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You don't understand, Hillary doesn't believe it's her fault she is losing

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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 11:33 AM
Original message
You don't understand, Hillary doesn't believe it's her fault she is losing
First, take a look at these traits:

Stabbed in the Back!

The past and future of a right-wing myth
Posted on Friday, July 14, 2006. Originally from June 2006. By Kevin Baker.

First drink, hero, from my horn:
I spiced the draught well for you
To waken your memory clearly
So that the past shall not slip your mind!

—Hagen to Siegfried
Die Götterdämmerung

Every state must have its enemies. Great powers must have especially monstrous foes. Above all, these foes must arise from within, for national pride does not admit that a great nation can be defeated by any outside force. That is why, though its origins are elsewhere, the stab in the back has become the sustaining myth of modern American nationalism. Since the end of World War II it has been the device by which the American right wing has both revitalized itself and repeatedly avoided responsibility for its own worst blunders. Indeed, the right has distilled its tale of betrayal into a formula: Advocate some momentarily popular but reckless policy. Deny culpability when that policy is exposed as disastrous. Blame the disaster on internal enemies who hate America. Repeat, always making sure to increase the number of internal enemies.

more


The Bush administration and the Republican Party thrives on such fear mongering. Here is Rumsfeld playing the fear card:

We also should be aware that the struggle is too important — the consequences too severe — to allow a "blame America first" mentality to overwhelm the truth that our nation, though imperfect, is a force for good in the world.


Now, let's focus on the "betrayal" formula: Advocate some momentarily popular but reckless policy (pandering). Deny culpability when that policy is exposed as disastrous (failing to accept responsiblity). Blame the disaster on internal enemies who hate America (projecting). Repeat, always making sure to increase the number of internal enemies (claiming everyone is out to "get you").

This is the formula Hillary's campaign has employed. Her campaign is a case study: it's everyone else's fault that she is losing to the dangerously naive Barack Obama (read: a black man who cannot win the nomination; therefore, our country's future is at stake) :

From accusing Obama of "demagoquery" to playing the fear card, Hillary's campaign has taken a page out of the Republican playbook.



Clinton to Obama: 'Shame on you'

She has helped to perpetuate the "cult of personality" claim with constant references to Obama's campaign as "just words" without substance. Here is Paul Krugman on the subject:

I won’t try for fake evenhandedness here: most of the venom I see is coming from supporters of Mr. Obama, who want their hero or nobody. I’m not the first to point out that the Obama campaign seems dangerously close to becoming a cult of personality. We’ve already had that from the Bush administration — remember Operation Flight Suit? We really don’t want to go there again.

What’s particularly saddening is the way many Obama supporters seem happy with the application of “Clinton rules” — the term a number of observers use for the way pundits and some news organizations treat any action or statement by the Clintons, no matter how innocuous, as proof of evil intent.

link


Hillary Clinton "Celestial Choirs" Barack Obama Attack

Bill Clinton:

And later, after he had run through, in great detail, the ins and outs of America’s foreign and domestic policy challenges, Clinton returned to the theme of substance versus abstraction. Hillary Clinton, he said, would be a “servant leader,” and voters had to decide whether that was more important than electing a “symbolic leader.” “You gotta decide,” he said, as if he had laid out even arguments for each.


Bill, Hillary and her surrogates have perfected a myth portraying Hillary as the victim of everything from media bias to sexism to Obama's fundraising. Hillary has been BETRAYED.

Betrayed by leading Democrats, the patriarchy, and everyone on the left:

Psychological Gang Bang of Hillary is Proof We Need a Woman President

January 11, 2008

by Marcia Pappas, President NOW - New York State

We've all witnessed scenarios where, on the playground little girls are being taunted by little boys while both girls and boys stand idle, afraid to speak up or even cheering. Or, in the workplace males tease young and older female co-workers; make obscene gestures, inappropriate comments, laughing and expecting (often correctly) that everyone will join in. Then there was that movie where Jodie Foster portrayed the true story of woman who was ganged raped in a bar while others looked on and encouraged the realization. Still others pretended the rape didn't happen. In short, gang raping of women is commonplace in our culture both physically and metaphorically.

This past week, we witnessed just such a phenomenon involving men who are afraid of a powerful woman. Hillary Clinton, in her quest for her Presidential nomination, has in fact endured infantile taunting and wildly inappropriate commentary. Indeed we have witnessed almost comical attacks by John Edwards who in turn sided with Barak Obama as both snickered at Clinton's "breakdown," which consisted of a very short dewy-eyed moment. Now John Kerry, who should certainly know better after his own "swiftboating," has joined the playground gang.

But here's the news. Every woman knows how it feels! There are those who will dismiss, defend or even shame those around them into believing that we progressives are making a mountain out of a mole hill. But that’s the game plan of the patriarchal system that has persisted for millennia. Because they can't frighten Hillary they've decided to control her with the time-old trick of patriarchal ridicule. Women, you know what I mean!

Pundits want to know what happened in New Hampshire. Why didn't the polls see it coming? How could they have gotten it so wrong? Well, aside from the thousands of women and progressive men who made calls from their homes, dropped literature, and held house parties for undecided voters, the truth of the matter is…women get it! That’s why, when women in New Hampshire could vote in private, they came out in droves for Hillary. They'd seen more Hillary bashing than had Iowa's women, and the polls stopped too early to measure their collective reaction. What happened is that women stood up and said "We're fed up and we're not going to take it anymore! We won't sit idly by and watch, while you gang bang one of us." One woman told me she didn't even want to vote for Hillary because she feared that her campaign would be the most dreadful blood bath in the history of politics. I asked her “if Hillary is willing to stick her neck out for us, should we not be brave enough to stand strong behind her?” She agreed and said of course she would vote for Hillary.

We have waited a long time to see our first truly viable women presidential candidate. And what we see now during the debates is what women and girls have experienced from time immemorial. But it seems John's recent alliance with Barak sent a clear message to women everywhere. The message is that if a woman gets too powerful, she can count on the good ole boys ganging up on her. Hillary is a powerful, strong and intelligent woman and she deserves our support. Let us remember what we as women's rights supporters, are charged to do: SUPPORT WOMEN!

And I, your writer,certainly speak from the belly of the beast. I was in Iowa for ten days with other feminist leaders, donating our personal time and money to help with Hillary's campaign. And in spite of our shortfall in Iowa, we did make a difference. Our efforts gave Hillary second place in the precinct we walked. Let me tell you why.

Our job on caucus night was to transport eight women from a nursing home to their caucus site. These were eighty-to-ninety-year-old women who came out in the cold weather and climbed into our vans to stand for Hillary. As we talked with glee about the possibility of our first women president, we were overjoyed to hear stories of their dedication to making it happen. One woman said "I never thought I would live long enough to see a woman president." Another woman said "It's about time; we need to have a woman as our President." These were women who were born around the time that women won the right to vote. They'd heard first-hand stories of that struggle from their mothers and grandmothers. They fought long and hard to see a day when they could have their own credit cards, own their own homes and be in control of their own bodies. They remember all too well when it was legal for a man to beat and/or rape his wife because she was HIS property. They remember when “rape” was ignored by people in the community and law enforcement officials. “She must have done something to deserve it” was common language in those days. Today we still see variations on this same behavior, more subtle perhaps, through success of our efforts, but nonetheless still abusive.

Now those senior citizens we transported stood tall for Hillary, and want us all to know that to have a woman president is to send a clear message to little girls everywhere: "Yes, you can do great things and even become President of the United States." Those senior citizens really get it!

So let's not let young women and little girls down, whether it's on the playground, in the workplace, or in the political arena. Young women need role models. They need to know they can be powerful and control their own lives. By putting Hillary in the Oval Office we send that message loud and clear for all to hear. Little girls everywhere need to know that to be important they don't have to emulate Brittany Spears or other similarly-exploited women. We can do it!

Think about the legacy we'll leave behind when we support Hillary Clinton for President of the United States. Let’s put a stop to the psychological “gang banging” of women and girls. Let's stand up and be counted by way of the hard-won votes we can now cast!

Marcia A. Pappas, President, NOW New York State


Hillary didn't denounce Pappas' despicable statement probably because she really believes herself to be a victim. She has been betrayed. She believes it, and Bill believes it:

A number of prominent Barack Obama supporters and neutral observers have criticized Clinton’s vocal role on his wife’s behalf. John Kerry told National Journal that “being an ex-president does not give you license to abuse the truth.”

“Did you notice he didn’t specify?” Clinton said when asked about the comment. “They never do. They hurl these charges, but nothing gets specified. I'm not taking the bait today. I did what I could to help Senator Kerry every time he needed me, and every time he asked me. He can support whomever he wants for whatever reason he wants. But there's nothing for me to respond to.”


There was a time when Bill Clinton's patriotism was challenged

Marcia Pappas, Kennedy-Basher, Heads to Ohio for Clinton

Erica Jong jumps at every opportunity to portray Hillary as a victim:

Hillary vs. the Patriarchy

<...>

You will point to Hillary's complicity. You will quote crazy-like-a-fox Ann Coulter, who claims to be voting for her.

You will also quote left-wing bloggers who love Barack Obama, and MoveOn.org peaceniks (I am one) who see no evil in him (nor do I). But I see little experience either. Obama is smart and attractive. Maybe he'll be president someday.

He was lucky enough not to be in the Senate when the Iraq war resolution was floated after then-Secretary of State Colin Powell lied about WMDs. That was the true tragedy of race: a black man lying for a corrupt white administration that was using him as a token, much as they use Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice now.

Obama is also a token -- of our incomplete progress toward an interracial society. I have nothing against him except his inexperience. Many black voters agree. They understand tokenism and condescension.

link


Jong must be sensing Hillary's predicament, but she cannot let go of her bizarre bias. Hillary is a beaver, Obama is a stallion (it's more fear, for Hillary's sake):

Why am I so afraid that the Democratic Party is shooting itself in the foot?

The Dems are far from perfect--in any time--but here we are in what has to be a Democratic year and it looks again like we are self-destructing.

We have two great candidates--one a hard working, never give up eager beaver, and one an inspiring, heart-leapingly brilliant stallion. Both have their merits. Both care for what Democrats are best at caring for--working people, children's and women's rights, financial realism.

Both acknowledge the health care crisis, the environmental depredations of the GOP, the huge lurking menace of a war that costs 12 billion dollars a day and gives us nothing--unless we are war profiteers or blow-yourself-up fundamentalists. Both are poised to take back the country from the plutocrats and their endless tax cuts for each other.


Note to Jong: Hillary is not losing because of sexism.

Last weekend Hillary launched bitter-gate. This was supposed to be a triumphant moment, casting Obama as an enemy of the people. Her attempt failed miserably.

In fact, Hillary's divisive campaign has hurt her much more than Obama:

*** Backlash? Two polls in major papers today will set the CW that the Clinton campaign will struggle with: that the attacks on Obama -- while softening up Obama -- have done as much, if not more, damage to Clinton. And that damage doesn't do anything to make the case she's somehow more electable than Obama. Per the Washington Post/ABC survey, Clinton’s unfavorability score is 54%, which is up 14 points since January; Obama’s, by comparison is 39%. Also, 58% say she’s not honest and not trustworthy. What’s more, Obama leads McCain by five points, while Clinton trails the Arizona senator by three. In addition, new ]link:www.latimes.com/news/la-na-poll16apr16,0,3742136.story?track=ntothtml|LA Times/Bloomberg polls] -- which show Obama ahead by five points in Indiana and 13 points in North Carolina, yet trailing Clinton by five in Pennsylvania -- has some similar findings. “Clinton also suffers from being seen as less admirable than Obama. Even in Pennsylvania, 47% of Democrats said he had more honesty and integrity, compared with 26% who thought that of Clinton.” This is the box Clinton's been in ever since Obama took the lead in this race: If she attacks, she raises her negatives almost as fast (if not faster) than she raises Obama's. These new poll numbers from the Post and Times indicate Clinton cannot be overly aggressive tonight and that could mean there's little chance of a knockout blow by her of him.

link

(emphasis added)

It's important to note that no one drove Hillary to this point, she freely and opportunistically engages RW-style attacks.

Still, she doesn't believe her problems are her fault. It's the Democratic Party's fault:

Clinton Expresses Frustration with the Democratic Party

April 10, 2008 4:56 PM

Sen. Hillary Clinton, D-N.Y., vented frustration that the Democratic Party has failure to come to a resolution about how to handle the convention delegations in Florida and Michigan.

"I really don’t understand why the Republican Party very clearly decided what they were going to do, and the Democratic Party can’t decide," Clinton said going further than she has in the past in her critique.

Senator Clinton then turned on her opponent, Sen. Barack Obama, D-Ill., saying "he doesn’t want the votes to count. Senator Obama has been very very clear - do not count those votes or come up with some kind of resolution which disenfranchises people."

An exasperated Senator Clinton burst into a fit of laughter, after being asked twice about the Colombia trade deal and a possible conflict of interest with her differing opinions she has with her husband. When asked if there was a conflict of interest specifically with her husband receiving $800,000 for speaking engagements ostensibly in support of the trade deal and Clinton giving her own money to her own campaign, Clinton burst out laughing. "And how many angels dance on the head of a pin. I have really, nothing to, I mean how do you answer that. I am against the Colombia free trade deal. It doesn’t matter who talks to me. It doesn’t matter any circumstances I’ve been against it I am against it I will be against it."

more


What next, question the legitimacy of the nomination:

GRANTHAM, Pa. — Hillary Rodham Clinton rejected the idea of a backroom compromise deal between the candidates to resolve Florida's Democratic delegate mess, insisting a solution must come from the national Democratic Party.

And failing to give Florida and Michigan a voice in the presidential nomination would leave the legitimacy of the nomination in question, the New York senator said.

In an exclusive interview with the St. Petersburg Times, Clinton offered her most extensive remarks on the delegate problem and pushed back at the Democratic National Committee's philosophy of having the campaigns approve a settlement.

"I don't think it's up to Sen. (Barack) Obama or me to dictate any resolution. I think it's up to the DNC to decide how to proceed, and I would hope that it would do so recognizing what's at stake,'' Clinton said in the interview late Sunday. "It would be tragic if we came out of this process ignoring the will of 1.7-million Floridians, setting us up for a very unhappy electorate in the fall, giving Republicans this incredible argument they could make against us."


Poor Hillary, it's not working out the way she thought it inevitably would.

The Trouble With Brand Hillary

Hillary turns out to be proned to lying, and her tactics are despicable. Maybe after this campaign is over, she can do some self-reflecting. The story about her run for president is already written.

More Hillary moments


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Arugula Latte Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 11:38 AM
Response to Original message
1. I just want to go up to her and say:
"Desperada -- Why don't you come to your senses?"
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4dsc Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 11:39 AM
Response to Original message
2. Hillary take the low road while Obama takes the high road..
Ed Schultz pointed out yesterday during his radio show that time and time again, Obama has refused to take the low road on issues about Hillary..
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guruoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 11:55 AM
Response to Reply #2
7. No, he kept his teflon intact by letting others do the swiftboating for him
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 02:52 PM
Response to Reply #7
30. Bee-yoo-tee-ful dreamer, wake unto me,
La-da-dee-dee-da-da-da-da-da-deeee
...Beautiful dreamer, out on the sea
Mermaids are chanting the wild lorelie
...Beautiful dreamer, awake unto me!
Beautiful dreamer, awake unto me!



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guruoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 03:38 PM
Response to Reply #30
34. ROTFL!
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ExPatLeftist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 06:21 PM
Response to Reply #7
41. Do you have any examples of this "swiftboating"?
Seems to me that Hillary Clinton has pretty much seen to swiftboating herself...

It's a bit of a stretch to accuse Obama of making her say the things that have caused most of the controversies surrounding her, I would think.
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Egnever Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 11:40 AM
Response to Original message
3. Obligitory Kick!
thanks for the hard work.
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Avalux Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 11:40 AM
Response to Original message
4. She has Bushitis.
She does not take accountablility for her actions and does not believe she is at fault for any of what's gone wrong with her campaign.

I imagine if she'd be president, she'd be a lot like Bush.
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ej510 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 11:47 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Hillary just cannot believe that this is happening!
She was blndsided by her arrogance.
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Hepburn Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 12:54 PM
Response to Reply #5
19. I would agree....
...I think she is at the stage of denial about the death of her campaign.

That was brought home to me when she make the bitter remarks at the union gathering and she was booed...the look on her face with IMO disbelief that this was happening to her.

JMHO
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 02:01 PM
Response to Reply #5
22. Reminds me of Penn and Carville's
Edited on Wed Apr-16-08 02:02 PM by ProSense
The Power of Hillary


Thanks for the comments and recs.



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Grinchie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-17-08 07:04 AM
Response to Reply #4
48. At this Point, I would wager that Dubya has Clintonitis
After all, there was so much dirty dealing in Arkansa before Bill became president. The Bushies just took it over and flew with it.
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ut oh Donating Member (190 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-17-08 11:10 AM
Response to Reply #4
59. I don't think she'll be a lot like Bush
But the finger pointing at anyone but her, is def Bush S.O.P.

It's really unfortunate.
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Armstead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 11:47 AM
Response to Original message
6. Yes, one of the advantaged making herself a victim -- She doesn't get it
Voters don't want to hear a lot of whining and blaming.

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Ian_rd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 11:56 AM
Response to Original message
8. Oh wow, that whole "gang-bang" tirade is amazing.
Now all of us who support Obama are gang-rapists? I never knew I had it in me.
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BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 12:39 PM
Response to Reply #8
14. It's all they got. This train-wreck of a campaign will be over soon, methinks...
Edited on Wed Apr-16-08 12:40 PM by BlooInBloo
EDIT: And how fucking despicable is the lessening of women who DO get horrifically raped? Equating that to having mean (but by-and-by true) things said about you is fucking pathetic.
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Ian_rd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 03:07 PM
Response to Reply #14
32. Excellent point. And what about the women who DON'T support Hillary?
Are they raping themselves? As Hillary's campaign and her supporters become more and more shrill, it will be hard for them to avoid the resulting moment of clarity of her potential voters. I'm convinced that's what caused the Democratic victory in 2006. The Republican rhetoric got worse and worse until they were finally saying shit like the terrorists were strategizing their attacks in Iraq to help DEMOCRATS WIN. I think many of their possible voters just heard this crap were like: "Wow, WTF am I doing supporting these assholes?"
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Grinchie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-17-08 07:07 AM
Response to Reply #32
49. Hillary's Supporters are Bought and Paid For.
Don't be fooled by the empty Corporate drones that signed on to fight for Hillary. Their work is amateurish, and they might have had better results if they outsourced their shills to Wipro.
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-17-08 09:18 AM
Response to Reply #8
53. Trust me. You do.
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Ian_rd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-17-08 11:47 AM
Response to Reply #53
62. Wow. In that case, gang-rapists are proving to be a powerful voting bloc this year
Their support alone puts Obama ahead of Hillary by 10 points! Scary!
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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 11:57 AM
Response to Original message
9. Bitter hubris

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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 08:38 PM
Response to Reply #9
44. Great image. n/t
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Major Hogwash Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 12:02 PM
Response to Original message
10. Man, I would hate to be in Bubba's shoes now.
You know, hell hath no fury like a woman scorned, and this is one scorned woman!

Mark my words, there is going to be some hellacious bookbag throwing going on later.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 05:49 PM
Response to Reply #10
40. She's bitter n/t


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guruoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 12:25 PM
Response to Original message
11. Still waiting to hear from Obama rapid response on this, prosense...
Going on two weeks now.


Hospital gives Michelle $200K raise, Obama appropriates $1M for Hospital


Hospital officials say Obama's wife deserved big raise

Obama_iii Officials at the University of Chicago Hospitals say a promotion and large pay increase given to Sen. Barack Obama's wife shortly after the Democrat was elected to Congress were well-deserved boosts for an executive who is "worth her weight in gold." The Chicago Tribune has the story.

"She's terrific," added Michael Riordan, who was president of the hospital in March 2005, when Michelle Obama was promoted to vice president for external affairs and had her annual salary increased from $121,910 to $316,962.

Hospitals spokesman John Easton told the Tribune that Michelle Obama's salary is in line with those of the 16 other vice presidents at the not-for-profit medical center.

Riordan told the Tribune that the promotion and salary increase had nothing to do with Obama's husband becoming a U.S. senator. "She was hired before Barack was Barack," Riordan said.

........

from the Obama campaign

Obama Requested $1 Million For Construction Of A New Hospital Pavilion At The University Of Chicago.
In 2006, Obama requested that the University of Chicago receive $1 million to support its Construction
of New Hospital Pavilion. For more than 75 years, the University of Chicago Hospitals (UCH) has provided
state of the art medical care on the South Side of Chicago. UCH is one of the largest Medicaid providers
in Illinois, and it provided more than $90 million in uncompensated care for Medicare and Medicaid
patients this past year. To continue providing the best care for patients from all walks of life, UCH is
proceeding with the construction of a new 600,000 square foot facility that will ensure their ability to
provide the best care for patients well into the future. Funding will go towards assisting the construction
and equipping a new hospital pavilion that will increase the Hospitals' clinical capacity by over one-third.


Obama did release his 2007 earmark requests but his Senate and campaign office has refused, without
explanation, tto disclose 2005 and 2006 until now.

I asked campaign spokesman Bill Burton why the change of heart.

"Sen. Obama throught it was appropriate to release them," Burton said.

http://blogs.suntimes.com/sweet/2008/03/sweet_scoop_obama_after_initia.html
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 02:04 PM
Response to Reply #11
23. That's stupid! Where is Hillary's earmarks list? n/t
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guruoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 03:34 PM
Response to Reply #23
33. Yes, graft is stupid, IMO.
graft (grăft) n. Money or an advantage gained or yielded by unscrupulous means.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 03:41 PM
Response to Reply #33
35. No, it's stupid. She was promoted in 2005
for an earmark request for the hospital (imagine supporting a hospital) in 2006?

How would that work with the hospital's budget and the appropriation process?



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guruoo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 04:51 PM
Response to Reply #35
38. Don'tknow. may be nothing to it. Kinda like a lot of things you try to peddle about Hillary.
Edited on Wed Apr-16-08 04:52 PM by guruoo
Get it?

(There's another one, but I'll save that for later.)
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elzenmahn Donating Member (124 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-17-08 02:21 AM
Response to Reply #38
45. Save it for later...
...you've just tipped your hand. Nice.

So why not just play what you've got? If you reeeealllyy think it's going to change a whole lot of minds, then fill us in.

Good luck with that.
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Kokonoe Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 12:36 PM
Response to Original message
12. Hillary is powerful, respectful and must be treated fairly.
Hillary is Lieberman, and must be handled with kid gloves.
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RiverStone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 02:10 PM
Response to Reply #12
25. And Lieberman will be irrelevant after the next election
Edited on Wed Apr-16-08 02:11 PM by RiverStone
So will Hillary if she does not make a graceful exit soon.
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Major Hogwash Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-17-08 04:43 AM
Response to Reply #25
47. Yesterday I heard that Lieberman may speak at the GOP convention this summer.
Ala Zell Miller.

When will the fun ever end?
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BlooInBloo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 12:37 PM
Response to Original message
13. They never do. It's Americanism - it's never your fault. It's always somebody else.
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myrna minx Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 12:43 PM
Response to Original message
15. K&R.
I really couldn't believe it when she mocked Obama supporters with her 'celestial choirs comments'. She never won me back. But then again, I live in a state that's not important to her anyway, so she apparently didn't want my vote anyway. :eyes:
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Catherina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 12:43 PM
Response to Original message
16. I can't wait until she's shooed off the stage. She's embarrassing. n/t
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housewolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 12:45 PM
Response to Original message
17. Excellent post
Thanks for doing all that analysis. Great work putting everything together the way that youu did.


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apocalypsehow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 12:47 PM
Response to Original message
18. K & R.
:thumbsup:
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Mme. Defarge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 01:25 PM
Response to Original message
20. From "The Sociopath Next Door" ...
Two simple rules: (1) Three lies equals one sociopath. (2) Beware the pity play.
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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-17-08 09:18 AM
Response to Reply #20
54. I know. Obama the frontrunner underdog gets me every time.
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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 01:41 PM
Response to Original message
21. that's probably gonna be true in any hard-fought contest
Consider what the Coach of Memphis said after the game. He complained about the 3 pointer that was properly changed to a two pointer after review, he complained about a foul that was not called on Collins, and so on.

There's a lot going on in the campaign and Russert and Matthews have certainly gone after her. Even before the Iowa caucus, Somerby was saying that the debate where Russert tripped her up "changed the course of the election". Before that, she seemed inevitable.

"Well...

Her Iowa numbers are down a bit from then, and her NH numbers are down substantially. Some of that is due to her own subsequent mistakes, but the whole dynamic started with that debate (and with the scripted press reaction)."

That debate and the 'scripted press reaction' have helped to take her down, probably just as surely as the press 'War on Gore' helped to put Bush in the White House. I expect this to have happier results, but I do not like the way the M$M seems to be the 'decider' in a supposed 'democracy'.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 02:11 PM
Response to Reply #21
26. That's true, but Hillary's divisive campaign isn't the old college try.
Their cries of betrayal and depths of denial go well beyond the "oh if the referee hadn't made that call."

This is more like the good old Tonya Harding try, repeating the same mistakes, and expecting to win.




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mod mom Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 02:08 PM
Response to Original message
24. Bill's email: "We know Senator Obama's strategy: spend, spend, and spend some more"
I sent my opinions on how I thought the Clinton campaign was being run to the new strategist and got on the email list to ask for money (now unsubscribed again), but I thought this was funny:

"We know Senator Obama's strategy: spend, spend, and spend some more"

So I guess Sen Obama's strategy to stay above the fray and focus on issues has nothing to do with his success. I wonder if Bill ever thought about just why Sen Obama has so much more money to spend-perhaps the people like the type of campaign he is running. :eyes:


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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Apr-21-08 09:25 AM
Response to Reply #24
68. Incredible, blame his superior fundraising. n/t
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nichomachus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 02:12 PM
Response to Original message
27. This is going to set the women's movement back 25 years
Edited on Wed Apr-16-08 02:13 PM by nichomachus
The constant "poor me" "I'm such a victim" motif is wearing thin. Hillary, history has shown us, is anything but a victim. She can play dirty when she has to.

There's an old saying (WARNING: Sports analogy) "If you want to play in the big leagues, you have to understand that, sooner or later, someone is going to throw at your head." Hillary wants to play in the big leagues, but when things get rough, she wants to be a victim.

And, comparing Hillary's treatment to gang rape just makes NOW look ridiculous -- definitely to men who aren't fond of NOW to begin with, and even to some men who were supporters of the organization. Marcia Pappas has done serious damage to her organization and her cause. It's worse because it really trivializes the plight of genuine rape victims. Shame on her.

So many women had pegged their hopes on Hillary -- and she has let them all down miserably.

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aquart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-17-08 09:21 AM
Response to Reply #27
55. Yeah, I believe you have.
I can't even imagine another woman with the guts and courage to run this sadistic gauntlet again.

But, it's only Hillary you won't vote for. A different woman would be fine.

Yeah, that's the ticket.
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nichomachus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-17-08 09:39 AM
Response to Reply #55
56. Ah -- ever the victim
Are you saying that all women are serial liars? The biggest problem Hillary has is that she or her campaign tells about one lie per day -- at a minimum.
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dbmk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-17-08 09:43 AM
Response to Reply #55
57. Well..
..as a guy that has twice voted for and hoped for a female head of state here in Denmark, twice voted for a female member of the EU parliament and twice voted for a female member of the city council, I can tell you:

If either of them had been Hillary, given the way she has revealed herself during her campaign (mind you when it started I expected her to win and was very ok with that), I would not have.

So, yeah, its not a woman thing. Its a person thing. And holy crap is she a bad one.
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RUMMYisFROSTED Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 02:13 PM
Response to Original message
28. Hagen to Siegfried!
:rofl:
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 02:40 PM
Response to Original message
29. K&R Thanks for compiling all this so well
:thumbsup: Good job.
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DearAbby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 03:00 PM
Response to Original message
31. Calling Dr Frist
Stat! The Campaign is flat lining, check the video, can it be saved?
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NewHampshireDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 03:44 PM
Response to Original message
36. Great post!
Seeing the 'Hillary expresses frustration with Democratic party' story here last week, I, too, had flashbacks to the excellent Harper's article that opens your OP. That's really the storyline, isn't it? It's funny, because it started with her supporters (who were quick to turn on anyone who criticized Hillary), then to her campaign team and advisers (Richardson as judas), and now to the lady herself.

I wonder, though, where is this all leading?

McCain/Lieberman, with HRC's blessing--citing the 'experience' of the ticket and the 'inexperience' of our nominee?

Or, the unthinkable McCain/Clinton? Or Clinton/Bloomberg (aka 'The Ego Party')?

Please, I hope I'm wrong about this. And I will be thrilled to be wrong. But there's still that nagging doubt.
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 07:12 PM
Response to Reply #36
42. Yikes, push it out of your mind. : ) n/t
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NewHampshireDem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 07:24 PM
Response to Reply #42
43. I will ... and, frankly, I'm a bit sorry I said it
I don't want my paranoia to be conflated with your excellent post. :)
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donheld Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 03:50 PM
Response to Original message
37. I'm learning according to Hillary
Nothing is ever her fault.
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elzenmahn Donating Member (124 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-17-08 02:26 AM
Response to Reply #37
46. Agreed. Just like Bushiebaby and the present adminstration.
Want more of that? IF Hilly finagles the nomination in Denver, then that's what we'll have. Two choices in the GE, same ol' crap.

"Meet The New Boss, Same As The Old Boss."

Had enough?
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KaptBunnyPants Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-16-08 05:12 PM
Response to Original message
39. I did not see that Krugman article. How sad.
If Krugman is willing to claim that Obama's supporters are the one's spreading venom who want "their candidate or nobody", then I take back every word of defense I've ever said on his behalf. He is a hack and nothing more.
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Orsino Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-17-08 07:23 AM
Response to Original message
50. I understand that it would be stupid of her to admit to big faults.
I don't begrudge her a little (okay, a lot) spin.
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peace frog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-17-08 08:29 AM
Response to Original message
51. "Clinton Expresses Frustration with the Democratic Party"
There is an easy solution to your frustration, Hill honey: LEAVE THE PARTY. Buh bye! :nopity:
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hayu_lol Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-17-08 08:43 AM
Response to Reply #51
52. Why should Hillary leave...
when she is going to win?
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SoonerPride Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 02:00 PM
Response to Reply #52
64. Wanna bet?
Name your price.
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Ganja Ninja Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-17-08 11:22 AM
Response to Reply #51
60. "vented frustration that the Democratic Party has failure
to come to a resolution about how to handle FL & MI"

They did come to a resolution, she just doesn't like it and won't accept it.
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Imagevision Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-17-08 10:23 AM
Response to Original message
58. Question, why is Bill sabotaging Hillary's run for the White House?
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geiger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Apr-17-08 11:36 AM
Response to Original message
61. And as Obama pointed out last night, she wants everything both ways, she's learned the wrong lesson
from past attacks that have been directed at her. She "plays it both ways," (Obama uses much more diplomatic language), but we are on to her.

Thanks for taking the time to document some of this. It's insidious and likewise pathetic, isn't it?
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 01:59 PM
Response to Original message
63. Hillary's surrogate write essay to help GOP
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karynnj Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 02:23 PM
Response to Original message
65. This shows why HRC's campaign has been so hurtful to the Democratic party
I had thought back in 2006 that the dynamics of a First Spouse running would be impossibly complicated - not matter who the First Couple was. An ex-President is often placed on a pedestal and becomes part of a very small group of elder statesman. The First Spouse will have spent 4 or 8 years as a First Spouse when everything is connected to (her/his) spouse's Presidency. Asking them to ignore that period is crazy and unfair - but using it has to make her opponents second guess it. This leads to Democrats criticizing the last Democratic President. This has to be a loss to the party. There is also the "third world" type aspect to it - is HRC really the best Senator or the best leader the party has? Where is the list of truly innovative things she has herself defined?

In fact, the dark side of the Clintons have made this worse - They have used every resource they have to throw mud. This has made the RW gleefull - with comments posted here saying that they were right in the 1990s on the character and integrity of the Clintons. This leads to us either having a candidate that HRC is attempting to damage - to prove to the superdelegates that he is not a winner - even though he is the most exciting politician in years. The problem is that - especially with their transparent attacks - she is even more damaged than he is. At this point, I regret the day that Clinton won the 1992 nomination - in spite of lying and scapegoating.


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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 09:44 PM
Response to Reply #65
66. Exactly. n/t
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ProSense Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-19-08 11:43 PM
Response to Original message
67. A list of people to blame:
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