I checked Hillary's *old* speeches - she consistently uses "hard working" to mean "working class"

[highplainsdem]

Oh, God, what a mess...

But it looks to me now as though the words she uses to avoid saying "working class" created much of the misunderstanding that has people so upset with her.

I'd been wondering how she could have said anything like that bizarre comment that's gotten so much attention. She isn't racist, and I don't believe she's trying to appeal to racists, and I didn't believe for one instant that she was really trying to suggest whites work harder than anyone else.

So I checked old speeches of hers, after looking at a transcript with the "uh" and "um" stuttering added...and noticing someone in the topic where I found that transcript

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x5894397

asking if she had at least referred to "working class" rather than "hard working" (which would have changed the meaning) and being upset that she hadn't.

But she HAD referred to the working class, but not in those exact words. She thought she'd said "working class" because she'd used the words "hard working" which she uses again and again to mean "working class" in her speeches, while she completely avoids using the words "working class."

At least that's the pattern in the old speeches I checked. I'd never noticed it before, but it IS an odd use of language, and IF people had been aware she does that, there wouldn't have been quite as much of an uproar over what she said.

A Google search showed she refers to "hard working Americans" a lot in her speeches. But I didn't find the words "working class" in a direct quote from her on any of the pages I checked that way.

So I went to her website and started going through her speeches doing keyword searches.

http://www.hillaryclinton.com/news/speech/

And I haven't seen her use the term "working class" in any of the ones I've checked so far. I haven't checked all of them -- it's late, and I'm tired -- but I checked the economic speeches, a speech to the AFL-CIO, and several of the others, searching for the word "working" to see if I could find ANY use of the term "working class."

And I couldn't. She seems to go out of her way to avoid it. Possibly she thinks it sounds worse than some alternatives.

When she wants to refer to working class families, she'll say "working families" or "hard working families."

In her speeches, that is. I wouldn't be surprised if she'll refer to "working class voters" when discussing voting blocs with her advisers. ESPECIALLY if she's talking about some news story or poll results where the term "working class" was used. But she seems to try to avoid using it when speaking in public.

So I think what happened, in that diastrous, stammered remark, was that she started to say "working class" as she talked about that AP story and what it said about working class voters. And then she caught herself and switched to "hard working." I think she made that "hard working Americans" just because she's used those words together so often in her speeches (the words "hard working Americans" and "hard working American families" turned up again and again in the Google results). And then, realizing she'd forgotten to include the detail that the AP story had been about white working-class voters, she added, "White Americans."

With absolutely no idea how terrible that sounded because she THOUGHT she'd just said "working class Americans, white Americans."

Now, look at this quote -- from that DU topic I posted the link for above -- and remember Hillary uses "working" and "hard working" to mean "working class":

"Well Kathy you know there was just an AP article posted uh that found how Senator Obama's uh support among um working, uh hard working Americans, uh White Americans, is um weakening again, uh and how, uh the you know Whites in both states who had not completed college were supporting me, and in, in Independents um I was running even with him, and and doing even better with Democratic-leaning Independents. I have a much broader base to build a winning coalition on."

And realize that with her pattern of speech, that odd substitution of "hardworking" for "working class," she really was saying, "Well, Kathy, you know, there was just an AP article posted, uh, that found how Senator Obama's, uh, support among, um, working, uh, working class Americans, uh white Americans, is, um, weakening again."

Now, some examples from her old speeches of how she uses both "hardworking" and "working" where she means "working class" (emphasis added):

This is from her January 11 speech on her economic stimulus plan:

"Now I have laid out a long term strategy about how we’re going to stabilize and grow the economy. I want to get back to where we see millions of new, good jobs created in America. I know we can do that. But I don’t think we can wait until January 20th of next year. Too many people will be hurt. Too many jobs will be lost. Too many homes will be foreclosed on. Too many more people will go without health care. We cannot wait. That is why I am calling on the president and the congress to work together to come up with some quick action to be able to present the slide toward recession. Unlike President Bush’s 2001 plan which focused on tax cuts in the wealthiest of Americans, my plan focus on middle class and hardworking families who deserve the relief and need the help right now."


From her January 24 speech on the economy:

"But now, finally, the President may acknowledge what the American people have known for years: that the economy is not working for middle class and working families."

"I also would include direct tax rebates to working and middle class families."

"But it isn't right that the wealthy and the well-connected have gotten so many more benefits than the middle class and working people have."


Unless you think she's suggesting that middle class people and families don't work, it should be very clear that she simply uses "working" and "hard working" to mean "working class."

And this tripped her up, with horrendous results, the other day. And led to people wondering why she'd suggest white Americans were hard working, implying others aren't. When all she'd been doing was referring, in her own rather peculiar way, to white working-class voters, citing an AP story referring to that group of voters.

Now. IF this makes sense to you -- if you can see that this was just her standard speech pattern and the words she uses for "working class" -- how do we go about getting this information out and at least starting to correct a horrible misunderstanding?

[Diane R]

1. 'Hard working' isn't the problem. Repeated use of 'white' is the problem.

[highplainsdem]

6. People have complained about the words "hard working." Here and elsewhere.

And the use of the word "white" is a reference to a voter demographic cited in an AP story.

Do you think Obama and his advisers never refer to that sort of thing when discussing how he's doing in terms of voter demographics?

[Kahuna]

25. The questioner didn't bring up the AP article. Hillary did. HIllary also

chose to interpret it's findings. If it were true that Obama couldn't get white voters or that her demographic was greater than hers, she would be the presumptive nominee instead of him.

[cliffordu]

2. What about all that white???

[FrenchieCat]

3. It's the White that appears to be a pattern.....you know, the color thing

her and her campaign keep referring to?

[Bright Eyes]

4. It's the "White" part that's the problem.

[SeattleGirl]

5. Inserting "white" into that meme is what bothers me.

I have no problem with "hard-working Americans", but I do have a problem with her saying "hard-working white Americans."

[highplainsdem]

8. Please remember she's referring to an AP story that brought that up.

And not for "racist" reasons -- only as a voter demographic.

[mrbluto]

33. That's not going to stop this posse.

They're hunting for something and they're gonna find it.

If it wasn't this it would have been something else.

[highplainsdem]

44. Looks that way. Don't bother them with the facts...

But hey, I had to try, because I can't stand seeing this much irrationality among my fellow Dems.

[IsItJustMe]

55. Irrationality hell, she is the one that said it, and you are the one who is trying to excuse it.

That to me Sir is the epitomy of irrational.

[highplainsdem]

59. I'm trying to clarify a misunderstanding.

She was using the substitution of "hard working" for "working class" that, as another DUer pointed out, other politicians including Al Gore use. She was not being racist. She was not suggesting that whites work harder than non-whites. She was referring to an AP story about voter demographics.

[KaptBunnyPants]

66. She's not being racist?

She is arguing that the person who lost the primary should be nominated because they won the only important demographic - white people. If you want to excuse the verbal gaffe she made implying that black people are not hard working as an accident, fine. She may very well have not meant it, I don't know what she's thinking. But what about the substance of what she's saying, that as the white person nominee she should be the made candidate instead? In what world is that acceptable?

[bluetrain]

7. Obama's rabid supporters have no interest in reality.

[harun]

60. Do you think it is good she uses "hard working" instead of "working class"?

Have you given any thought as to the reason she does this?

[dansolo]

62. She is trying to avoid looking like she is a populist

The DLC hacks have repeatedly faulted populism as the cause of the past few electoral defeats. So they face a dilemma. How can they appeal to working class voters, without actually using the words "working class". "Hard working" was very likely a phrase that polled well, and it has the added advantage of the inherent "us vs. them" dynamic against those who the listener may deem as not hard working, i.e. lazy, and feeds into certain stereotypes.

[harun]

63. I think you are right on. DLC is overtly ANTI-POPULIST. Which

I am not pro-populist, but I prefer Dem politicians at least be populist neutral, not anti-populist.

[casus belli]

9. The bottom line of it is this...

without parsing, without drawing any alternate meaning from her own words other than what she has said - she is still saying that he's having a hard time getting white people to vote for him. Not only is it not true, but it's deplorable that she would be appealing to super-delegates and voters to vote on race-based issues. What she is saying is: "I can win the white vote, and he can't." That, my friend, is unacceptable any way you choose to spin it. And when you couple it with her willingness to capitalize on the Reverend Wright fiasco and other incidents, it speaks to a troubling pattern.

[99th_Monkey]

11. How does one "recommend" a post UNDER a thread? If I knew, I'd be using it in response to your post

you spelled this our beautifully. what you said.

[Kahuna]

26. Yeah. That's what I want to know. What you said about what he/she said. nt

[redqueen]

32. Succinctly put. I don't understand why that's hard to figure out. (nt)

[highplainsdem]

61. No, the AP story said that, in the paragraph on voter demographics.

You can argue with what the AP said was shown by its exit polls and the exit polls of TV networks if you wish.

It is not at all unusual in this country, or any other, for running mates and party nominees to be selected based on how much they appeal to various voter groups. Which is why it's no more "racist" to point out when a candidate is getting more of the white vote than it is to mention when they're getting more of the African-American vote.

For what it's worth, I don't think the voter demographic that the AP story cited, Obama getting fewer working class white votes, is as much about race as it is about perceptions of elitism. Whether or not Obama and his supporters insist that he isn't elitist, the fact remains that he comes across that way to many working-class whites.

I'm wondering, too, whether -- at the start of his campaign, when he was getting a smaller percentage of the AA vote -- he was getting fewer working-class black voters. Has his support in the AA community always been even across the economic and educational spectrum, or did he pick up more working-class black support later? I'm guessing, based on some newspaper articles I vaguely remember, that it was the latter.

So it's overly simplistic is say that his not appealing as much to working-class white voters is simply because they're racist.

As for the elitism of his supporters...

A lot of people were outraged when Paul Begala said the Dems "can't win with egg heads and African-Americans."

But in her response objecting to that, Donna Brazile referred to those white working-class voters as "Joe Six Pack" and "Jane Six Pack." There's a LOT of condescension in that terminology -- I hope you don't think they feel flattered by labels like that -- and many Obama supporters seem completely tone-deaf to that.

We are not going to win in November without a coalition that includes not just Obama's current supporters but most of Hillary's current supporters. And this was the point Hillary was making. I'm sure she'd have been including black working-class voters too, since so many of those used to support her and her husband, if Obama did not have such a lock on the black vote at this point. If those voters were still among her supporters and the AP story had referred to them, she'd have referred to them.

Yes, her statement was clumsy, and it was unfortunately made worse because most people (including myself, till last night) didn't realize she always uses "hard working" to mean "working class."

But it was not a racist statement.

[The_Casual_Observer]

10. So what? Working class isn't hard working?

[highplainsdem]

13. ??????????

Of course working class people work hard.

But a lot of the people complaining about that quote have taken "hard working" to mean just that, and NOT working class. If you'd read my message more closely, you'd have noticed I mentioned that one of the people upset about her comment here had specifically asked someone posting a quote whether she'd referred to "working class" voters, since that would have changed the meaning. That DUer (hnmnf) swore when told she hadn't.

And I've seen a lot of complaints elsewhere that Hillary must think whites work harder than anyone else. When that was NOT what she was saying, as I'm trying to explain. She was using the words "hard working" to replace the words "working class." As her old speeches show.

[FrenchieCat]

12. Handy guide showing that Hillary's lying anyways.....

Relationship of State White Population Won by Obama and Percentage Won By

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=5884830&mesg_id=5884830

[highplainsdem]

14. Again, Hillary was citing an AP story, as she said.

[FrenchieCat]

17. Seems like she'd have accurate information then......

I would think she'd have someone on staff to do that kind of thing, before going before the world and making such a statement about how White People vote; those that work so hard.

[highplainsdem]

21. Here's that AP story.

And you can drop the snide suggestion that she was implying white people work harder than others. What part of my OP explaining that "working hard" is the wording she uses for "working class" didn't you understand?

This is a link to an AP story that I'm guessing is the one she meant:

http://www.tampabay.com/news/politics/national/article492190.ece

And this is that particular paragraph:

But exit polls for the Associated Press and TV networks showed Obama continuing to do poorly among some key voter groups, particularly working-class white voters. Of 28 states that have held primaries where she and Obama competed before Tuesday, Clinton won working-class white voters in 25 of them, and Tuesday she won two-thirds of whites in both North Carolina and Indiana.

If you want to argue with the exit polling by the AP and TV networks, go ahead. But this shows Hillary wasn't lying in what she said about the AP story.

[FrenchieCat]

23. I don't rely on AP to provide information

on voting patterns of an opponent, unless the story bolster what I want to convey.

Bottomline is that the entire narrative is a fraud, and a whole lot of what has happened with that vote has much to do with Hillary and her media than anything else.

They always wanted for Barack to be seen as the Black Candidate; hence the media obsession with Pastorbating for weeks on end. They did her bidding.

Her statement in the USA Today article, was just more of that.

She's not slick......at all, although she may think so.

[Arrowhead2k1]

15. The word 'white' is what jumped out.

Your post is a phail. That is all.

[highplainsdem]

24. So the context and actual meaning of what she said doesn't matter?

Interesting.

[SoCalDem]

16. Hmmm, maybe she'll say she "mis-spoke"...Amazing how the Obama

campaign has NOT been THRASHING her with her own words..a la the "bitter" Mis-speak... odd that, eh??

saying bitter instead of anger, or clinging instead of liking or using or whatever ..well let's see.. It that as bad as mentioning WHITE...as in NOT BLACK LIKE OBAMA'S LAZY WORKERS?? or BLACK, like that guy who cannot wiN??

The Clintons deserve every entry .. it's probably higher now..

[Arrowhead2k1]

18. They absolutely don't need to waste precious time attacking her at this point.

She is DONE!

[FrenchieCat]

19. Oh......Obama got trashed alright for his mispeak?

Did you forget? I think it was about a week's or two worth of media press rage, like right before a vote. Remember?

[SoCalDem]

20. My comment was sarcastic.. are you "sarcasting" me back??

:rofl:

it's late & my brain is tired :)

[FrenchieCat]

22. It's late....

I'm tired!

I'm going nite-nite! :hi:

[bluetrain]

27. kick

[Apollo11]

28. "Hard-working families" was also used by Al Gore and Tony Blair

It is poll-tested language to overcome the fact that most folks don't like to think of themselves as "working class".

Most Working Class people these days prefer to call themselves Middle Class. It's about self-image.

However, folks are proud to say they work hard. So politicians have tried to make use of that.

[redqueen]

34. That is so damn sad.

:(

[ecstatic]

29. She has a history of twisting the words of others. Karma's a

bitch!

[scheming daemons]

30. She tied the words "hard-working" to "white"... implying that non-whites are NOT hard-working....

..that's the racist codespeak.

[redqueen]

35. Not in my opinion. Not at all.

I wasn't offended by this alleged implication that other Americans aren't as hard working.

She was citing statistics, so speaking of one particular type of demographic really can't be logically interpreted as somehow negating that the similar demographics (hard-working / working-class minorities) don't exist... only that they don't support or bolster her argument, so they don't need to be cited.

[highplainsdem]

37. Try reading the OP before you reply.

It's clear, once you look at her speeches and see that she uses the words "hard working" to substitute for "working class" -- which someone else here just pointed out that Al Gore and Tony Blair and other politicians do -- that she was merely talking about the white working-class voters mentioned in the AP article.

[Butch350]

31. Hard Working Americans, White Americans

What wrong with that? We all know that

Black Americans
Chinese American
Mexican American, etc...

Are shiftless lazy people. Thank God we got one group of Hard Working people or this
world would go to shit.

[JVS]

36. hard working=working class is not so insulting hard working= working class= white voters is terrible

[highplainsdem]

41. That was NOT what she was saying.

It was a clumsily assembled sentence, but it was pretty clear she was simply referring to the voter demographics in the AP story.

But this was one time when the use of the words "hard working" to mean "working class," combine with her adding "white" because she was clarifying what the AP story said, created a sentence that was too easily misunderstood.

I wish to God that someone in her campaign, or Hillary herself, had pointed out that she was simply using wording that means "working class" in many political speeches.

Most people here didn't think Obama should have been raked over the coals for the "bitter" remark, that it was misunderstood and blown all out of proportion.

This remark of Hillary's was, too.

[JVS]

42. It might not be what she meant, but it IS what she said.

She stumbled when she spoke that line. Maybe it was because she was nervous. Maybe she was nervous because she knew she was engaging in race-baiting.

[Emit]

38. "...among working, hard-working Americans, white Americans..."

That's the quote

[NoFederales]

39. A lot of words appropo of apologetic nothings--the race baiting furor

is about her plainly phrased "white" with everything else. It was loaded race pandering, she knew it, and for the code-blinded apologists, I am tired of the interference running and distractions that enable the Clintons to believe they are wearing clothes. The bare, naked lady, Clinton, laid it all out so publicly. Put some clothes on her, lipstick ain't cuttin' it, and if she continues to insist on streaking about, then by goddamned at least do it to the tune of Ray Steven's old hit "The Streak".

"Yeah, I did............"

NoFederales

[SoonerPride]

40. She needs to apologize for her "misspeaking." Period.

blatantly racial dog whistle politics has no place in the Democratic party.

[highplainsdem]

48. She needs to clarify it, but it was NOT racist.

[SoonerPride]

51. um, sorry, it was BLATANTLY RACIST.

Anytime you mention race you are on a minefield.

And saying "white people support me and not him" she stepped on a shell and blew herself up.

That, my friend, is racist language.

[midnight]

43. I think if we are worried we should be worried about not working.

How's the job growth where you live. Are your children able to feed themselves or do they come home to eat, sleep, live? How many family's share a home. Those are the lucky one's. I was in the grocery store yesterday. The special announcement was that store management wanted the shopper to know that if you would sign over their tax check they would add more money to it making it more valuable. So if you had a 300.00 check, the store would give you a 350.00 food card. The shopper could earn 50.00 dollars for giving the money to the store. That is not the part that concerns me. The part that concerns me is this was in the suburbs of middle class America that is being shredded by this war and bad banking practices. Not long ago, people would be buying a trip somewhere or something a bit more extravagant, but now wisely putting it into feeding the family is a smart move.

[jeffrey_X]

45. So white collar, middle class americans don't work hard?

eom

[highplainsdem]

47. Please read reply #28, from Apollo11, which explains

that Hillary's terminology is standard political terminology, typically used to try to avoid offending anyone who might be offended by the words "working class." It certainly is NOT meant to imply that middle class people don't work hard.

It's obvious from this mess that it isn't the best terminology.

But it is used by other politicans, including Al Gore, and Hillary's been using it consistently, judging by her speeches. And it didn't cause her ANY problems until this fiasco where, as she attempted to explain what the AP story said, she added the clarification that it was referring to white working class voters. And didn't realize how that would sound because she is so completely used to using "hard working" to mean "working class."

[Apollo11]

52. Hillary has been told not to say "white working-class voters"

A lot of working-class folks like to think of themselves as middle-class. And gradually "working class" has come to have a stigma attached to it, so that people don't like it when a politician labels them as being working class.

So Hillary had to come up with a whole explanation about white voters who work hard but did not go to college, which is pretty much the demographic definition of "white working-class".

[stillcool]

46. Hillary and Bill Clinton..

are consummate politicians who choose their words wisely, and for effect. "Hard working white blue collar workers" are apparently the voters that "matter", and the reason why she is more electable than Senator Obama. "Working Class White Blue Collar Workers" doesn't sound any better to me.

[ShortnFiery]

49. Don't forget "SPADE WORK"?!?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8oRwZQLdhEw

[MadBadger]

50. That was me who had the issue

White was the problem, but hard-working just pisses me off. I dont generally like working class, but hard-working is even worse, making it seem like nobody else works hard and thats bullshit.

[highplainsdem]

53. Someone else pointed out here that Al Gore and other liberal politicians

use the same wording.

I agree it isn't the best -- and that couldn't be more obvious now, after this fiasco -- but it is used, it's meant as a polite way of referring to the working class, and it was NOT meant to offend or imply any of the things it's been read as implying.

I can't stand the "Joe Six-Pack" alternative a lot of pundits use. Didn't Donna Brazile use that recently?

[redqueen]

58. Why won't you address post 9? (nt)

[ShortnFiery]

54. According to Randall Robinson, former Clinton Aide

Adherence to the rule of law is not something normally associated with the Clintons. Moreover, racial and ethnic disrespect, intimidation, exploitation and hate have always been a fundamental Clinton tactic and the reflexive use the "N"-word and other racial and ethnic slurs, an essential element in the Clinton lexicon. When the "first black president" and his wife ran Arkansas, the NAACP sued them for intimidating black voters at the polls.

Conversely, the Clintons' refinement of the DNC drag and drop is, arguably, one of the more insidious and repugnant applications of their special brand of race-hate politics.

Calculating a black man's worth to be 5/3 of a vote is no less racist, and arguably more so, than calculating his worth to be 3/5 of a white man; the latter is demeaning, but the former is dehumanizing.

But it is even worse.

Listen to Randall Robinson in this video. Only one conclusion is possible: A Clinton legacy of lynching.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8oRwZQLdhEw

Also peruse this interview text with Randall Robinson:

http://www.unctv.org/bif/transcripts/2001/bif1719.html

I think largely missing the point. I think we talk a great deal about racial profiling, as if that were the forest; it's the tree. It's what's happening to a whole generation of young black males: that's the forest. And I suspect in part that we talk more about racial profiling, driving while black and that sort of thing, because that is still an issue that affects all blacks. But what affects the PeeWees is this absence of opportunity, this legacy of slavery, this prison industrial complex. And this failure to understand that we're still all in this together. What happened after the civil rights movement, people like myself and yourself who were prime to go to college and we came from families that were intact, parents that were loving and encouraging, models for our behavior. And so all we needed was the ceiling removed a bit and we did well.

But most of us were bottom-stuck, homes broken, fathers not there, intergenerationally riddled with pathologies. Those people remained and I think that we, since the civil rights movement, have argued less tenaciously in their interest than we have in our own. And our relationship to President Clinton is a good example of that. For some curious, arcane, difficult to understand reason, black communities had a great affection for Bill Clinton and with the exception of the things he has done for certain blacks, he's done nothing for the mainstream black community. He added more federal prisons to the prison rolls than Bush and Clinton put together. Built more prisons than either of them, destroyed the Caribbean economies, did as much to Africa. Welfare reform pushed people into poverty. He was terrible for black people. But he bought us with gestures.

[ampad]

56. You didn't work this hard to spin

When Rev. Wright's words were taken completely out of context or when Obama's bitter comment was turned around, did you? She didn't use racist words or race baited - as far as I know. :shrug: Also if this is so what is taking Hillary so long to clarify? It is because she said what she meant and it is backfiring on her as it should. The fact that some of you are working so hard to spin it is a testament to that but it does not matter anyway. She has lost this fight.

[ieoeja]

57. That makes sense and does sound better.

So her (white) statement was only (white) race baiting, not outright (white) racist.

That is certainly better (white) than implying (white) that Black (not white) Americans (white) are not hardworking (white).

I (white) can forgive (divine AND white) her (white) that then.

[quiet.american]

64. You know what -- she started this with her disingenuous reading of Obama's remarks (see: bitter).

She made the bed, now she must lie in it. And what she said, even if given every benefit of the doubt, was pretty stinky.

[BleedingHeartPatriot]

65. I equate it with Sen. Obama's "typical white person" statement. Poorly worded, nothing more.

[DemGa]

67. The Obamas known damn well the Clintons are not racist

-- that the charges are false. And they also know full-well the benefits derived from this smear campaign - a tactic Team Obama clearly felt they HAD to take. Simply dreadful - the lowest of all politics. But it comes with a risk of alienation.

I'll guess we'll see how that gamble pays off.

[chill_wind]

69. Obama is not responsible for her choice of words.

And I'm not even sure he's commented on them. This is a media fury and a voters' issue to contemplate.

She spoke them. Let her clarify them for herself. She's in the word business, after all, and she certainly wasn't above exploiting Obama's "bitter" references. She wrung them dry.

[gbrenna]

68. She use white

No matter how she described these voters-hardworking etc...they were white voters she was talking about. It is offensive.