Who Barack Obama should NOT pick for vice president

[mystieus]

America's hottest new game is who Barack Obama should pick to be his running mate in November. With apologies to Hillary Clinton (who likely isn't going to get the nomination) and John McCain (picks likely to be boring, almost Dan Quayle like), the focus is on Obama.

And there are many places to turn to speculate on who Obama will choose. Hillary Clinton, John Edwards, Bill Richardson, Joe Biden, and Kathleen Sebelius are among many good quality candidates.

But this is the Democratic Party, where good choices don't often get made. So Sen. Obama, while many people are giving you good advice on who to pick, I will give you advice on who not to pick.

-- Joe Lieberman. The temptation that Al Gore faced in 2000 led to Lieberman. At the time, I thought it was the worst pick of any VP candidate in the modern era. And this is back when Democrats still liked Lieberman. But Lieberman represents a defensive position. Do not pick a VP candidate because of a negative.

-- Sam Nunn. Nunn is respected on many levels, and his experience is tempting to have on the ticket. But Nunn is a bad choice simply because he is conservative, one of Lieberman's pitfalls. A conservative choice for VP is bad for several reasons: it doesn't energize the base, and if something happens to you, that person becomes president.

-- Chuck Hagel. Hagel or Ron Paul would be tempting on many levels, and in a different society, an odd choice could work. But they are still Republicans. If you want to incorporate Hagel into your administration, take that shot. But not as VP.

-- Jim Webb. In many circles, Webb is a popular choice to be on the list of those to pick. But he's too conservative, too off-the-cuff, and has been in the Senate even less than Obama. Democrats love the idea of picking off people just as they finally get to the big-time. It's like picking fruit before it reaches its true ripeness. We don't need green bananas for vice president.

-- Michael Bloomberg. Tempting choice, well respected, and gives an independent vibe. True Bloomberg was a Democrat until 2001 when he ran as a Republican, and he is now an Independent. But there is so much that we don't know about Bloomberg's politics. Would be good to draw independents, but doesn't energize the base, and it's difficult to pick someone who John McCain could also pick.

-- Geographic balance. The tradition of picking someone for geographic balance has almost become passe. Dick Cheney, John Edwards, Joe Lieberman, Jack Kemp, and Al Gore weren't picked for geographic balance. And you shouldn't go that route either. You end up with odd matchups such as JFK/LBJ and Michael Dukakis/Lloyd Bentsen.

-- Political expedience. Names such as Ted Strickland (Governor -- Ohio) and Tim Kaine (Governor -- Virginia) have been bandied about as possible candidates. No offense to either of them, but pick a VP based on who they are, not what short-term experience can be provided. If they fit other criteria, then they do offer an advantage. But don't pick them for that reason.

-- Someone who is uninspiring. Your VP pick should be a proven leader, ready to lead at a moment's notice. But it should also be someone with upbeat charisma, obviously not as much as you, but still someone who can be considered a leader. Tom Daschle and Richard Gephardt would, on many levels, fit your criteria. But they aren't inspiring. Daschle and Gephardt were at the top of the Senate and House, respectively, yet they are reminders that their leadership was ineffective. For all the criticism of Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid, they got a lot of things done to get the House and Senate back for the Democrats. And it's sad since Daschle and Gephardt would do an excellent job. It hurts to put Gephardt on this list. I like Gephardt, and thought he would have made a great president. William Kristol brought up his name on FOX on Sunday, but that isn't the reason. And it's not because Rupert Murdoch's New York Post told us Kerry would pick Gephardt in 2004. Gephardt should be a part of your administration, officially or unofficially, but not as vice president.

http://www.buzzflash.com/articles/election08/175

[DemVet]

1. Your comment about....

a trait for the Veep, "not what short-term experience can be provided," was very interesting.

[Yael]

2. No Strickland, No Clinton, No Rendell

I like Richardson for the role, personally.

[AllentownJake]

5. I'd take Clinton

over Rendell....at least she controls what she says 90% of the time.

[Yael]

6. Can't you just picture him now?

Yammering about whatever thoughtless meme falls out of his mouth -- again on the national stage, but this time for 6 months?

I shudder to even think.

[AllentownJake]

9. The quicker he leaves the Govenor's Mansion

and goes back to commenting on Eagles games full time the better off this state will be.

Can you imagine him as a VP candidate still insisting on going to Philly every Sunday night to do his Eagles game broadcast.

[PoliticalAmazon]

50. "Want to go for a swim, Obama? Here's an anvil to help you."...

quoted from another DU poster.

[NewJeffCT]

10. just curious - what's wrong with Strickland?

I'm not really following Ohio at all, but didn't he win handily in 2006?

[Yael]

23. His mindless bobble-heading behind HRC when she was on her

bullshit "Shame on you" tirade.

Showed him to be the clueless politico that he is.

I would prefer one with a little more experience and a spine.

[mystieus]

43. Every time someones says Ted Strickland this pic of him standing behind Hilliary pops into my mind

[Auntie Bush]

24. I'd personally like Wes Clark for that role

but he's a loyal Clinton supporter. Maybe Clinton would give him her blessings because she wants Dems to win and Wes would give him foreign policy experience and a lot of Rethugs and Indies like Wes.

[Yael]

25. Clark would be another good one.

[mystieus]

55. As a Hillary surrogate Wesley Clark said some pretty harsh things about our nominee

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4962668

[NewJeffCT]

27. I think Clark would be a good choice, too

Colin McEnroe on WTIC-AM 1080 in Hartford, CT thought Clark might get it... because of his support for Clinton, he might help bring some of her backers along. McEnroe is a liberal afternoon radio personality.

[dhill926]

34. that's what I'm thinking....n/t

[NightWatcher]

3. I'd pick Tim Kaine in a pool, if we had one going.

I've seen him out on the stump for Obama a few times, and he seems jazzed

[OmahaBlueDog]

11. Kaine is my pick too

Also, I disagree with the OP (who wrote a very good post) on Webb. He's an ex-Sec Navy -- it's not like he just got elected to the Senate after a career in Amway sales. I think the biggest, fairest knock on Webb is that he's an ex-Reagan Republican.

Webb received the Navy Cross for actions on July 10, 1969. The citation read:

“ The Navy Cross is presented to James H. Webb, Jr., First Lieutenant, U.S. Marine Corps, for extraordinary heroism while serving as a Platoon Commander with Company D, First Battalion, Fifth Marines, First Marine Division (Reinforced), Fleet Marine Force, in connection with combat operations against the enemy in the Republic of Vietnam. On 10 July 1969, while participating in a company-sized search and destroy operation deep in hostile territory, First Lieutenant Webb's platoon discovered a well-camouflaged bunker complex that appeared to be unoccupied. Deploying his men into defensive positions, First Lieutenant Webb was advancing to the first bunker when three enemy soldiers armed with hand grenades jumped out. Reacting instantly, he grabbed the closest man and, brandishing his .45 caliber pistol at the others, apprehended all three of the soldiers. Accompanied by one of his men, he then approached the second bunker and called for the enemy to surrender. When the hostile soldiers failed to answer him and threw a grenade that detonated dangerously close to him, First Lieutenant Webb detonated a claymore mine in the bunker aperture, accounting for two enemy casualties and disclosing the entrance to a tunnel. Despite the smoke and debris from the explosion and the possibility of enemy soldiers hiding in the tunnel, he then conducted a thorough search that yielded several items of equipment and numerous documents containing valuable intelligence data. Continuing the assault, he approached a third bunker and was preparing to fire into it when the enemy threw another grenade. Observing the grenade land dangerously close to his companion, First Lieutenant Webb simultaneously fired his weapon at the enemy, pushed the Marine away from the grenade, and shielded him from the explosion with his own body. Although sustaining painful fragmentation wounds from the explosion, he managed to throw a grenade into the aperture and completely destroy the remaining bunker. By his courage, aggressive leadership, and selfless devotion to duty, First Lieutenant Webb upheld the highest traditions of the Marine Corps and of the United States Naval Service.<6>

(source: Wikipedia)

Webb attended Georgetown Law School from 1972 to 1975, graduating with a law degree. While at Georgetown, Webb wrote his first book, Micronesia and U.S. Pacific Strategy.<8>

From 1977 to 1981, Webb worked on the staff of the House Committee on Veterans Affairs. During this time, he also represented veterans pro-bono. Webb also taught at the Naval Academy and was criticized for a 1979 article published in the Washingtonian titled "Women Can't Fight" <9> (see "Senate Election" below).

During the Reagan Administration, Webb served as the nation's first Assistant Secretary of Defense for Reserve Affairs from 1984 to 1987. During his time as Assistant Secretary, Webb sought to reorganize the Marine Corps. He was gravely concerned with the disarray the Marines had fallen into post-Vietnam: drug use, racial infighting, and low morale within the Corps left him with the impression it was no longer America's premier fighting force. The Marine Corps was also rocked by two scandals during this time: the Clayton Lonetree espionage affair, where Lonetree became the first Marine convicted of espionage, and Marine Lt. Colonel Oliver North's central role in the Iran-Contra affair.

In 1987, he served as Secretary of the Navy, becoming the first Naval Academy graduate to serve in the military before serving as the civilian head of the Navy. As Navy Secretary, Webb pushed the appointment of Alfred M. Gray, Jr. as Commandant of the Marine Corps, hoping that Gray could reshape the Corps into the elite unit it once was.<10> Webb resigned in 1988 after refusing to agree to reduce the size of the Navy. Webb had wished to increase the Navy to 600 ships. As revealed in The Reagan Diaries, Reagan wrote on February 22, 1988: "I don't think Navy was sorry to see him go."

After his resignation, Webb earned his living primarily as an author and filmmaker. He won an Emmy Award for his 1983 PBS coverage of the U.S. Marines in Beirut.

Among Webb's awards for community service and professional excellence are the Department of Defense Distinguished Public Service Medal, the Medal of Honor Society's Patriot Award, the American Legion National Commander's Public Service Award, the Veterans of Foreign Wars Media Service Award, the Marine Corps League's Military Order of the Iron Mike Award, the John H. Russell Leadership Award, and the Robert L. Denig Distinguished Service Award

On March 30, 2003, Webb wrote an opinion piece for the New York Times.<11> While he erred in believing that the Iraqi leadership had learned lessons from the first Gulf War that would enable them to stop U.S. troops from taking Baghdad, subsequent events proved correct his conclusion that a protracted guerrilla conflict would be a likely outcome of an American invasion of Iraq.

During the 2004 presidential campaign, Webb wrote an op-ed piece for USA Today in which he, as a military veteran, evaluated the candidacies of John Kerry and George W. Bush. He criticized Kerry for the nature of his opposition to the Vietnam War in the 1970s while affiliated with the Vietnam Veterans Against the War, and accused Bush of using his father's connections to avoid service in Vietnam. Webb also wrote that Bush had "committed the greatest strategic blunder in modern memory" with the 2003 invasion of Iraq.<12>

Webb endorsed incumbent Democrat Charles Robb for reelection to his Senate seat, over Webb's former Naval Academy classmate and fellow Marine Oliver North, in 1994.<13> Webb subsequently endorsed Republican George Allen over Robb in 2000,<14> and then ran against Allen himself in 2006.

(source: Wikipedia)

[AllentownJake]

4. No Rendell

That's all I care about.

NO FAST EDDIE!!!

[TexasObserver]

7. No Strickland, No Clinton, No Rendell

No Clintonistas or other Republicans

[mystieus]

37. Seriously

[SayitAintSo]

8. NO CHUCK HAGEL n/t

[OmahaBlueDog]

14. It won't be Hagel

and McCain won't pick Hillary or Traitor Joe.

[NewJeffCT]

15. I know, he's far right on everything except Iraq

pro life, pro big business, anti-environment...

[NewJeffCT]

12. Please don't pick a Republican

or any sort of independent.

I think I could live with most Democrats.

[mystieus]

41. Seriously

[crimsonblue]

13. How about John Kerry?

Surely the swiftboating can't work two elections in a row.... :yoiks:

[OmahaBlueDog]

17. I thought about that

Doesn't Kerry still have a fair war chest from the last election? And he has a good internet organization. However (and this isn't intended to be snarky), if we're going to beat down Hillary on the IWR vote, won't we have to level the same criticism at Kerry?

[karynnj]

48. There are several huge differences

1) Kerry spoke against the invasion before and after it happened - HRC didn't. This makes the arguement that it was for leverage in the diplomacy far more believable.

2) Kerry was one of the sponsors of Kerry/Feingold - which HRC called "cut and run", until after Nob 2006 when she moved very close to it. Kerry/Feingold, in a lesser way, is Obama's "IWR".

3) Kerry has said that the vote was wrong and he profoundly regrets it.

As to VP, Kerry is unlikely because he is running for Senate and MA does not allow both. I think if he accepted the slot it would create a mess in MA as it might be too late for any viable candidate to run for his seat - actually running the risk of losing it.

Kerry might be better either as a Senator with lots of seniority or as Secretary of State, a position that he seems made for - especially if it has responsibility for BALI type conferences.

[Bensthename]

22. I'd love it..

He is strong on all catagories..

[Genevieve]

16. Wesley Clark,

I think?

[mystieus]

42. He's a BIG Hillary supporter

[Cha]

18. hilary, hilary hilary...

hilary, hilary, hilary. No hilary.

[RBInMaine]

19. Gotta think big picture with this. Obama, like it or not, needs help with blue collar whites, so

it should be Webb (who also is from purple VA and has great military credentials) or Strickland who would help carry the critical state of OH and unite the party since he was so pro-Clinton. These are the top two people they considering. Facts are facts. He needs someone to balance the ticket from a "red" or "purple" state, helps with whites and males, and has experiences he doesn't, i.e.
military/foreign policy or Governor. At the moment, I think Strickland is the top contender with Webb a close second. They'll also take a good hard look at Wesley Clark.

[XemaSab]

51. As far as geographic balance goes

I see Obama as having four choices: a Northwesterner, a Southwesterner, a Midwesterner, or a Southerner.

These choices may (or may not) work out as follows:

*solidify Oregon and Washington, and make them spend money in Montana and maybe Alaska.

*solidify New Mexico, Colorado, and Nevada, and maybe make them spend money in Texas.

*solidify Minnesota, Wisconsin, and Michigan, maybe pull in Iowa and Missouri, help fight for Ohio, and make them spend money in the plains states and Indiana.

*maybe solidify Florida, maybe pull in Virginia, North Carolina, Georgia, and Louisiana, and make them spend money in Texas and all the other southern states.

Tempting options... Hispanics, Southern Whites, Prairie Populists, Western Libertarians.... all low-hanging fruit.

[hokies4ever]

20. No Rendell - race baggage

No, I'm not saying that because he's white. But we don't need his soundbite about conservative whites not ready to vote for a black man as President played on a loop in the media.

[Bensthename]

29. Ugh, I can not look at that vile man again..

Every time I see him on TV I cringe. He seems so devious.

[hokies4ever]

30. I also hated how he praised Farrakhan in that youtube clip from the 90s

and sat idly by while Hillary forced Obama to reject and denounce him.

[AllentownJake]

31. He is

The man was a good mayor and a mediocre govenor. We call him Fast Eddie out here for a reason...we also call him Spitzy because if you talk to him in person you will need an umbrella.

The best thing he ever did was get someone to hit the Jimmy Johnson in the head with an ice ball.

On the plus side you'd never have to worry about a sex scandal...stealing Hoagies on the other hand might be a problem.

[AZBlue]

21. HILLARY CLINTON

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, NO.

[merbex]

26. If he picks a Republican, you'll see enough Democrats revolt that he

and his supporters will not be able to rationalize any possible defeat on Hillary Clinton..... that's for sure

[merbex]

28. Additionally , if he picked Joe Lieberman.... you'd see many Dems stay home

on Nov 4

[JPZenger]

32. I only disagree on one point - inspiring

I think Obama offers enough inspiration to cover the whole ticket. I agree with all of your comments except the need for the VP to be inspiring. The VP can be a grey haired person who provides gravitas. The most important quality is national security and foreign policy experience.

All things considered, Richardson is my choice. He's from a swing region of the country, he's got foreign policy and administrative experience, and he's a lifelong Democrat (vs. a recent convert). The Latino dimension certainly helps.

[Lady-Damai]

33. NO CLINTON!!!!!!!!!!!! n/t

[mystieus]

40. Agreed.

[Imagevision]

35. Hillary would be Obama's 90's old school politics he spoke of...

[WA98296]

36. I LOVE EDWARDS....And, PLEASE, PLEASE don't pick a republican or DINO.

[TexasObserver]

38. No Clinton, No Lieberman, No Nunn, No Hagel, No Bloomberg

[AlinPA]

39. Brian Schweitzer from MT would strengthen the ticket. nt

[Ken Burch]

44. Good points all...but, since Lieberman has endorsed and is campaigning for McCain,

he probably isn't on the short list. Or the long one, for that matter.

I wonder if it might be possible to consider a running mate who isn't actually in office right now?

Jim Hightower would be good.

He'd put Texas at least somewhat in play and help with Obama's "working class white" problem without pandering to the racial ugliness the other Democratic campaign has traded on. Hightower could hit all the red meat points about class that Obama is seen(falsely)as avoiding.

[mystieus]

46. Has he?

[Ken Burch]

53. Yeah. It's been all over the net. Just google "Lieberman McCain"

or something like that.

Actually happened in December...Here's a linkeroonie:

http://marcambinder.theatlantic.com/archives/2007/12/lieberman_to_endorse_mccain.php

The weird thing is, before HolyWarJoe did that, he was still going to be seated as a superdelegate at our convention...even though the man isn't actually sitting in the Senate AS a Democrat.

[mystieus]

54. He has no shame..

[Clark2008]

45. Well, I don't think he should pick John Edwards

That wouldn't help him among people who know his real record... like my family.

[XemaSab]

47. I'll go one further: he shouldn't pick a senator

As president, he'll need all the senators he can get.

I've heard DiFi and Boxer thrown around, and I think they'd both be poor choices, partly due to what may be percieved as pandering, but partly because we NEED both of them to represent California. I shudder to think who Arnold would appoint...

[Bake]

49. I agree completely! No Senators!!

Leave 'em where they are, where they are needed.

And no Bill Richardson.

Bake

[taught_me_patience]

52. Richardson

He delivers nothing.
He is not photogenic (horrible toupe).
Horrible debator.
Didn't get more than about 3% of any primary.
Doesn't energize working class voters.
Looks sleazy with the beard.

[newmajority]

56. In the following order, he should NOT pick.....

1) Hillary.

2) Any Republican.

3) A Senator

4) A DLC tool such as Rendell or Strickland. (Repentant/ex DLC'ers like Richardson or Edwards are OK)

5) Agree with the OP on the Daschle/Gephardt types. I've forgiven Daschle for losing 2002, I may never forgive Gephardt for his part in what was done to Howard Dean. :mad: