Imagine if John Lewis had said:

[EffieBlack]

"If Hillary Clinton were a man, she would not be in this position. And if she was a black man or woman, she would not be in this position. She happens to be very lucky to be who she is. And the country is caught up in the concept."

And then after people objected to his comments, he responded with:

"Any time anybody does anything that in any way pulls this campaign down and says let's address reality and the problems we're facing in this world, you're accused of playing the race card, so you have to shut up. I really think they're attacking me because I'm black. How's that?"

What do you think the reaction would have been? Do you think people would be telling white women who raised concerns that they're tearing apart the party by objecting and that they needed to calm the hell down in order to make sure that black voters didn't get mad and desert the party?

Just wondering.

[maddiejoan]

1. I'd have to agree

If Hillary Clinton were a man, she would not be in this position.

She'd be our nominee already instead of the MSM's personal punching bag.

[Bucky]

2. Inasmuch her unique claim to being "ready on day one" is that she was married to a president

I'm pretty sure she wouldn't have had it in the bag by now. Of course it's a silly "what if" to begin with. Who she is in her entirety is a complex arrangement resulting from her life experiences, as a politician, as a wife, as a mom, as a lawyer, as the victim of an unrelenting 8 year long blood hunt on her family. If Hillary Clinton were a man, she wouldn't even be Hillary Clinton.

It takes nothing from her talents and capabilities to point out that she mostly became "the MSM's personal punching bag" after they spent six years building her up as the only Democrat who could seriously run for president. The press was talking "Hillary for president" virtually nonstop from the moment George W Bush got "elected"--stopping only briefly between Kerry's nomination and Bush's "reelection" in 2004.

She was able to dominate the fundraising before Obama showed up because she was President Clinton's wife and because she benefited from six years of media love-hate fawning. She was able to dominate the popularity polls in the election pre-season for the same reasons. To complain now that all those assets are somehow now liabilities seems a bit inconsistant.

Again, I detract nothing from her actual abilities--I'll happily vote for her and work for her if she's the nominee. But there were a couple of other candidates who decidedly were Hillary-Clinton-as-a-man: Chris Dodd and Joe Biden. Neither cleared 5% in the two state races they ran in.

[maddiejoan]

3. Sorry

HRC has twice the brains of Dodd and Biden (and they are no slouches)

She had to in order get as far as she did.

[Johnny__Motown]

16. Oh Please, all she did was inherit Bill's political machine and go shopping for an easily won senate

seat


She didn't do a damn thing to get herself into the senate other than marry (and dot divorce) Bill.



Yes I plagiarized the "Oh Please" thing from the post below me.. thought it was kinda funny....

[Hamlette]

4. Oh please, if Hillary hadn't been married to Bill she'd still be cheating her clients in Arkansas

At least now I know why people hate the Clintons.

I have defended both of them for 16 years. I'd done. They both stepped over the line. This 57 year old woman lawyer would have done anything to see a woman president in my life time. Not her. She is just like Bush/Rove.

[blonndee]

5. LOL!

:toast:

[maddiejoan]

6. If Hillary hadn't been married to Bill

she'd have been our 42nd President or Chief Justice Rodham by now.

[Hamlette]

7. LOL

And she wasn't because?

You are drinking the kool aid dear. You are not listening to her.

I have argued myself sick for 16 years defending those two. Against the right and the left (welfare reform, nafta etc) and now I finally hear what the Clinton haters hear. Dishonest, ends justify the means, evil Rove tactics.

How I wish it weren't so.

[Johnny__Motown]

19. What makes you think that? Her ability to attack a 12 year old rape victim?

[HuffleClaw]

8. who's john lewis? n/t

[izzybeans]

11. A Freedom Rider turned Congressman.

One of the leaders of the march in Selma Alabama.

American hero to me.

[Cha]

12. Google it. n/t

[grantcart]

15. I thought it was sarcastic until I saw your a friend from the north

Rep John Lewis was a civil rights worker who literally fought and was beat up in peaceful demonstrations with Dr. King.

He has sustained an even higher level of respect among many than Rev Jesse Jackson because he has become a respected Congressman

who is perceived as a very hard working Congressman who seeks a low profile and avoids inflamatory positions.

His credentials are considered among the highest in civil rights circles.

He originally endorsed Clinton but last month endorsed Obama, after Obama performed very strongly in Lewis' district and in Georgia.

In the original Ferraro statment she not only called Obama 'lucky to be a black man' but also clearly implied that John Lewis (and

Chris Dodd and others) are cowards for endorsing Sen Obama

peace

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fqL_sm0J8jc

[grantcart]

9. Here you can hear Ferraro call Rep Lewis a coward.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fqL_sm0J8jc

[izzybeans]

13. Here is John Lewis being beaten in Selma, Al. I dare her to say that shit again.

[barack the house]

10. You only have to flip it to make them see.

[goldcanyonaz]

14. I don't think it would have gotten much air time.

Much of this forum already spews that she wouldn't be where she was if she wasn't married to Bill, so I don't see this as that much of a stretch.

I also believe many here would cheer the comments on, if one had said the above about Hillary.

ETA!

Already got the above comment a few up from mine:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x5065579#5067907

[grantcart]

20. before apologizing for what you think she said please listen to the

comments made originally on the John Gibson show (her good friend)

In all of the discussion about what she has said people are overlooking this clip that comes from John Gibson's radio show

some of the statements she makes

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fqL_sm0J8jc

at 2:40 She accuses John Lewis of being a political coward because he switched his endorsement solely because he was afraid of his constituents

at 3:05 She says about Rosa Delora "I don't care what she says" implying that anyone who endorses Obama is simply hiding their real motivation (she goes on to repeat the now repeatedly debunked canard about 'present' votes)

at 3:25 "I am a lunatic about this stuff"

at 3:30 she impugned Senator Dodd for endorsing Obama solely as a result of "guys sticking together"

at 3:45 Gibson asks why would in not be the democratic thing to have superdelegates follow the democratic will of the primary elections "Why is it not credible that . . . they are doing it because they don't want to be at odds with the people"

and she basically says that they should just hand the election to Hillary regardless of the results

at 4:14 she restates her contention about Obama being in the race only because he is Black and characterizes him as being simply

a 'problem for Hillary' getting the nomination.


Listening to Ferraro you hear the bitterness of a woman who believes that Hillary Clinton was a woman of destiny who was leading the country to its first woman president and Obama the black man is stealing the nomination from her.

That level of bitterness about the fact that Clinton is losing this race is commonplace at DU. Why don't they direct their bitterness at the person who is responsible for the debacle sometimes termed Clinton for President campaign?

[Cha]

17. John Lewis is too smart and classy to say

anything like that..but there should defenitly be sufficent outrage at geraldine ferraro for coming out with this staged psych ops for the benifit of appealing to racist voters.

[NashVegas]

18. I Think Most Hillary Clinton Supporters Are Realistic Enough

That we would - do know - the truth in it.

However, we also know that because she is a wife, in the early-mid 1970s, she chose to put her very promising political career in the back seat (the trunk, really) and help her husband get promoted, eventually, to the highest office in the land.

Had she not been able to suppress her own ego and instead put her career first above everything, who's to say she wouldn't be in the campaign, right about where she is right now?

Oh, and P.S. -

Do you think people would be telling white women who raised concerns that they're tearing apart the party by objecting and that they needed to calm the hell down in order to make sure that black voters didn't get mad and desert the party?

That's what many Obama supporters have been doing in this very forum for the last two months!

"We must come together and support our nominee - Barack Obama <--- January 3, 2008.
The time for infighting is over. We must present a united front."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=132&topic_id=3944738

[grantcart]

21. The only legitimate rationale for unity is mathematical.

There is no way, given how delegates are distributed proportionally in districts that you can make up more than a few dozen delegates. Obama's 142 delegate lead in pledged delegates is mathematically unsurmountable. If anyone has made an argument for unity based on any other reason, I believe they are wrong.

[Usrename]

22. Some of us honestly don't see how she can possibly win.

Is there a plausible scenario for her to win the Whitehouse now? I sure don't see one. Maybe if she had won more, but not now.

How does she make it to the Whitehouse having lost the popular vote and the delegate count?

Do you think that she can be anointed by the superdelegates at the convention and still maintain enough support to win the general?