REALITY: Clinton is the WEAKER general election candidate....

[rndmprsn]

with negatives in the 47-48% range, GOP attack machine primed and ready to throw 20 years of opposition research at her, more than half of the DEMOCRATIC party NOT behind her, compromised position on IRAQ WAR VOTE, no REAL experience as a chief executive, no REAL CIC experience, DLC CORP democrat, LOST MOST of primary states, behind in POPULAR votes, BEHIND in delegates, throws temper tantrums on live TV, does NOT have the temperament to be CIC, etc etc etc...

why the hell any progressive democrat or general election independent voter would vote for clinton...i have NO idea?!


please add to the list if you can...

[tabatha]

1. Most importantly,

her approach to things does not appear to be presidential.

[TwilightGardener]

2. Word. Total lack of honor, principles and integrity.

[City Lights]

7. Amoral. eom

[Skwmom]

3. No duh. ALL the Republicans had to do was increase her negatives and now

they don't even have to do that. She's done it for them.

The only reason she's still in this race is the media and the Limbaugh Republicans.

[papau]

4. not true - see USA survey - she wins over McCain and that is with Oregon going GOP

Obama also wins over McCain but with no larger margin than Hillary's - and they give Obama Oregon (there is a 1% difference between folks in the poll).

[gabeana]

5. If you are going to use Survey USA

guess who the stronger candidate is, just guess ------- it's Obama

[papau]

6. He needs Oregon to win - Hillary doesn't.. O's 4 extra electorial votes mean squat as he is given

Oregon and she is not, based on a 1% difference.

[rndmprsn]

8. ...in other words

[papau]

12. In other words if you think Oregon is iffy - Hillary is the only choice

[rndmprsn]

13. don't fucking put words in my mouth asshole

i wasn't even responding to your sorry ass excuse for thinking/post

shoo go away, or help keep my thread kicked...you decide

[papau]

21. self-delete

[rndmprsn]

22. ...

[rndmprsn]

23. thanks for the kick =]

now go away

[papau]

28. I owe you an apology for reacting to your tone that way - I should have just ignored it - sorry

[beachmom]

11. Not if the AA vote doesn't show up. nt

[papau]

14. Also true if the 70% of the Hillary supporters that say O is "unacceptable" don't show up

[beachmom]

24. Republicans usually win the white vote. Even Bill Clinton lost the white vote.

But without a strong percentage and turnout from the AA community, a Democrat is toast.

[beachmom]

9. I just read that Kerry can thank his wins in PA & MI largely on a high percentage AA vote.

That is something that I never considered in a micro way. There has been so much emphasis on the "Archie Bunker" Reagan Democrats types, that people have forgotten that if a Democratic nominee doesn't get the AA vote to turn out in a big way, you can kiss key swing states goodbye.

[papau]

17. true - this is the first time the female vote is really pissed at a candidate, making pleasing

both groups important.

[beachmom]

26. The female vote will come around if Hillary loses fairly (I see a MI/FL deal is in the works)

Obama has been ahead the entire time. I think most progressive females will come around, especially since the Obama campaign has not used sexism subtly or blatantly the way the Clinton campaign has used race baiting.

It hit me with a ton of bricks what the whole nastiness was about: First African American or first woman. One group has to lose and that causes hard feelings, but you can hardly say one group was more deserving than the other. The difference is the Obama campaign has not been plagued with sexist surrogates, and that Obama has always been ahead. That is completely different than Clinton trying to win via smoke filled room (super delegates overturning the pledged delegates) or making MI and FL count exactly as the "results" were, since Obama wasn't even on the ballot in MI and he was the less well known candidate in FL where he was not allowed to campaign.

Obama is going to lose PA, but he will lead in the popular vote and pledged delegates by the end of the process. The Supers will see that and confirm that he is the nominee.

[Laurab]

34. A lot of the female vote is "pissed" at Hillary.

From what I've seen, anyway. I'm one of them. It would be difficult, if not impossible for her to get my vote now, unless she wins fairly, and I don't see how she can.

If that's my choice for a woman in the WH, no thank you. Papau is mistaken, I think. I believe it's a very small percentage "pissed" at Obama. What for? Because he had the audacity to run against Hillary?

There are so many things to be angry at Hillary for, and I don't think she would have a prayer in the GE, and she's done it by HERSELF.

You are exactly right about everything you said, at least I hope so (except for the losing PA part - I do hope he does well there), but I'm not sure it's progressive women who need to come around - I think a lot of them already have.

It's the ones who aren't aware of the underhanded tactics used by the Clinton campaign that will need to come around - the "Jane six-packs" I guess you might call them. I know a few, of both sexes - and they really don't prefer Hillary THAT much, so I'm not sure it will be a big problem.

[XemaSab]

30. Think about it this way:

The country is about 12% black.

The country is about 50/50 Democrat and Republican.

Virtually all black people are Democrats.

So you take the 12% and double it to get the proportion of black people within the party and HOLY COW!

The party is 24% black people!

Admittedly, a lot of black people live in the south and go pretty unrepresented.

But we neglect them at our peril.

[Nitrogenica]

10. Rush wants her elected as our candidate because she is weaker.

[rndmprsn]

15. ding ding ding!

cling faith in clinton syndrome causes otherwise normal people to lose all sense of judgment

[papau]

16. If seen seen a head fake in either the NFL, or the NBA?

[snooper2]

18. calculated...

Everything the Clintons have done in their lives has been calculated...except for the blow jobs

Now Obama is messing it up...

[papau]

20. Obama is not calculating - St Obama of the weekly race card smears via "supporters"

[tabasco]

33. No, the weekly RESPONSE to the Clinton racial smears.

Clinton follows the republican playbook to a tee.

Smears her opponent and then cries foul when he responds.

Only fools can't see Clinton for the vile person she has become.

[rndmprsn]

35. amen

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

19. You're making WAY too much sense.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

25. Any connection between your reality and mine is purely coincidental.

[beachmom]

27. Hillary Clinton will lose states where Obama has a chance. I lived in VA. I know what I am talking

about.

[metalluk]

29. There is no quarreling with your last point.

You do indeed have no idea.

Clinton's weakness is her negatives; Obama's is his glaring lack of experience. Either way, McCain is poised to pounce. The Democratic candidate, whoever that might be, will have to pounce harder and quicker. That's why campaigns take place. Neither you nor anyone else knows for certain what will happen in the general election and the polls suggest it is going to be close, regardless of whether it's Clinton or Obama carrying the Democratic banner.

Many Obama supporters will stay home if Clinton wins the nomination; many Clinton supporters will crossover if Obama gets the nod.

Obama puts into play for the Democrats five traditionally Republican states but would also jeapordize four Democratic states and one swing states, and the latter group has twice the number of electoral college votes as the former group. Without a state by state analysis, general election projections are meaningless. You are merely stating what you wish to be true, without any genuine substantiation.

Obama's inexperience is very evident to experienced observers and will be all the more evident after McCain takes his whacks.

[JimGinPA]

31. K&R

[Carolina]

32. K&R!