I am waiting from Hillary herself to concede. Is that too much to ask on a place called DU?

[Neshanic]

You wanted a fighter. You got one. I wanted someone who will get in the face of republicans. There she is. That's why I still support her, and until she says the words "I am OUT!" I will still support her.

Until a presumptive is announce by Skinner, I will support her. When the presumptive is announced, I will support him. The key word here WHEN.

So you can go off on all type of attack posts about Hillary. I will not give up until the Presumptive is announced. Then I will gladly step in line.

Continue flaming on Hillary fighting for what she believes in and what I believe in.

[SoonerPride]

1. Tilting at windmills isn't fighting

It's insanity.

[Xipe Totec]

26. You need to read the whole novel, not just the cliff notes

You clearly don't understand the character of Don Quixote.

[Starbucks Anarchist]

2. No, we wanted a fighter who always fought, not when it was convenient.

[Cant trust em]

10. that pretty much sums it up.

[BlooInBloo]

3. The whining for Obama's side to unilaterally stop fighting for Obama is the stupidest thing EVER.

[dogday]

6. Or vice versa until that magic number is reached, no matter

who is ahead.. You know rules and all, they are big in our Party....

[BlooInBloo]

11. I've repeatedly been outspoken on not asking Clinton to quit.

[dogday]

14. Good for you... I don't support either, but do support

the Democrats... The race will continue and I believe Obama has the advantage at this point...

[niyad]

12. oh whaaaaaaa, the obama side screams and hollers and almost literally

foams at the mouth whenever anything the least bit negative is said about THEIR candidate.

can't stand the heat? or the truth about your oh-so-noble chosen one? I think a lot of people are going to be in for a very big surprise when they find out that their idol is human, just like everyone else.

pace

[BlooInBloo]

17. Um, what are you talking about?

[dogday]

19. I heard the term October Surprise last night mentioned...

I would not put it past the Republicans to have that bomb ready...

[cyndensco]

54. If there was an October surprise,

don't you think the Clintons would have played it by now? I doubt republicans have any more access to dirt than the Clintons (and I'm not suggesting they're one in the same. The Clintons are just powerful).

No, HRC's October is now - if she had it, she would play it along with the rest of the kitchen sink.

[dogday]

59. Excuse me, I am talking about Republicans and their slime

machine.. Remember them? They are the enemy, and they are the ones with this information, not Clinton... Better start looking toward the bigger picture of the GE, cause that is the prize...

Republicans have the money, and media, and the resources to expose an October Surprise... Just ask John Kerry......

[Growler]

43. I hate Defcon 2

nt

[niyad]

4. apparently it is. it is sad that a place that used to be my island of sanity in a very

red world has turned into a place where I have to check and make sure I didn't get switched over to the Site That Shall Not Be Named.

how CAN you be so reasonable?

[rucky]

5. No arguement here, but may I ask why?

[blm]

7. She NEVER GOT IN BushInc's face and wouldn't even BACK UP those who did from 2001-2007.

Peddle this Hillary is a fighter meme to those who will buy ANY LIE if it gets repeated enough.

[PoliticalAmazon]

45. Very true. How do we know she isn't now STILL serving the best interests of the neocons? n/t

[WeDidIt]

8. That's the standard Skinner himself sets

if you read that sticky thread up there.

One concedes or one reaches the delegates needed.

[Arrowhead2k1]

9. Get in the face of Republicans?

More like 'take' the face of Republicans!

[Mass]

13. She can concede whenever she wants. But the longer she waits, the clearer it will

be that what is important to her is herself and nobody else. She cannot win and a hurtful primary continuing is only going to help McCain. While she attacks Obama and he needs to defend himself, Dean is the only person going after McCain.

[Symarip]

15. You keep commending Hillary for being a fighter

Who the fuck do you think she's fighting? Obama? The Democratic Party? US?!

Furthermore, when we needed her to fight against the establishment (see IWR vote for further detail) she sat on her ass and was either too stupid to do her homework or too worried about her political career to stand up and do what's right.

Fuck that. I'm not going anywhere.

[Neshanic]

20. I am not arguing with Obama supporters any more over their issues.

This is my candidate. Skinner has notmade the announcement. She has not quit.

When Skinner says stop, this is the DU Presumptive I will stop and jump in your line.

I am not debating any longer with Obama supporters over their talking points.

[emilyg]

25. Amen.

[scheming daemons]

16. By all means, STAY IN Hillary.... keep destroying the "Clinton Brand" so we NEVER...

..have to deal with it again.

Take down the DLC too, while you're at it. Much appreciated.



She's become a self-parody. Hope she keeps it up. Every minute she stays in makes Obama look MORE Presidential in comparison.

[Pawel K]

18. Using your own standards Bush is a fighter, doesn't mean that's a good thing

there is a time when you have to cut your loses and leave. If you refuse to you are hurting yourself and everyone around you.

She lost, she needs to move on for the good of the country. If she refuses to drop out in the next week or 2 I think even you would agree that her motives will be crystal clear, if they aren't already.

[TBF]

21. She voted for fighting in Iraq, and she wants to "obliterate" Iran. That is not the kind of fighter

we had in mind.

[zulchzulu]

22. I certainly am waiting for Hillary Clinton to concede as well

She can do it now gracefully and we can all move on and take down McCain or she can continue to make a fool of herself and destroy her reputation as well as her husband's.

It's her choice.

[Rob Gregory Browne]

23. What's she's doing does not paint her as a figher anymore than

what Bush does paints him as a fighter.

There's a huge difference between being a fighter and being stubborn to the point of meltdown. What Hillary's supporters should really be doing is asking her to step down. If her supporters start saying it, maybe she'll listen.

Couldn't you do that for the good of the party?

[livetohike]

24. I'm waiting for her to get in the face of Republicans - for eight

years now, I have been waiting. She is a disappointment as a Senator - imagine the Presidency under her.

[Beacool]

27. And Obama has been such a fighter.............

:rofl:

[livetohike]

34. He's winning without having to look like a fifth grader on the

playground.

[Beacool]

36. You mentioned her senate record.

When has Obama fought for anything in the senate????

Please......

[livetohike]

40. Here you go - not bad for his limited experience

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2008/2/21/164117/783/290/461422


Of the 15 bills Senator Obama sponsored or co-sponsored in 2005-7 that became law:

Two addressed foreign policy:
Promote relief, security and democracy in the Congo (2125)
Develop democratic institutions in areas under Palestinian control (2370).

Three addressed public health:
Improve mine safety (2803)
Increased breast cancer funding (597)
Reduce preterm delivery and complications, reduce infant mortality (707).

Two addressed openness and accountability in government:
Strengthening the Freedom of Information Act (2488)
Full disclosure of all entities receiving federal funds (2590)

Two addressed national security
Extend Terrorist Risk Insurance (467)
Amend the Patriot Act (2167)

One addressed the needs of the Armed Forces
Wave passport fees to visit graves, attend memorials/funerals of veterans abroad (1184).

Of the 570 bills Senator Obama introduced into the Senate during the 109th and 110th Congress (Senate Bill numbers are in parentheses), they can be summarized as follows:

25 addressed Energy Efficiency and Climate Change
Suspend royalty relief for oil and gas (115)
Reduce dependence on oil; use of alternative energy sources (133)
Increase fuel economy standards for cars (767, 768)
Auto industry incentives for fuel efficient vehicles (1151)
Reduce green house gas emissions (1324)
Establish at NSF a climate change education program (1389)
Increase renewable content of gasoline (2202)
Energy emergency relief for small businesses and farms (269)
Strategic gasoline and fuel reserves (1794)
Alternative diesel standards (3554)
Coal to liquid fuel promotion (3623)
Renewable diesel standards (1920)
Reducing global warming pollution from vehicles (2555)
Fuel security and consumer choice (1994, 2025)
Alternative energy refueling system (2614)
Climate change education (1389)
Low income energy assistance (2405)
Oil savings targets (339)
Fuel economy reform (3694)
Plug-in electric drive vehicles (1617)
Nuclear release notice (2348)
Passenger rail investment (294)
Energy relief for low income families (2405)

21 addressed Health Care
Drug re-importation (334)
Health information technology (1262, 1418)
Discount drug prices (2347)
Health care associated infections (2278)
Hospital quality report cards (692, 1824)
Medical error disclosure and compensation (1784)
Emergency medical care and response (1873)
Stem cell research (5)
Medical Malpractice insurance (1525)
Health centers renewal (901, 3771)
Children’s health insurance (401)
Home health care (2061)
Medicare independent living (2103)
Microbicides for HIV/AIDS (823)
Ovarian cancer biomarker research (2569)
Gynological cancers (1172)
Access to personalized medicine through use of human genome (976)
Paralysis research and care (1183)

20 addressed Public Health:
Violence against women (1197)
Biodefense and pandemic preparedness and response (1821, 1880)
Viral influenza control (969)
End homelessness (1518)
Reduce STDs/unintended pregnancy (1790)
Smoking prevention and tobacco control (625)
Minority health improvement and disparity elimination (4024)
Nutrition and physical education in schools (2066)
Health impact assessments (1067, 2506)
Healthy communities (1068)
Combat methamphetamines (2071)
Paid sick leave (910)
Prohibit mercury sales (833, 1818)
Prohibit sale of lead products (1306, 2132)
Lead exposure in children (1811, 2132)

14 address Consumer Protection/Labor
Stop unfair labor practices (842)
Fair minimum wage (2, 1062, 2725, 3829)
Internet freedom (2917)
Credit card safety (2411)
Media ownership (2332)
Protecting taxpayer privacy (2484)
Working family child assistance (218)
Habeus Corpus Restoration (185)
Bankruptcy protection for employees and retirees (2092)
FAA fair labor management dispute resolution (2201)
Working families flexibility (2419).

13 addressed the Needs of Veterans and the Armed Forces:
Improve Benefits (117)
Suicide prevention (479)
Needs of homeless veterans (1180)
Homes for veterans (1084)
GI Bill enhancement (43)
Military job protection
Dignity in care for wounded vets (713)
Housing assistance for low income veterans (1084)
Military children in public schools (2151)
Military eye injury research and care (1999)
Research physical/mental health needs from Iraq War (1271)
Proper administration of discharge for personality disorder (1817, 1885)
Security of personal data of veterans (3592)

12 addressed Congressional Ethics and Accountability
Lobbying and ethics reform (230)
Stop fraud (2280)
Legislative transparency and accountability (525)
Open government (2180, 2488)
Restoring fiscal discipline (10)
Transparency and integrity in earmarks (2261)
Accountability of conference committee deliberations and reports (2179)
Federal funding accountability and transparency (2590)
Accountability and oversight for private security functions under Federal
contract (674)
Accountability for contractors and personnel under federal contracts
(2147) Resctrictions awarding government contracts (2519)

10 addressed Foreign Policy:
Iraq war de-escalation (313)
US policy for Iraq (433),
Divestiture from Iran (1430)
Sudan divestment authorization (831)
Millennium Development Goals (2433)
Multilateral debt relief (1320)
Development bank reform (1129)
Nuclear nonproliferation (3131,977,2224).

9 address Voting/Elections
Prohibit deceptive practices in Federal elections (453)
Voter access to polls and services in Federal elections (737)
Voter intimidation and deceptive practices (1975)
Senate campaign disclosure parity (185)
Require reporting for bundled campaign contributions (2030)
Election jamming prevention (4102)
Campaign disclosure parity (223)
Presidential funding (2412)
Integrity of electronic voting systems (1487)

11 addressed Education
Increase access of low income African Americans to higher education (1513)
Establish teaching residency programs (1574)
Increase early intervention services (2111)
Middle school curriculum improvements (2227)
Public database of scholarships, fellowships and financial aid (2428)
Summer learning programs (116)
TANF financial education promotion (924)
Higher education (1642)
Build capacity at community colleges (379)
Campus law enforcement in emergencies (1228)
Support for teachers (2060).

6 addressed Hurrican Katrina
Hurricane Katrina recovery (2319)
Emergency relief (1637)
Bankruptcy relief and community protection (1647)
Working family tax relief (2257)
Fair wages for recovery workers (1749)
Gulf coast infrastructure redevelopment (1836)

5 addressed the Environment
Drinking water security (218, 1426)
Water resources development (728)
Waste water treatment (1995)
Combat illegal logging (1930)
Spent nuclear fuel tracking and Acountability (1194)
Asian Carp Prevention and Control Act (Introduced in Senate)

4 addressed Discrimination
Claims for civil class action based on discrimination (1989)
Domestic partnership benefits (2521)
Unresolved civil rights crimes (535)
Equality or two parent families (2286)

4 addressed Homeland Security
Judicial review of FISA orders (2369)
National emergency family locator (1630)
Amend US Patriot Act (2167)
Chemical security and safety (2486)

Next time someone asks you "where's the beef" in Senator Obama's Senate record, please feel free to send the link to this diary.

[niyad]

50. WOW--amazing he had the time to do all that, considering he has spent almost his entire time in the

senate running for the democratic presidential nomination.

apart from introducing these bills --what did he actually have to do with any of them? how many did he help write? (I am reminded of how many bills got his name on them in the IL lege, to make him look better)

one would think, looking at that list, that no other senator was doing anything.

[livetohike]

55. I was responding to the other post who asked

Just reporting what I found :hi:

[niyad]

57. understood. but my questions still stand. especially since he voted "present" for 120 votes.

[livetohike]

61. I don't know and I don't have the time to look up all that data

Btw, what has Hillary Clinton actually done in her 8 years?? How many laws did she write, how many received co-sponsors, how many passed?

I haven't seen any substance from her supporters on this same issue.

[thewiseguy]

28. How emotional?!

:eyes:

[Beacool]

29. Hillary is a much better candidate and has broader appeal.

Obviously, Obama is about to win the nomination. Having said that, I will support her even after she says "I'm out".

After she bows out, I'll continue on my merry way and watch the parade go by.

[Symarip]

31. Way to be a team player (nt)

[nadinbrzezinski]

35. So will you quietly pull the right lever in November?

even if you too wear a Hazmat suit?

[Beacool]

37. Frankly, I doubt it.

Country first, party second.

[Name removed]

38. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Neshanic]

39. self delete....

[Beacool]

42. I'm not trying to be cool.

I'm just expressing my opinion, just like you and everybody else. I though that we were in a democratic board, not in a dictatorship.

[cyndensco]

56. How does she have broader appeal?

If she had broadER appeal than Obama, wouldn't SHE be the frontrunner. That makes no sense. It is illogical.

[Beregond2]

30. This idea

that being "a fighter" by itself, is something to be proud of, baffles me. The question is, is the fight worth fighting? Is there any hope of victory? Is the fight being conducted in a fair, clean way? Does the fight benefit the larger cause? The answer to all of these, in Hillary's case, is "no."

This "my candidate, right or wrong" attitude is the kind of thing one expects from Republicans.

[JVS]

33. Nobody reads Augustine anymore.

Damned hippies

[futureliveshere]

32. Yes agreed.. At least you admitted its a 'him'. Fight on, but stay positive

Promote HRC, try not to pull BO down. I have been urging my fellow BO supporters all morning to do the same to HRC.

[bowens43]

41. Hillary isn't a fighter, she's a psychopath.

who is making a fool of herself, her supporters and our party.

[Rene]

48. Where'd you get the idea a campaign is a tea party. You FIGHT if you want to win.

Hillary gets my write in in November. I'll never vote for obama.
I've voted for many years...and I've NEVER been so ticked off at a candidate or his so called supporters.

[PoliticalAmazon]

44. She is wasting Democratic Party resources, and hurting Dems' chances in Nov....

....This is also germaine to the discussion.

I am wondering how far the DNC will indulge Hillary's refusal to concede before they maneuver to get her out.

[onenote]

46. Fair enough.

[Rene]

47. obama's a wimp. no decisions.(120 present votes)...preaches..packaged by king-makers

made into a rock star by the text messaging crowd. Those are the folks that'll put their hand on the TV ...so starved for attention.

[PATRICK]

49. This is hard to put on a candidate

who has a blockbuster size campaign with enduring big gains. It has not collapsed as many would have thought. It has obviously not gone broke enough except to tantalize the campaign that if only it had more money etc. She has also too much inertia on the aggressive front sliding in short of home plate to actually, easily stop anything.

She has still a huge amount of clout even if she froze her campaign in its tracks now. What she ought to do is every bit as difficult, maybe more so, than a simple concession speech. She has to transition away from the damage and the aggressive competition. She can still carry on if she balances that with reversing the tone skillfully toward party good will and unity. She will get enormous help with that.

Simply submitting in a Nixonian concession speech is NOT the best she could do, nor does it win much for those who think they have forced it upon her. You would quickly find that out if she did and that whole enormous segment of supporters and delegates were left sour, powerful and alienated from the huge tasks ahead.

It would still be to her enormous personal credit to pull off the positive unification mode as the campaign screeches to a final halt sometime far beyond its last hope. For that, early concession is not the first requisite. Enthusiastic support of the party is. I hope this fares better than
instances where she backed the MSM against Kerry, but the long work of reconciliation is what we really should desire to begin ASAP. Equally, or more negative are those gloating on the power or revenge trip who would be satisfied with the damage done to the party so long as HRC merely bites the dust in spectacular fashion.

[B Calm]

51. With Hillary, it's all about her and what she wants. . .

[B Calm]

52. She's not a fighter, she's a poor loser!

[goodhue]

53. An announcement: Obama is presumptive nominee

As for Hillary, I don't expect her to suspend her campaign until June 4th or so . . .

[Occam Bandage]

58. Two candidates.

One started with the entire party behind her.
One started with only a few Congressional allies.

One started with the biggest entrenched machine in Democratic history.
One started with his Chicago apparatus and little else.

One started the race 30 points in front.
One started the race polling in the mid-teens.

One started the race a household name by virtue of marriage.
One started with name recognition on the wrong side of 40%.

One didn't bother putting an organization in for caucus states or post-Super-Tuesday states.
One planned for the long haul.

One claimed it would be all over by Super Tuesday.
One focused on fighting past Super Tuesday, and so won 14 contests in a row.

One of these candidates is Hillary Clinton.
The other one is a fighter.

[TragedyandHope]

60. Not at all

Some of us are willing to wait. I hope more of us will realize it's in everyone's best interest to calm down.