least supported candidate to close the gap. You shouldn't, ever, fight fire with fire. You fight fire with some nice cold water (facts).

I fight fire with cold water (facts). But often a Republican or even some DINO will spring out of wonderland and ask "Why are you being sooo damn negative?"

Harry Truman said it best..."I never give them hell. I just tell the truth and they think it's hell." :headbang:

[obnoxiousdrunk]

16. I agree with you

"An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind."--- Gandhi

[DaveinMD]

17. I agree

to stay away from the Bush Awol stuff. But we should not be afraid to run a comparative campaign, because there are major differences between the candidates on the issues.

[unfrigginreal]

18. Naive

If reckless charges carried no weight than why do the Repugs control all 3 branches of the government? Every charge must be countered.

[Democat]

19. Negative attacks don't work, that's why the Republicans control everything

Great point!

Staying positive hasn't worked this far, why would it start working now?

[DaveinMD]

20. its not a matter

of staying positive. They need to respond and then pick the right things to criticize. There are enough current mistakes that we don't need to go back more than 30 years.

[ibegurpard]

21. Yeah that worked great for Max Cleland, Jimmy Carter, Al Gore...

... and the list goes on. No one is saying that the charges have to be answered with equally unsubstantiated rumor but the means to discredit the people behind the "swift-boat" ads is readily available and it's being ignored in favor of "taking the high road" and letting Republicans like John McCain come to the rescue.

[DaveinMD]

23. no one came

to the defense of Cleland. I see Kerry responding in a real way. They have dispatched his real crewmates. Republicans are taking a beating for this.

[PhuLoi]

26. Staying above the fray did not work in 2000 or in 2002.

The public at large detests wimps. Take the fight to their houses. Make them have to explain all their mistakes repeatedly. Get up in their faces and don't back off. Call them the criminals that they are but have the cites in your back pocket. No more pink tutus.