Question for Hillary Supporters: Did you ever ask yourself why

[jgraz]

Keith Olbermann, Stephanie Miller, Rachel Maddow, Mike Malloy, Mike Pappantonio, Sam Seder, Randi Rhodes, David Bender, Thom Hartmann, Laura Flanders, Cenk Uygar, Frank Rich, Eugene Robinson and Ed Schultz ALL suddenly "hate" Hillary and/or want to tear the party apart? Do you really believe that they're victims of mob mentality, closet dittoheads or that they're somehow coordinating with the Obama campaign?

Does that really make sense to you?


Or could it possibly be that your candidate has crossed the line where most (or all) decent progressives are horrified by her behavior?

Which do you think is more likely?

[Yes We Did]

1. Didn't you get the memo?

All of our progressive heros are really trolls.

Every last on of them.

They really are scary, aren't they. Just like Bush's 19%.

[soundguy]

11. Progressives ARE NOT Dems

They are progressives and are hijacking our party. Just so happens the Dems will put up with the crap they shovel. So the far wacky left has a new name for themselves same ole sheep different name. We do share a few of the same ideals, but the ones I work with on issues are all about themselves and use the party to further their pet causes. Flame me if you must but it is true.

[jgraz]

14. Damn right. Let's put this party back in the hands of the Corporations who PAID good money for it!

Go Hillary!

[dflprincess]

33. If you think Obama is the any less a corporate candidate than Clinton

I'd like to talk to about a bridge in Brooklyn I'd like to sell.

[Yes We Did]

37. Nice thoughtful arugument.... NOT! Got some facts to back that up?

Didn't think so.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

55. Some of Obama'sTop Advisers are LOBBYISTS for Monsanto, Pfizer, Carlyle Group, NRA............

Forum Name General Discussion: Primaries
Topic subject Top Obama adviser is lobbyist for Pfizer, Carlyle Group, Monsanto and NRA and....
Topic URL http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.ph...
4538995, Top Obama adviser is lobbyist for Pfizer, Carlyle Group, Monsanto and NRA and....
Posted by ElsewheresDaughter on Mon Feb-11-08 02:57 PM

Moses Mercado joined the Barack Obama presidential campaign team and already he's making waves.

The waves are being generated by Mercado's other line of work -- as a lobbyist with Ogilvy Government Relations who is registered to represent several dozen big-name clients, including the National Rifle Association, the Carlyle Group, the Blackstone Group, Monsanto, Pfizer Inc., United Health Group, Sempra Energy and Constellation Energy.

http://blog.washingtonpost.com/the-trail/2007/09/28/mer...



Hmmm.. Obama has lobbyists for big Pharma, energy and the NRA working on his campaign.

Obama Brings on Top Lobbyist


Obama and Hillary Clinton discussed the influence of health care lobbyists at an August forum. (AP).

Former Dick Gephardt presidential campaign adviser Moses Mercado hasn't even joined the Barack Obama presidential campaign team and already he's making waves.

Mercado, a veteran field man who organized Gephardt's primary operations in Arizona and New Mexico, and later John Kerry's general election operations there, confirmed he is finalizing plans to serve as a senior adviser to the Obama campaign.

The waves are being generated by Mercado's other line of work -- as a lobbyist with Ogilvy Government Relations who is registered to represent several dozen big-name clients, including the National Rifle Association, the Carlyle Group, the Blackstone Group, Monsanto, Pfizer Inc., United Health Group, Sempra Energy and Constellation Energy.

His resume seems to contradict one of Obama's central themes on the campaign trail -- that as an outsider he can fend of the powerful business interests that he has argued have contributed to the income gap between rich and poor and has frustrated attempts to address issues such as high prescription drug costs and global warming.

In a speech he gave in New Hampshire back in June, Obama singled out the role of lobbyists in the process. As the Chicago Tribune reported at the time, Obama "sought to make the case that the culture of influence in Washington affects the pocketbooks of Americans in myriad ways, from drug prices to student-loan interest rates -- both of which, he argued, are inflated through industry manipulation of public policy."

The story went on to quote Obama, saying: "What's most outrageous is not the morally offensive conduct on behalf of these lobbyists and legislators, but the morally offensive laws and decisions that get made as a result."

The Obama campaign said they have not settled on exactly what role Mercado will play, but he will not take on any job until he has ceased his lobbying work. Obama aides said yesterday no one can work on the campaign and still be registered on behalf of clients as a lobbyist, and Mercado will not be exempted from that requirement.

Mercado, who is close with Obama campaign manager David Plouffe, said his recent work as a lobbyist will not impede his ability to participate in a presidential campaign. He confirmed he would be taking a leave from Ogilvy, though the timing and temrs have not yet been ironed out.

"First and foremost, I'm an American and I participate in the process," he said. "That's the most important thing. I've always been involved in the process. That's why I'm going to be leaving , so that there isn't any question."

He said he was surprised anyone would take issue with his involvement. "I'm kind of honored that people are worried that I'm going to go work for Obama. It's good for the ego, I guess."





Why would they need to give money when they WORK FOR HIS CAMPAIGN?


"You've got to have a president in the White House who is not simply subject to the whims of corporate lobbyists" - Barack Obama

[Alexander]

61. So he gives Obama advice but no money? Big deal.

Wake me up when Obama starts taking lobbyist contributions like your girl does.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

66. Why would they need to give money when they WORK FOR HIS CAMPAIGN?

[blm]

71. Not all are created equal - you LOVED Jackson Stephens, E_D. What did HE DO for America that

made you want him and his chosen politicians like the Clintons who he groomed and bankrolled to have such an impact on our nation these past twenty years?

[movonne]

27. Go back to Rush...he is waiting for you...with open arms..

[dionysus]

28. hahahahaha... 23, is that you?!?!

hahahahahahahaha....

[Yes We Did]

30. Watch much Faux Noise? Oh that's right, that's all Hillary has left.

Doesn't that just say it all?

[LSK]

31. PLEASE let the hijacking continue

Because I like those wacky lefty crap such as universal healthcare, ending the war in Iraq, progressive tax structures, balanced budgets, public financing of elections, open elections and government.

PLEASE LET THERE BE MORE PROGRESSIVES!!!

[Alexander]

38. Can you show us progressives how to drag our knuckles on the ground like you do?

Some people make a very valid case for legalized abortion.

Just saying.

[Yes We Did]

42. Not just legalized, but legalized after the 90th trimester

[movonne]

60. I'm a liberal...can I be a dem...oh please...

[anamandujano]

2. Mob mentality.

[Yes We Did]

3. That, or the Hillary Supporters are just delusional.

[jgraz]

4. Every single one?

Are you really that much of a :tinfoilhat:-er?

[movonne]

13. and you think the Obama supporters are delusional...can you say

you disliked all these people before this election and their preferences..

[movonne]

32. and that seem to be the only 2 words you know...is this the hillary

message for the day...

[KittyWampus]

39. You sound like the teenage girl whose friends & parents all tell her the guy she's dating is a creep

the more you attack the creep, the more the young woman feels drawn to him.

[sueragingroz]

5. Randi Rhodes used to GUSH about meeting the Clintons

She was a fan.

She wants ratings.

That's it. That's all. She knows that her listener base are mostly latte sipping liberals and she wants to cater to that fan base.

Don't ever forget that these Liberal talk show hosts, while great at getting the word out in the GE, are about one thing: Ratings and $$$$.

[Yes We Did]

9. "Latte Sipping Liberals" I think you are in the wrong forum. Disgusting!

[movonne]

24. I also liked (very much) the Clinton's..I joined Move On when they

opened up business to defend the Clinton's...but now I feel much different..and I think another clinton in the white house would be bad..I don't know what Obama will do..but I sure know what hillary will do...

[Yes We Did]

35. yeah, we'd lose the house and senate again.

[LSK]

34. Randi Rhodes has talked about hating defending Clinton during monicagate

PS this is the same Randi Rhodes who joined Cindy camping in the ditch and the same Randi Rhodes who got sued by CACI for speaking the truth.

[Yes We Did]

41. But she did it anyway. She stuck by her and kept her mouth shut until

the Ferraro incident. She held out longer than most. And I wish she would have started earlier.

[bvar22]

62. It wasn't the Ferrraro "incident".

Randi flipped after Hillary endorsed McCain last week.
THAT was the straw that broke Randi's back.

[Blue-Jay]

45. What's wrong with lattes?

Personally, I prefer black coffee (sometimes hazelnut-flavored), but when did enjoying an occasional latte become something to be derided?

What's next? should we make fun of people who like Guinness instead of Keystone Light? Are they the next "bad liberals"?

[movonne]

6. not to mention the Kennedy's ...to me that was the big one..I lived

through the Kennedy years and loved John and Bobby...

[blm]

7. For me, the Clintons have PROVEN they side with secrecy and privilege of BushInc and

its powerful cronies.


That respect for closed government proves they have NO REAL RESPECT for the citizens of this country and our right to open government that is accountable to the people.

Instead of treating us as citizens to be respected with the truth we get treated as mere voters to be manipulated - just as the GOP does with its base.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

8. They want to be considered cool. Not a real hard question.

[jgraz]

17. Exactly how does criticizing Hillary make them "cool"?

[Scurrilous]

10. K & R

:thumbsup:

[goldcanyonaz]

12. Not everyone was meant to be a follower.

[movonne]

40. So why are you...

[goldcanyonaz]

47. Wow, how profound. You get a cookie.

[movonne]

64. I thought so...I'm glad you did to...and thank you for you cookie...

[pocoloco]

53. Nor smart enough to lead.

[styersc]

15. Wait, I've read posts that claim there is no media bias at all

against Hillary and now you are claiming that there is an entire cabal out to get her? WHich is it?

And have you ever asked yourself why you are so mentally weak that the opinions of a bunch of talk show hosts is so important to your decision making process? Talk about "ditto heads"?

Grow some balls and some brains.

[jgraz]

19. Reasoning really isn't your strong suit, is it?

That's ok, we still need people to staff the drive-thrus.

[Metric System]

22. Excellent points.

[tridim]

16. Occam's Razor be damned I guess.

Our progressive talkers are just moving the same way as the rest of our party, away from Hillary. It's not mysterious at all.

[Metric System]

18. It sounds like you're engaging in groupthink. I have my own mind, thanks.

[jgraz]

21. Really? Plan on using it anytime soon?

[Metric System]

25. Is that the best you can do?

[hisownpetard]

29. Jeez, I thought it was pretty damned good, if you ask me!!

[jgraz]

36. Ok, try this. You just accused Randi Rhodes of tearing the party apart for criticizing Hillary

Do you think all of these other people are tearing the party apart when they criticize her tactics? Is that what you think is going on here?

[saracat]

20. Did you ever ask yourself why RFK Jr , Paul Krugman , Wes Clark Steven Speilberg and a host of

others support Hillary or aren't they decent progressives? Could it be that not "eveyone agrees with you"?

[jgraz]

26. No one is on this board saying RFK Jr is evil or tearing the party apart.

But every time someone comes out AGAINST Hillary's scorched-earth tactics, they are accused of being a tool of the right or stupid or crazy or any number of things. Does that make sense to you.

And btw, if you had caught this week's Ring of Fire, you'd find out that RFK Jr is none too pleased with the current tactics of the Clinton campaign.

[EFerrari]

59. And we have yet to host a thread eviscerating RFK JR. Hmm.

[maddiejoan]

23. Obama is the new corporate backed candidate

In truth, he has been since he delivered the keynote address in 2004.

Doesn't shock me that he has been propped up by the media and gobbled up by the gullible.

The Clintons never were really the 'insiders'. That's why Bill was attacked non-stop through his Presidency, and Hillary through her candidacy.

They've always been the 'outsiders' that weren't supposed to get where they got. Washington DC both hates and fears the Clintons.
That's why this primary has concentrated on destroying Hillary. The fact that she is still standing toe-to-toe with the establishment
shows what a fighter this woman is.


It doesn't much matter to me. We'll have a Democratic President either way, but I don't think Obama will achieve even a small fraction of his agenda while in office.

My only hope is that he isn't torn to shreds during his Presidency and end what could have been an easy 16 years of Democratic Party majority.

I'm in NY. I get Hillary no matter what happens.

[movonne]

57. And I'm glad you have her in New York and I hope she stays there

and does a good job...I was a supporter of the Clinton's then(meaning when he was in office) but no more...

[maddiejoan]

63. and I hope to hell

that Obama can take the beating the GOP is going to give him.

Whether he makes it to the Presidency or not. Because it sure won't stop if they give him the keys to the WH.

[jconner27]

43. Mighty fine kool aid over at team Obama

I think they want McCain to win because they're be out of job if a Dem wins.


PS
Fuck you Randi Rhodes

[LSK]

50. how do you explain Randi Rhodes job during the 90s???

When she was DEFENDING THE CLINTONS? She seemed to have a job then....

PS
YOU ARE AN UNGRATEFUL ASSHOLE. LOOK IN THE MIRROR SOMETIME.

[jconner27]

44. Mighty fine kool aid over at team Obama

I think they want McCain to win because they're be out of job if a Dem wins.


PS
Fuck you Randi Rhodes

[jgraz]

46. Really, all of them are on the obama Kool-aid. Every one?

Do you even know who all of these people are?

[jconner27]

73. Ok there's another reason

They want a pony too.

[Ravy]

48. I *have* wondered that.

I really have no clue why they have. It certainly surprised me.

But, I am not much of a crowd follower.

I just want a Unity ticket because I think it is by far our best chance at winning, so I hate to see the bashing get too far out of hand. Particularly media-led bashing based on half-truths and lies.

[rodeodance]

49. CUT THE CRAP--STOP CALLING OUT HILLARY SUPPORTERS!

[jgraz]

54. Are you stalking me?

Or am I just too "uppity" for you?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=4777209&mesg_id=4777381

[dionysus]

56. calm down, calm down....

banky will make everything better...

[bridgit]

51. Can't say about the rest of them, but Schultz has been up front & nasty about it...

She wouldn't come on his show and it bruised his ample ego

[LSK]

52. Randi officially got nasty about Hillary last friday

Up until then she had not publicly taken a side.

[bridgit]

69. I like her, but she was off the hook today, shouting callers down...

If you don't agree with her, or she with you...it's a shouting match, and she has the mic. Maybe it'll get better after all this stuff. Maybe...

[LSK]

70. thats how she always is

:shrug:

[jgraz]

58. The real question is about ALL of them

If you take them one at a time, it's possible to pretend that they each, individually, are trying to torpedo Hillary. But when you look at all of them together, a different picture emerges.

[bridgit]

67. AirAmerica seems making a last stand, they are all standing atop one rampart...

Malloy last night gave a considered run down of the many concerns voters should be accessing to make an informed decision regarding BO (you'll have to pull up the transcript as I will provide no link that's your research)...but he was back on point/target in very short order. The rest are simply talking over, under, past & around such matters. And not merely because they disagree with HRC, but because they hate her; you can hear it in their voices, and the words they choose.

For people that prefer their news seem less biased toward one Dem; more biased against republicans, AirAmerica may not be the way to go at this point in time...in the aggregate. It's too much like an echo chamber. I know I have little interest in a left-wing version of FauxNews.

If by trashing left-center, or even center-if-still-Dem-views is what is said to reside within it's charter as "features discussion and information programs with hosts reflecting liberal and progressive points of view" then I guess that's fine, I don't own the radio station. So I have no vote there, not even by proxy.

I do think it in their longer term interest to get back to what put them there to begin with http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_America_Radio

[workinclasszero]

65. How about this: Rush Limbaugh, Hannity and Bill O'Reilly are helping Hillary

in her quest to destroy Obama and any chance the dems have at winning the presidency this year.

Damn how f'in stupid are the Hillbots anyway!?

I do believe the bots are all going to vote foe McCain in the GE. He's their boy for sure!:puke:

[rodeodance]

68. "Damn how f'in stupid are the Hillbots anyway!?"--see, this is what these type threads do!

[DemVet]

72. I think they are all closet dittoheads. Good way of putting it . Thank you. n/t

[WinkyDink]

74. I know! Gen. Clark and Joe Wilson are such morans!

Did you need to read *sarcasm*?

[amborin]

75. that's a motley list of heterogeneous types

some are mere tv show hosts like olberman (not a journalist by any means)

others are assorted other categories

but, hey, Hillary can make a list, too....

staring with Paul Krugman, brilliant world renowned Princeeton economist

whom Obamites now despise

[LSK]

76. add Bill Maher to the list

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sii15ANPTEQ&feature=related

[jgraz]

78. and Matt Taibbi and Katrina Vanden Heuval

Katrina was a big Hillary booster at the start of this campaign. Now she's recording editorials slamming her tactics.

[fadedrose]

77. They disappointed in the way she votes,,,

and whom she gets her money from, and in the people who support her candidacy. And they doubt her sincerety about the issues she claims she wants to solve.

The same reason why I'm against her.