Hispanics in NYC choose Dinkins over Giuliani (twice)--memo to the hispanics-are-racist crowd

[antiimperialist]

There is a thread going around trying to incite racial tensions between Hispanics and blacks. A Hillary pollster is cited pushing the theory.

Let's take a period in which racial tensions in NYC were high. The 90's, and the battles between Giuliani and African American mayor Dinkins:

Election (hispanic vote)

1989: Dinkins 73% Giuliani 26%
1993: Dinkins 60%, Giuliani 38%

DU'ers from other states are invited to post their data as well.

http://www.gothamgazette.com/article/voting/20030328/17/331

[MadBadger]

1. Well this isnt a General Election where its a Republican vs. a Democrat

These are just two dems. So your example doesnt work.

[denem]

4. Giuliani was a Republican by 1989.

[antiimperialist]

2. Please explain how it would be different n/t

[TwilightZone]

3. Are you saying that racial tensions between Hispanics and blacks simply don't exist?

Racial tensions exist between *all* major ethnic groups, particularly in the United States, but certainly in other countries, as well. I doubt that you're going to find much disagreement on that.

[antiimperialist]

5. The point is that Hispanics won't stay home because Obama is the candidate. No evidence of that n/t

[TwilightZone]

10. Your OP doesn't even make that connection...

so I'm not sure how it relates. Where was that asserted?

[DemocratSinceBirth]

6. The Point It Seems You're Making Is That Party Trumps Ethnicity

But how is it relative if both candidates are of the same party ?

[antiimperialist]

11. My point is that issues trump ethnicity.

Dinkins was a better candidate for low-income people. Hispanics in NYC are poor, much llke blacks. They have a lot in common when it comes to concernts about health care, income distribution, etc.

Whether Obama or Hillary are their preferred choice remains to be seen.

Many are assuming that Hillary will overwhelmingly beat Obama among Hispanics, but we would have to compare Hispanic vote vs. the white vote and the black vote to draw a conclusion. It would be unfair to expect an identical support for Obama by Hispanics compared to blacks. But it would be fair to expect Hispanics to support Obama to a greater extent than whites do. If we find at the end that Hispanics were even more supportive of Clinton than whites, then it would probably be likely that racism was present.

[Adelante]

7. Here is the "Hillary pollster" referred to in the OP

Racial politics have been refreshingly absent from this campaign, partly because of the lack of diversity in the first two states and partly because Obama has never made his race central to his campaign. That’s about to change, as Nevada, with its large Hispanic population, and South Carolina, with its large black population, prepare to vote. Obama has an interest in downplaying his race in both states. There are lingering tensions between the Hispanic and black communities which he doesn’t want to inflame, and some residual skepticism among black voters concerning Obama’s electability among whites. Interestingly, in the final days of the New Hampshire campaign, when defeat looked certain for Clinton, it was Hillary’s aides who started talking privately about racial politics. They argued that on February 5th, when twenty-two states vote, Hillary’s fire wall would be Hispanic voters in the largest states, such as California and New York.

On the morning after Clinton’s victory, I talked to Sergio Bendixen, one of her pollsters, who specializes in the Hispanic vote. “In all honesty, the Hispanic vote is extremely important to the Clinton campaign, and the polls have shown—and today is not a great day to cite polls—that even though she was slipping with women in Iowa and blacks in South Carolina, she was not slipping with Hispanics,” he said. “The fire wall doesn’t apply now, because she is in good shape, but before last night the Hispanic vote was going to be the most important part of her fire wall on February 5th.” The implications of that strategy are not necessarily uplifting.

When I asked Bendixen about the source of Clinton’s strength in the Hispanic community, he mentioned her support for health care, and Hispanic voters’ affinity for the Clinton era. “It’s one group where going back to the past really works,” he said. “All you need to say in focus groups is ‘Let’s go back to the nineties.’ ” But he was also frank about the fact that the Clintons, long beloved in the black community, are now dependent on a less edifying political dynamic: “The Hispanic voter—and I want to say this very carefully—has not shown a lot of willingness or affinity to support black candidates.”

http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2008/01/21/080121fa_fact_lizza?currentPage=3

[Essene]

8. NYC politics isnt the norm

The black & hispinic caucus is very tight and politics in NYC are very tribal, often more borough based than broadly ethnic or even partisan.

Hispanics in NYC are predominantly puerto rican and dominican.

The tensions and history isnt always applicable nationally, although i do think folks are overplaying this point. Folks say whites wouldnt vote for Obama, too. That's obviously not true.

We don't need pundits out there saying non-sense like this without some fact to it.



So... until hispanic leaders are speaking against Obama or Clinton, i wouldnt make much of this.

I'd just listen.

[Essene]

9. PS... the relevant issue is the NYC 2001 Mayoral race - Ferrer vs Green

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4023969

What happened here in the mayoral race in 2001 is what folks should be concerned about.