Signed OFF from MoveON and here's what I told them:

[Triana]

No matter who I support for President (and I haven't decided yet), I don't think it's a good idea for MoveOn to be endorsing or working for any particular candidate. In fact, I'm not sure it's even legal for MoveOn to do so.

I am turned off and disgusted by MoveOn's endorsement of Obama - no matter how your members voted on who they wanted for President.

I don't dislike Obama or Clinton or any other Dem candidates - but I DO NOT NEED any more emails from this organization or that one begging for my money or time in supporting one candidate or another.

I thought MoveOn was a different type of organization than that but I guess not.

I hope a Democrat wins. One of them. And as for MoveOn - they should be encouraging that same thing. Going beyond that is unacceptable to me, given what type of organization I believed MoveOn to be.

Sorry.

[sniffa]

1. Who cares?

And this is only brazillionth thread by some DUer saying they've left MoveOn. Good for you.

[pocoloco]

4. Don't care??

Why the fuck would you post??

[sniffa]

8. Why

Because this is a stupid fucking thread. That's why I fucking posted. Thanks for fucking asking.

:hi:

[neutron]

29. I signed off Yesterday

They used us to promote their own candidate and
make the media think all 3 million members voted..

In fact only a fraction even knew about the vote.

MoveOn shrewdly sent emails the evening before
their deadline - on a workday when few people would have
time to read their email.

[neutron]

31. We also Dropped Cable TV

[Triana]

66. I dropped mine back in 2001...

...couldn't stomach any more of the punditry and propaganda. I think people develop a tolerance for it. But if you don't listen for a few years then get a glimpse of it again - it's appalling.

Congratulations on saving both your money and your sanity! :thumbsup:

[neutron]

82. I was dumb enough to believe in Olbermann

Lookin' out for himself just like every other news animal.

[boston bean]

61. you only post in the stupid fucking threads, which means alot. I haven't

seen you make on good reasoned argument.

Except maybe your support for Mercer for President. Yeah right.

[demo dutch]

76. Snifa Snifa, getting hostile again.

[cali]

10. why the fuck shouldn't someone post? n/t

[Sherman A1]

34. Agreed

If the thread is of no interest one must wonder why one would post to it........

I never went to MoveOn's web page, but I certainly won't now..... This was in my opinion a dumb move.....

From a DK Supporter that will most likely vote for Obama in the Primary.

[MADem]

6. You've given up that affectation of all lower case letters save the L??

Or did you get a new keyboard, or what?

[LibraLiz1973]

44. That is his "thang"

Always has been
:)

[MADem]

50. Not any more, it seems....!

Otherwise, his post would read

and this is only braziLLionth thread by some du'er saying they've Left moveon. good for you.

[LibraLiz1973]

42. I'm leaving MoveOn because they wont support Lee Mercer.

:rofl:

[populistdriven]

81. I am phone banking for them tomorrow, mostly because of the endorsement. nt

[ZombieHorde]

2. What kind of organization did you think they were?

Why does it offend you that they endorse someone?

[Bluebear]

9. Because they never have before. Never.

This is the first time they endorsed someone in the primary and it certainly wasn't a progressive.

[ZombieHorde]

17. So...

The reason you are offended is because it is their first time?


I hope that you are not this harsh on virgins.:evilgrin:

[Bluebear]

19. ...

:evilgrin:

[VolcanoJen]

32. Except for the fact that that's not true.

In 2004, they did the exact same thing, and the same way as they did it here... the winner of the MoveOn straw poll would have to meet a threshold of support in order for MoveOn to endorse.

Howard Dean won that straw poll, but it didn't pass the threshold. So, that's why they didn't endorse.

[Bluebear]

72. So, then it *is* true, if they didn't endorse. Right?

[Radical Activist]

59. They held an endorsement vote in '03

and Obama and formerly Kucinich are the only ones in the race with a real progressive record.

[tularetom]

3. The members of Moveon VOTED to endorse Obama

Did you vote? If you did and were outvoted then you have every right to be unhappy with their action. You even have the right to quit and complain if you want.

If you did not vote you can still quit but you probably should not bitch. Maybe if you had voted the results would have been different.

I made a contribution to them over the Petraeus ad. Since then I've gotten a bazillion requests for more money from them. They are a pain in the ass but if their MEMBERS vote to endorse Obama so what? It ain't gonna influence what I do,

[Bluebear]

11. It was not a vote, it was a sample poll.

And I certainly didn't expect them to endorse someone in the primary, they never have before.

[emilyg]

20. I opted out, too.

[tularetom]

23. Vote, Poll BFD. Did the OP participate or not?

If not then they should STFU. What, you don't like democracy? Would you like it better if the people who participated in the vote/poll had selected Clinton or would you still be outraged?

[Triana]

52. YES I DID.....

...as a matter of fact.

AND YES I'd still be outraged at what they've done no matter WHO "won" their poll.

I had no idea the morons were going to ENDORSE and start shilling for whoever won the damn poll. In fact it never occurred to me that they would do such a stupid thing.

[tularetom]

54. Fine - that's all I need to know

You did the right thing then. I just don't know that I would be "outraged" about it. I only have a limited capacity for outrage (although people who know me think that capacity is unlimited) and most of it is used up by the outrage I feel daily at the fucked up incompetent bush administration. After that I really don't have the ability to feel much outrage at something as insignificant as who the members of Moveon.org endorse in a presidential primary.

IIRC Moveon was formed in the late 90's in an effort to get the country to "move on" and get beyond the silly ass Clinton impeachment and let Clinton do his job. Perhaps they should go back and examine their mission statement.

I dunno. I liked what they did with the Petraeus/Betray Us ad so I gave 'em some dough. I just don't give a rats ass who they "endorse". If I contribute at this stage it will be direcltly to the candidate.

For what its worth I voted absentee in the CA primary. Unfortunately the candidate for whom I voted has since seen fit to discontinue his efforts to seek the presidency

[truedelphi]

43. It's not like they gave the email recipients much time.

As someone else said, you were asked to vote and twenty four hours later the votes were counted.

I think that SUCKS!

And I am more of an Obama supporter than Hillary, but I still think it is unfair.

[cali]

5. nice and self-righteous.

I give it a 7 on the high dudgeon scale.

:thumbsup:

[mtnsnake]

7. Awesome letter, Triana

Well done!

[krabigirl]

12. Excellent. Great letter.

[ursi]

13. Ok, I go to the move on site and vote for Obama - they then endorse him

does this mean you are leaving the country if Obama wins?

[bookman]

14. I sorta felt that way also

I actually wish there was a choice to not endorse a primary candidate. MoveOn did not include one. I'm still a Move On fan, but this bothered me a bit.

[Yael]

15. I did as well, but not because I dislike Barack Obama

They moved from issues to partisanship.

[Triana]

27. That's just it....

...they moved from progressive issues and activism for progressive issues and ideas to partisanship. For them - therefore - to choose to endorse and support any specific candidate before our nominee is chosen completely changes (and considerably narrows) the focus of what MoveOn WAS (or what I thought it was).

Thanks Yael for putting into words what I couldn't.

[onehandle]

16. Sadly, their endorsement can only hurt Obama.

And it won't get him a single extra vote.

[VolcanoJen]

37. There's nothing "sad" about getting endorsed the members of MoveOn.

And if you knew anything about the spectacular kinds of ground operations they mobilize in elections, you certainly wouldn't be able to say "it won't get him a single extra vote."

I'm truly disappointed at how naive so many DUers are when it comes to MoveOn.

[MADem]

18. I think they've been hearing a LOT of that sort of farewell in the past few days.

I am betting that MOVEON wishes they could move on from this debacle of an error in judgment. The cash cows are pushing off to greener pastures.

[shaniqua6392]

22. They will not get one dime from me.

I canceled my membership already, too. They should not have endorsed anyone. And for those who say that Moveon did not endorse, you had better get your facts straight. Just because they based their endorsement on SOME of it's members voting, they still came out with an official, first time ever endorsement of a candidate.

[acmavm]

91. This will be to MoveOn what supporting bush**s prescription drug plan

was to the AARP. The AARP never recovered, and neither will MoveOn.

[Recursion]

21. I wish I could understand the outrage

They're a political organization. Why shouldn't they endorse a candidate?

[Saturday]

28. They should endorse the Democratic candidate in....

the General Election NOT in the primary. What if Obama is not our candidate? They made a stupid move IMO.

[truedelphi]

45. Yes indeed they made a stupid move. n/t

[Recursion]

60. Are you suggesting they wouldn't support Clinton if she won?

I have trouble believing that.

[Yael]

36. They were supposed to be partisan neutral and stand on issues

Thats why I quit.

I told them I didn't care which of the two candidates won, I will vote Edwards in my primary and the nominee in November.

When I saw that they took the leap into partisanship, I left.

[bread_and_roses]

24. MoveOn is a PAC. PACs endorse.

The Democrats want it both ways - they are quite happy with our two-Party oligarchy but don't want anyone else to influence "their" Primaries - where most of the real choices are. By all means, disassociate from a PAC that is not supporting your candidate - but all these cries about the act itself make no sense.

[Yael]

39. They have never endorsed in a primary before

Much less this late in the game when the field is whittled to 2.

What of the Kucinich supporters who support the party but are not backing Obama?

Moveon was about party, not partisanship. Until now.

[bread_and_roses]

55. I didn't realize that MO was an arm of the Democratic Party....

....I imagine that might be a surprise as well to other non-Democratic Party-registered members. And MO did not endorse in 04 because no candidate reached their threshhold. For issue-driven organizations, which Democrat matters. I have no quarell with anyone disassociating because Obama is not their choice - but railing at them for doing what they have both a right and a reason to do seems to me to miss the point. Additionally, some here do not seem to understand the difference between its PAC and "Civic Action" branches. One can contribute to "Civic Action" without contributing to the PAC.

[Mass]

77. They endorsed Lamont vs Lieberman. and they were damned right.

If your point is that they endorsed in the primary, would you have had the same view if Edwards was still there and had been endorsed? Not that sure.

And they had an endorsement context in 04. They just did not get over the threshold they had fixed to endorse (50 %). This year, the threshold was higher (66 %) and Obama won.

http://www.commondreams.org/news2006/0526-12.htm

http://www.thenation.com/doc/20080211/melber

[robbedvoter]

41. Against GOP. Not dems.

[Triana]

51. Damn good point!

What they've essentially done is cause further division WITHIN the Dem party.

AS IF we needed more of THAT.

Had they waited and endorsed THE Democratic nominee then it would have been less disingenuous and divisive.

[juajen]

90. What's really maddening, is that any money any of us

donated up to now, will go to support Obama, when we did not mean for it to go to support someone we oppose, or even someone we support. I always thought it supported the democratic party, not an individual. Perhaps they should start refunding money that was not donated to Obama.

I got an email from them asking me not to go. Of course, I did not change my mind. Funny thing, the email wouldn't let me reply. Stupid. I never had any trouble replying before.

[Triana]

49. "my" candidate?

I DON'T HAVE A CANDIDATE.

Jeeeze.

The one I HAD dropped out and now I support - NO ONE.

[Saturday]

25. I agree with you Triana.

And the reason is....what happens if Hillary wins the primary and not Obama? How can they possibly make a turn and then support Hillary? It's ludicrous.

[Triana]

38. Good point...what would they do then?

And how much credibility would their support have when it changes with the wind during / after a storm of primaries. It would have behooved them to FIRST find out which way the wind is blowing - waited until AFTER the primary storm to see who the nominee IS before endorsing or supporting anyone.

Their actions now are disingenuous because THE DEMOCRATIC PEOPLE OF THIS COUNTRY AT LARGE have NOT chosen their nominee yet. For MoveOn to preliminarily choose to support/endorse one over the other just because that's the way THEIR members voted (their members are HARDLY the voice of all the Democrats in the country) cheapens the endorsement, and narrows considerably the function of their organization from a proponent of progressive ideas on the issues - to a proponent of one candidate over any other before EVERYONE ELSE has chosen.

:wtf:

It's a disappointment.

[Tom Strong]

26. MoveOn just fucked themselves in the butt. n/t

[Evergreen Emerald]

30. I quit after they e-mailed me their support for Obama letter

and I donated more money to Clinton.

[Triana]

46. That's what did it for me. An email I just got from them..

..RE: Obama.

Nothing against Obama but Jeeesus H. Friggin KEEEEEERIST! How many organizations or whoever or whatever do I need sending emails and junkmail begging me to support - whoever.

They just jumped into the pile of all the others. And in doing so - put themselves OUT of my INbox.

Like I said, I thought they were a different type of org than that. But, I guess not.

I liked Edwards but you know, I'd have had the same concerns had they decided to endorse him at this point. I'd have thought the same thing: :wtf:

And I'd have continued to contribute to JRE from his website not through or BECAUSE of MoveOn's begging me to do so.

[Tom Rinaldo]

53. I haven't gotten that letter yet

I wonder if it is because I sent them negative feedback on their decision to make an endorsement, or if it because I voted for Hillary in their vote (I did that because I knew she would never get 66% and the only way to stop Move On from endorseing was by voting for Clinton).

I sure as Hell hope they are not selectively sending out that letter to those members who supported Obama only, or avoiding members who complained.

[awaysidetraveler]

78. So you're pro-war, right?

[cobalt1999]

33. A dumb move by them.

What is their vision of their organization going forward?

What if Clinton wins?

Even if she doesn't, they've marginalized themselves.

Someone wasn't thinking ahead very far.

[robbedvoter]

35. I wish I saved mine - but yours is more articulate anyway. There wasn't a vote.

They had a vote in 2004 - and no candidate broke 50%. Which is why they now created a ...ROVING sample. 10%

[LibraLiz1973]

40. I agree. No matter the candidate, they should not endorse.

[Triana]

47. They should have at least waited to see who our nominee is and THEN...

...encouraged us to support that person based on any specific progressive policies the nominee promotes.

[Desertrose]

48. I also unsubscribed.

I agree with your post.

I think they made a big mistake and will be less useful because of it.

[Yurovsky]

56. What's wrong, Obama too "uppity" for you???

that seems to be a recurrent them amongst the Obama-bashers.

Look, I was Dennis Kucinich supporter from day 1, but now that the choice is between a Democrat (Obama) and ChimpyLite (Hillary), you've got to expect that progressive organizations will support Obama.

Seriously, if Hillary wins the nomination, it won't matter who wins in November, because we'll get more of the same Cowboy diplomacy that's killed millions of innocent people the world over the past 7 years. Hillary herself probably wants to ride on a tank into Tehran.

[SaveOurDemocracy]

62. You expect anyone to take you seriously with

a bullshit post like this?

[Triana]

64. ...

:thumbsup:

[Bluebear]

70. Yes, Obama is much too uppity for us.

Idiot.

[mondo joe]

73. *click*

Ah, peace...

[intaglio]

57. So did Liebermann n/t

[Radical Activist]

58. Did you feel that way in '03 when MoveOn held an endorsement vote?

That was an attempt to help Dean but Kucinich kept it from happening.

[SaveOurDemocracy]

63. I also unsubscribed ... similar motivations, and similar

comments left describing why I disagreed with them taking a partisan position in the primary process.

[backscatter712]

65. Your loss...

MoveOn's an explicitly political organization. Why shouldn't they "take sides"? Of course, they're always going to take the Democratic side in our elections, but they're also going to make a decision as to which candidate its members feel will do the best job getting elected and promoting progressive ideals.

Even if I was a Clinton supporter rather than an Obama supporter, why is it not within MoveOn.org's right to endorse a candidate?

[Triana]

68. YOUR opinion (n/t)

[flyarm]

67. i gave them alot of money and i did public speaking for them from time to time..i just signed off

as well..i don't believe they should be endorsing one candidate over the other..and where the hell were they when we in Fla and ohio begged for them to pay attention to the vote stealing by the voting machines..i do recall writing them more letters than i care to think about to get support where we needed it..now they are interfering with our electorial process...it stinks to high heaven..

oh and i am an Edwards supporter and don't like either of the other two..so that is not the reason for my signing off on them,.i just do not believe it is right..they have my money doing what they do...and i don't like it one bit.

fly

oh and p.s. i got the voting form and did not fill it out because i can't stand the two left standing..i believe some shananigans went on to force Edwards out..

[Triana]

69. I rememember that!!

And I remember sending them letters! They did zilch. Totally silent on the matter I think.

And you are darned right - some (namely corprat) shenanigans went into forcing Edwards and Kuchinich out.

"we the people" had little say. And they try to call this a "democracy"

Not anymore it isn't.

[Captain_Nemo]

71. I signed off too! Eli is an egoist....he had to have known the majority of the moveoners would be o

[ErnestoG]

74. Who will next be the target of the Hillars' outrage?

Hostess Twinkies? Megaplex Theatres? Stay tuned!

[BenDavid]

75. From my point of view there are many semi bigots that are

supporting Obama. These so called semi-bigots say, "Obama's one of the good ones - you don't see him running to Louisiana to help The Jena Six, you don't see him commenting on the Duke rape case. Obama stays out of all that race nonsense, which means he's got my vote." From the semi-bigot's point of view, is Obama "one of the good ones?"


Does Obama avoid taking positions on black issues to preserve his political viability?


I know, I know, call me racist for asking the question.( first time someone did on du was nov.2007)

[awaysidetraveler]

79. So you're cool with this Iraq war thing, and so you're down with Hillary.

[Triana]

80. LEARN TO READ will ya?

MY CANDIDATE dropped out. Remember that?

I'm not "down" with Hillary or Obama.

I don't think MoveOn should have endorsed ANYONE at this point - even if it had been Edwards.

[Eric J in MN]

83. Regarding the legal question

MoveOn is actually two organizations: MoveOn Civic Action, which can accept unlimited donations, and MoveOn Political Action, a PAC, which can accept limited donations up to $5,000.

The endorsement is from MoveOn Political Action.

[Triana]

84. Nonetheless, it's a turnoff and unconstructive

For those who wonder I VOTED FOR FUCKING OBAMA their smarmy little poll.

AND IT STILL pisses me off that they decided to shill for him (or ANYONE at this point).

Not that I like Obama much better than Hillary - BOTH of them turn me off to no end - but he's the lesser of the two evils.

And my opinion on that - because I'm VERY undecided as yet - changes almost daily, so I'll hear no crap on it from either camp.

I DON'T KNOW whether I'll actually vote for either of them in the GE. Still very much undecided.

[WCGreen]

85. They can't endorse a particular candidate if they are a non-profit

advocate organization...

If they have a PAC set up and registered, then thay can...

[Freida5]

86. If this is a membership organization. How do we impeach the Board and President of Move ON

[mondo joe]

87. You don't. The board manages itself. NT

[ErnestoG]

88. Work on impeaching Bush and Cheney first.

I submit that you have let your priorities get skewed.

[zulchzulu]

89. This throwing out the baby with the bath water message is brought to you by...

Bitter tasting with a little envy on the side...